ball python babies from live to f/t

[firedragon]

Hi, I'm new here, just found this helpful site. I am also new to ballpythons, although I've been doing a lot of research before acquiring one.

Last week I got a bunch of babies, captive born, in Sweden, I imported them to Finland where I live (neighbour country, Scandinavia). I got 8.8 babies, of which I have 5.4 left. 9 babies that is. They're very young, around one month old. I keep them in rubbermaids, 2-4 gallons. There are three males in a 4-gallon rubbermaid, two females in another, two males in a 2-gallon rubbermaid and two females in a 2-gallon... So, four rubbermaids, 9 snakes. I intend to separate them as soon as possible.

My actual questions concern eating. They have been fed live small mice and the breeder suggest I continue this. I stronly oppose live feeding though, and was wondering if it's common practice to start off ball juveniles with live prey? The breeder claims only about 10% of ball python hatchlings accept F/T or pre-killed. Is this true? I'd like to switch the babies to F/T as soon as possible and I'm asking for advice on how to do so. The breeder also told me to offer them prey every or every other day, right away, I've had them for just a couple of days, to see if they eat. Won't this stress them even more? They made quite a long trip, and have been handled and bothered since their arrival (people who pre-ordered have been coming to choose and get their own), so my common sense tells me to let them be on their own for a week at least before offering food? They seem hungry, they've been zooming around the tanks actively, and some of them also seemed to have settled down, found nice hides etc. So I tried to give a small F/T mouse to a male who'd been snipping at me (I figured he should have an appetite, if anyone... he's btw the only one to show aggressive signs). I left him alone with the mouse in a small box with a hide, in a dark wardrobe, but he didn't take it. I reheated it and put another male into the box with the mouse and slept over the night (only three hours, though). Nothing had happened to the mouse. I even broke it's skull a little, to increase the smell. The apartment was pitch black and calm. I figure it's just too soon, or the snake just didn't recognize the limp thing as something edible?

What I'd like to do is wait for a week, possibly separate the babies, then offer them food in their own enclosures at night. What do you think?

When I purchased the babies I didn't know I'd have to go through this, since I assumed that they eat dead prey. It's a bit stressful...

P.S. sorry for the long post... I'm thankful for any help and advice you guys can offer me.

[Marla]

Your instincts are very good, and I'm glad to hear that. You are right on target about switching to f/t, not trying to soon or too often to avoid stressing them, and separating them as soon as you can. Often it takes a little work to switch over to f/t and what works for many of us to begin with is to thaw the mouse to normal body temp (same as humans) or just a bit above, then "dance" it with tongs or hemostats gripping the back of the mouse, and if/when it strikes, tug back just a little bit to simulate resistance. Often after enough feedings this way, the snakes will readily eat a warmed mouse dropped in front of their current hide inside the enclosure (not if using loose substrate, though).

Congrats on your snakes (how many will you be keeping?), and you are welcome to come back and ask as many questions as you think of.

[firedragon]

Thanks. I'll try feeding them when I've separated them, which should be happening as soon as I can get more rubbermaids... Do you think I should go with the 4-gallons for each snake? They're still very small as mentioned, and I won't be keeping most of them for that long, just until they start eating, so would a 2-gallon suffice? I figure they feel safer in a smaller box... How long should I wait after I transfer them? They haven't eaten for 10 days now.

And I have a "stupid foreigner" question... Hmm... What are those human heating pads that everyone here seems to use? Like, what's their real purpose and what do they look like? I've been using heating mats for reptiles, they're so expensive and overheat (although I've managed to regulate the temp by adjusting the space between the tank and the mat, so nothing bad has ever happened).

I plan to keep just one female ball, although I've got some really pretty and tough males... But right now I just don't have the space for them when they grow up.

[JamminJonah]

Welcome to the site! Good to see you around the forums! Marla is right on (per usual )

[Marla]

For month-old ball pythons, I think 2 gallon containers would be all right, but they would outgrow those quickly, so it depends on how soon the others will be going to new homes. If you can't predict that, it would be better to go for somewhat larger enclosures just to be on the safe side. Also, how soon after transferring them before you feed depends on a few things, but if you were to move them today, you could give them just a couple of days to settle in to being alone and try feeding again (I'd say a minimum of 48 hours, but you don't want to wait too long since they've probably only ever eaten once).

Your "stupid foreigner" question isn't stupid at all. Maybe they're less common in Finland, or called by a different name. This page: http://www.drugstore.com/templates/s...sp?catid=28346 shows a bunch of human heating pad, but the type we're referring to is the type that plug into a power outlet (not the microwaveable, etc.) and that do not have auto-shutoff. Beyond that, you have a lot of options and a wide price range. If you can't buy them locally, I'm sure there are some web sites where you could order them already configured with the right wiring plug and voltage.

Enjoy your female (did you pick her out first thing? ) and be sure to upload a photo or two when you get a chance.

[firedragon]

I compromised and got both 2- and 4-gallons, since some of the babies are really small whereas other fit better in the bigger ones. Separated them yesterday, I'm anxious to start feeding them, they look so thin... The breeder said they've eaten 2-3 times, but some of them are so small I can't believe... Well. Hopefully they'll start eating soon, if not f/t at least live.

I found one heating pad like that, in a health store (in Wal martesque store I only found something meant for car seats), but it was really expensive (40 bucks or so), so I ended up just buying another reptile heating mat. I should probably get a thermostat... at one point the heat was 102F, I immediately increased the space between the mat and the enclosure. Luckily, the snake wasn't using it's warm hide at that point. By the way, what would you say is fatally hot (will lead to burns)?

Yeah, I picked out a fat and curious cute girl for myself Hope she starts eating.

Thanks for your help!

[Marla]

Sounds like you're in good shape. That's unfortunate about the heating pads being so expensive. Surely Europeans get backaches just as much as Americans do? I can't tell you an exact temperature that will lead to burns, but I can say that at about 120F (sorry, I'm American) burns are a definite possibility, though they may happen at lower temps than that. I've had one snake get burned, and he was a determined burrower who lay on top of a heating pad at ~120F for hours before I got home and caught him. Enjoy your snake, and maybe next time you should import heating pads, too, and sell complete snake + setup kits.

[daftperception]

Are bps rare in Finland just asking because you said you imported from sweden.

[steelsack]

Welcome to the site! So you're in Finland........I happen to be finnish! How's the old country?

[firedragon]

daftperception: Yes they are, captive bred are almost impossible to find (very sporadical chances). Pet stores have them from time to time, but they are almost without exception wild caught and incredibly expensive (around 250 euros). Maybe in a couple of years we'll have succeeded in breeding them too... The herp scene over here is rather small, as you might guess.

steelsack: REALLY, huh, that's funny Well, it's ok I guess, high unemployment rates and problems with alcoholism, but when hasn't it been like that... And a jerk as the Prime Minister... And the wrong party in the Parliament... But otherwise, it's ok ^____^