Feeding new baby monitor

[Pyrate81]

I didn't mean to start all this drama, we are using the forty gallon tank until we build the permanent enclosure. I breed balls and am well aware that different species require specific habitats to thrive. That's why I ask questions here to get advice along with my own research this tank I had is set up to provide proper temporary conditions. I have a topsoil sand mixture deep enough for the monitor to burrow should he desire, also I provided enough rocks and wood pieces for him to have plenty of hiding places. My temps are 130 in the hot bask I g area and he is doing well eating when ever offered shared crickets and Dubai's from our colony. He is fed now with tongs or from the dish we have provided. We found the monitor at a repticon show and hadn't planned on the purchase. My son is fifteen and helps my care for our ten snakes and twelve tub rat rack that we breed feeders for our snakes in. I made a comment and asked for some tips and didn't expect to be jumped by fellow herpers and called irresponsible reptile owners. You remind me of the tree huggers in another forum who dogged me for feeding live rats to my balls. You know self rightious beepers like you ruin these forums by acting like everyone is irresponsible for not doing things just as you do, even criticising zoologists. Are you a herpetologist or veterinarian or even a biologist, I'm just curious what are your credentials that make you think you can berate everyone who doesn't believe as you do.

Very well said. :Applause:

[Dehlol]

I didn't mean to start all this drama, we are using the forty gallon tank until we build the permanent enclosure. I breed balls and am well aware that different species require specific habitats to thrive. That's why I ask questions here to get advice along with my own research this tank I had is set up to provide proper temporary conditions. I have a topsoil sand mixture deep enough for the monitor to burrow should he desire, also I provided enough rocks and wood pieces for him to have plenty of hiding places. My temps are 130 in the hot bask I g area and he is doing well eating when ever offered shared crickets and Dubai's from our colony. He is fed now with tongs or from the dish we have provided. We found the monitor at a repticon show and hadn't planned on the purchase. My son is fifteen and helps my care for our ten snakes and twelve tub rat rack that we breed feeders for our snakes in. I made a comment and asked for some tips and didn't expect to be jumped by fellow herpers and called irresponsible reptile owners. You remind me of the tree huggers in another forum who dogged me for feeding live rats to my balls. You know self rightious beepers like you ruin these forums by acting like everyone is irresponsible for not doing things just as you do, even criticising zoologists. Are you a herpetologist or veterinarian or even a biologist, I'm just curious what are your credentials that make you think you can berate everyone who doesn't believe as you do.

1.1 pastels, 1.0 lesser, 0.1 het blurry, 0.1 spider, 1.1 norm. 0.1 dinker,

I'm not a herpetologist. I'm not a veterinarian. I'm not a biologist. Guess what. Private keepers have produced more healthy offspring than all zoological institutions combined, and then some. Private keepers (real keepers) have healthier monitors than zoos. It doesn't take rocket science to walk into a Komodo exhibit with no dirt and know something is beyond wrong.

I act this way toward anyone who buys a new animal without any proper research. Some species can handle it better than others- take for instance corn snakes and ball pythons. Sterlite bins, heat pads, paper towels, and a water dish. Not overly complex animals to keep, something a 4 year old could probably manage. Monitors are a different story.

Adam- I'll have to dig through my old laptop HD for most of my pictures, and I'll try and snap some pics of my 2 current monitors as well. I've raised several species but currently only own a pair of niloticus. The female is around 5', the male is around 6'. Growing the female up to hopefully produce next season- just because no one ever works with this species in captivity, and I'm hoping captive bred offspring will turn out to be decent pets a few generations down the line....

[I-KandyReptiles]

I think the majority of the posters in here are angry that you would buy such an advanced animal without doing any research.

It's pretty irresponsible. I can understand why some are getting testy.

[Capray]

How much of all this work that you are doing to try and help the monitor is your son actively involved in?

[John1982]

I'm not a herpetologist. I'm not a veterinarian. I'm not a biologist. Guess what. Private keepers have produced more healthy offspring than all zoological institutions combined, and then some. Private keepers (real keepers) have healthier monitors than zoos. It doesn't take rocket science to walk into a Komodo exhibit with no dirt and know something is beyond wrong.

This is not such an amazing feat when you consider the purpose of zoos and the always increasing number of herp enthusiasts. I reckon it'd be pretty hard to attract folks to view wildlife with half the enclosures seemingly devoid of said life. Don't get me wrong here, I'd love visiting a place with right proper exhibits, and enjoy viewing habitats nearly as much as the animals themselves - I just don't see such changes happening for these "ambassador species" anytime soon.

I act this way toward anyone who buys a new animal without any proper research. Some species can handle it better than others- take for instance corn snakes and ball pythons. Sterlite bins, heat pads, paper towels, and a water dish. Not overly complex animals to keep, something a 4 year old could probably manage. Monitors are a different story.

I'm thinking the holier than thou attitude is getting tiresome. Just because something requires a larger living space to thrive doesn't make it rocket science. I don't need a degree in knowitall to build a box, throw some dirt in, attach my heat lamps with thermostat then toy with ventilation a bit - reckon a 7 year old could pull that one off. I'm personally not so opposed to impulse buys but understand how it might tick off monitor enthusiasts especially. These animals require more money(food, electricity, food, building materials, food) and time(feeding, cleaning poop, feeding, cleaning poopy water, feeding, getting pooped on, feeding) than most impulse buyers are willing or even capable of providing.

