!!!!And here they are!!!!

[Dark Lady Kat]

I'm not saying you shouldn't breed them. I'm saying if you do, you shouldn't label them as a guess. Let the buyer know that there is no paper work, that they could be crossed, etc.

I think it becomes a problem when people dont pass this info along.

Say a kid goes to show and picks up a BCI labeled as a Red Tail Boa. 5 years from now he gets into breeding without doing a ton of reserch. He picks up a BCC thinking he wants to breed Red Tails. Crosses it with the BCI, say the litter comes out looking more like true BCCs. Now he has his own booth selling a cross as a true form. Then the cycle starts all over.
If no one keeps the bloodlines pure, then we might lose them forever one day.

Remember I said I have a couple of pairs going now. I don't have full history or papers. I will not be selling them as a pure line of anything. It would be a guess at best.


I think the bigger breeders of locality Boas have paper work going back to were the snake was caught in the wild.

There are the purest out there.

Thank you and I agree I wouldn't use the guesses here for breeding info they are just barely reaching the year old mark and breeding is still a ways away from breeding I will only use the info from their papers when and if I do breed them. I can see more clearly what you are saying getting the guesses now is just going to help me do some of my own research until I do get their papers once my friend unpacks them. Since I have been out of the snake world for so long and never got into breeding when I owned snakes before I am very new to the whole locality thing and am finding it very interesting.

Now would you breed different localities of the same major type ie... bcc, bci, bca but different localities of the major archtype sumarian and guanya like I said just curious obviously morphs come from crossing things that would not have naturally occurred otherwise

[Evenstar]

Now would you breed different localities of the same major type ie... bcc, bci, bca but different localities of the major archtype sumarian and guanya like I said just curious obviously morphs come from crossing things that would not have naturally occurred otherwise

I think you may have missed my last 2 posts. Take another look. That should help answer your question here and also shed some light on locality vs sub-species.....

[Dark Lady Kat]

And for further research, here is a breakdown of boa localities and sub-species as well as the ventral scale counts.
Here are the scale counts for you.

BCC
scale counts - 75 to 95 dorsal rows.
227 to 250 ventrals.
49 to 62 subcaudals.
Average 15 to 21 saddles.

BCI
scale counts - 56 to 79 dorsal rows.
225 to 253 ventrals.
47 to 65 subcaudals.
Average 22 to 30 saddles.

BCA ( Amaral Boa)
scale counts - 71 to 79 dorsal rows.
226 to 237 ventrals.
43 to 52 subcaudals.
Average 22 saddles.

BCL (Longicauada)
scale counts - 60 to 76 dorsal rows.
243 to 247 ventrals.
50 to 67 subcaudals.
Average 19 to 21 saddles.

BCO (Occidentalis)
scale counts - 65 to 87 dorsal rows.
242 to 251 ventrals.
45 subcaudals.
Average 22 to 30 saddles.

Hopefully, all of these links and info will help those doing research, or the keeper who is just looking for some additional resources and info...

-Vypyrz-

Can you or one of the other describe to me how the scales are counted and thank you very much with so much info floating on the web it is easy for a novice in trying to determine locality and sub species to get very confused with the good and bad information. Which is why I ask so many questions as many of you here are more experienced and can better determine if the information on a site is reliable or not.

I will also have to look into with in the next year or two getting an albino BCI I would love to prove out the albino gene as albino boa and pythons are one of my favorites it is just something about them that is mystifying to me. I will also be sure to post when my friend gets me the papers and info on all three as to what they say.

Now another question and I am sorry if I am asking to many but if I do decide to breed them I want to be able to provide the most accurate information to the buyer of the babies.
What should I look for in the papers he has on them to determine authenticity I guess would be the best word choice? And Would me contacting the original seller of them to ask questions be considered bad rapport?

Thank you all for being so patient and informative.

[3skulls]

Yeah see what the papers say. I would track back as far as I could. I don't think any breeder would mind passing along any info they might have.

Me personally, and this is just my opinion, would not cross a BCC with a BCI. If you want to do morphs stick with the BCIs. If the other 2 come back as pure, I would keep them that way.

I want a pair of Surinames really bad.

I'm not saying it shouldn't be done. I think there is room in this hobby for everyone. The purist, the person crossing GTPs with Carpets, Burmballs, the person that only has a love for normal BPs. I just think it's very important for all breeders to keep the best records they can and pass it along with the sell, no matter what it is.

Now if we were talking about Tarantulas, you would be tracked down and shot if you crossed them :p

[Dark Lady Kat]

Yeah see what the papers say. I would track back as far as I could. I don't think any breeder would mind passing along any info they might have.

Me personally, and this is just my opinion, would not cross a BCC with a BCI. If you want to do morphs stick with the BCIs. If the other 2 come back as pure, I would keep them that way.

I want a pair of Surinames really bad.

I'm not saying it shouldn't be done. I think there is room in this hobby for everyone. The purist, the person crossing GTPs with Carpets, Burmballs, the person that only has a love for normal BPs. I just think it's very important for all breeders to keep the best records they can and pass it along with the sell, no matter what it is.

Now if we were talking about Tarantulas, you would be tracked down and shot if you crossed them :p

Yes I know I have a friend of my husband and I that raises tarantulas and she is very passionate about the fact that tarantula raising is only for the purist.

As I look over the information provided by eve it is more likely they (1 and 3) are BCC than BCA their tails are not short enough considering the information provided. But it is still possible of course that they are crosses as cross breeding on BCC and BCA seems to be popular.

[Balls&burms_DEA]

I asked my buddies on redtailboa.net. Short responses so far.
But everyone is on the same page. There ameralis.

There tails are plety short enough. 3-5 saddles. Def BCA. Any consrictor
will have long brillent beautiful tails.

I have a Guyana at 3 years. Almost 5 feet. Slow grown
yearling Suriname and sunglow. Much bigger than yours. By like 40something inches bigger lol. All have 7-10 saddles just for there tail.
Las far as breeding. All I have to say. It's safe to say those are BCA.
No doubt.
I breed boas. I raise boa. I know boas.

And if that hypo is het albino. . It's possible to make sunglows with a mate holding the same genes. Well albino in this case.
Heres that link
http://www.redtailboa.net/forums/boa...as-please.html

[Dark Lady Kat]

I asked my buddies on redtailboa.net. Short responses so far.
But everyone is on the same page. There ameralis.

There tails are plety short enough. 3-5 saddles. Def BCA. Any consrictor
will have long brillent beautiful tails.

I have a Guyana at 3 years. Almost 5 feet. Slow grown
yearling Suriname and sunglow. Much bigger than yours. By like 40something inches bigger lol. All have 7-10 saddles just for there tail.
Las far as breeding. All I have to say. It's safe to say those are BCA.
No doubt.
I breed boas. I raise boa. I know boas.

And if that hypo is het albino. . It's possible to make sunglows with a mate holding the same genes. Well albino in this case.
Heres that link
http://www.redtailboa.net/forums/boa...as-please.html

LIke I said I will not rule out any option I got the impression from the information I had read that they werent short enough but as a Novice in identifying these things mistakes happen and thank you for clarifying it for me I will have to look into getting an albino male because I would love to prove out the het albino on the salmon one and I will have to get you guys some better pictures of her as well she is gorgeous and pinkish orange very little black and mostly a reddish brown as her darker color

[Balls&burms_DEA]

Vince Russo has the best information with localities and morphs.
Well IMO the best. Plus all my boas are from him.
I'm not tryin to come across as a snob. Or know it all. But I love Surinamese and I live Guyanas.My 2 fav lines of boas. Honestly love all true redtails. (Which array though BCC only). And were talkin the 3rd largest lines of boas. 2 being BCO and 1 being anacondas.

By all means there beautiful. I love Bolivians. Second fav locality. Because there thin saddles and smaller tail. And overall smaller size.
Meet keep posted on your sunglow project. See if I acually proves out. If not worst can happen is half hypos poss het for albino. Then you for sure have the ingredients lol

[3skulls]

I wanted to get a Surinam from Vin Russo or Rio Bravo, but could come up with the money this year.

[Balls&burms_DEA]

Vince is a good guy. I have a few of his snakes. Gus is a good online friend you could say. Those 2 are who I'd recommend to get any pure locality from. There lines are all originated from f1 lines straight from the wild.

Gus has the nicest brazilians and Peruvians iv ever seen. Also the largest Guyana iv ever seen. 14feet.
But. Vince has the leopards and type 2 anerys.
Those guys have some nice snakes lol.