I don't believe a ball python or corn snake is hardier than a monitor per se. Seems to me this is more a case of the average house temperature being closer to their naturally preferred gradients giving this illusion. If I kept my house a constant 40 degrees I don't suppose either would thrive for long without their own accommodations. When you compare the natural gradient of a diurnal african lizard with that of a nocturnal african snake you might understand why one seems more hardy if neither were given adequate care in the typical human's house.

Adam- I'll have to dig through my old laptop HD for most of my pictures, and I'll try and snap some pics of my 2 current monitors as well. I've raised several species but currently only own a pair of niloticus. The female is around 5', the male is around 6'. Growing the female up to hopefully produce next season- just because no one ever works with this species in captivity, and I'm hoping captive bred offspring will turn out to be decent pets a few generations down the line....

I know these are for Adam but I'm looking forward to the pictures. I always enjoy seeing large setups and, most important, their thriving inhabitants. I also appreciate you sharing your advice and expertise, if not the way you give it.

[AdamL8]

I didn't mean to start all this drama, we are using the forty gallon tank until we build the permanent enclosure. I breed balls and am well aware that different species require specific habitats to thrive. That's why I ask questions here to get advice along with my own research this tank I had is set up to provide proper temporary conditions. I have a topsoil sand mixture deep enough for the monitor to burrow should he desire, also I provided enough rocks and wood pieces for him to have plenty of hiding places. My temps are 130 in the hot bask I g area and he is doing well eating when ever offered shared crickets and Dubai's from our colony. He is fed now with tongs or from the dish we have provided. We found the monitor at a repticon show and hadn't planned on the purchase. My son is fifteen and helps my care for our ten snakes and twelve tub rat rack that we breed feeders for our snakes in. I made a comment and asked for some tips and didn't expect to be jumped by fellow herpers and called irresponsible reptile owners. You remind me of the tree huggers in another forum who dogged me for feeding live rats to my balls. You know self rightious beepers like you ruin these forums by acting like everyone is irresponsible for not doing things just as you do, even criticising zoologists. Are you a herpetologist or veterinarian or even a biologist, I'm just curious what are your credentials that make you think you can berate everyone who doesn't believe as you do.

Only a minor bit of the recent tirades were actually about your monitor specifically. Most of it was just back and forth debating that accidentally took over your thread. Sorry about that.

I'm thinking the holier than thou attitude is getting tiresome. Just because something requires a larger living space to thrive doesn't make it rocket science. I don't need a degree in knowitall to build a box, throw some dirt in, attach my heat lamps with thermostat then toy with ventilation a bit - reckon a 7 year old could pull that one off. I'm personally not so opposed to impulse buys but understand how it might tick off monitor enthusiasts especially. These animals require more money(food, electricity, food, building materials, food) and time(feeding, cleaning poop, feeding, cleaning poopy water, feeding, getting pooped on, feeding) than most impulse buyers are willing or even capable of providing.

Just because it's easy to do something doesn't mean people are willing to do it which is quite often the case. I'm highly against impulse buys because when it happens the people usually have no idea how to care for a monitor or understand the size that they will get. The few who decide to look up the true care requirements for monitors generally write them off as being ridiculous and ignore them entirely causing the monitor to die in a year or two. The majority of the blame for impulse monitor buying lays with the sellers who boast them as simple to care for and leave out all of the vital information to make a sale.

I liked the part about all the food because of how accurate it is.

I don't believe a ball python or corn snake is hardier than a monitor per se. Seems to me this is more a case of the average house temperature being closer to their naturally preferred gradients giving this illusion. If I kept my house a constant 40 degrees I don't suppose either would thrive for long without their own accommodations. When you compare the natural gradient of a diurnal african lizard with that of a nocturnal african snake you might understand why one seems more hardy if neither were given adequate care in the typical human's house.

I think that Ball Pythons and Corn Snakes are easier for the general public to deal with and they are so mainstream that everybody and their brother knows how to care for one. They don't need much more than interaction once a week to feed, change the water, and change the substrate. Monitors are simple too but their requirements are usually too much for the average person.

[ironpython]

How much of all this work that you are doing to try and help the monitor is your son actively involved in?

Every bit he shows me what he is doing. He has been researching and tell g what he finds. He built a breeding box for crickets which consists of a ten g aquarium with egg cartons and a small Rubbermaid container with a portion of the lid cut out and filled with dirt with a screen over it for egg laying. Also a dubia colony with flex watt heat and a super worm colony and meal worm colony. He pays for everything with his own money from cutting grass. He has been researching on the intranet and utube getting ideas from someone who calls himself snake freak. His monitor has grown twice its original size eating like crazy. He just now fed it two mouse pinks, with tongs it swallowed them whole.

1.1 pastels, 1.0 lesser, 0.1 het blurry, 0.1 spider, 1.1 norm. 0.1 dinker,

[ironpython]

Feeding is not an issue I breed rats for my balls and have way more than I need.

1.1 pastels, 1.0 lesser, 0.1 het blurry, 0.1 spider, 1.1 norm. 0.1 dinker,

[ironpython]

We are well aware of the size this animal will attain and of the husbandry requirements involved. I have a 12x 20 shed coming and he will have one end of it in a 4x4x8 enclosure with a doggie door going to a fenced dog kennel should he want to go outside. We live in south coastal Ga. with a long summer and high humidity. Maybe you should do more research yourself before you pass judgement on someone you know nothing about. His new home will be finished well before he out grows his temporary home.

1.1 pastels, 1.0 lesser, 0.1 het blurry, 0.1 spider, 1.1 norm. 0.1 dinker,