Can I attatch my ZooMed Heat pad directly to tub?

[The Serpent Merchant]

Sounds good

Though I will add that the general consenious (not only on this site but others as well) is that no part of a BP's cage should get much over 95...

[suzuki4life]

Yeah but we are talking about physical burns. The whole proving at what temp neurological damage occurs is out of my reach to experiement and prove(or disprove). Since it(the temp) can't truly be proven or not, we will need to stay with physical harm.

My issue here is mostly about heat transfer. Conduction from one material to another.

At what temp (minimum, in your opinion) will boiling water cause physical burns to my skin? How fast will this occur?

I won't harm an animal with this experiment but I am willing to test upon my own flesh.

Are we in agreement that human flesh will burn at a lower or equal temp than snake flesh will?


So parameter one, heat pad as stated will be permitted to have full voltage for the period of 7 calendar days. At the end of that period, the max temp will be recorded.

[kitedemon]

Plastic holds a higher R value than glass.

This is absolutely hilarious. So you are claiming that your coffee will stay warmer longer in a 1mm thick plastic cup than a 6mm glass mug? TRY IT!! Gatorade bottle is about the same thickness of a tub make some coffee and pour it in a glass mug (about the same thickness as a 15gal tank) and in your gator aid bottle and see which cools quicker. Again it is not as easy as you suggest, equal thickness sure, but really, you have 6mm tubs???

[suzuki4life]

This is absolutely hilarious. So you are claiming that your coffee will stay warmer longer in a 1mm thick plastic cup than a 6mm glass mug? TRY IT!! Gatorade bottle is about the same thickness of a tub make some coffee and pour it in a glass mug (about the same thickness as a 15gal tank) and in your gator aid bottle and see which cools quicker. Again it is not as easy as you suggest, equal thickness sure, but really, you have 6mm tubs???

I said, plastic has a higher R value than glass.

and this results in your post

but in the end you agreed with me....you're a confusing person.

[kitedemon]

I would suggest that prolonged temps of over 100 to be unhealthy for the snake no burns no damage just no digestion. I my research has concluded that prolonged temps of over high 90s can exhibit digestion. So why don't you use the max generally accepted temp for royals in your test 94ºF

My fast test I just did is very simple, tub lid and my hand under it. I used a traceable platinum PRT meter with a fast response time. I measured in 3 min the plastic was 92.6ºF I dropped the tub and measured my hand and it was 94.5º That is only as close to two degrees different as makes no difference. The room temp and start temp for the lid was 72ºF. Measuring the bottom of the tub bare is the only safe way. and removable substrate can be moved so the hottest possible contact temp is what should be measured. I won't start in on the accuracy of pyrometers I'll leave that be.

Lets guess at a higher heat we experience a 4x change (very generous here likely 1.5 or 2x max...) so 8º difference and at 130º -8 122º unacceptably high. Maybe aerogel at 1mm could do what you are claiming.

[rebelrachel13]

At what temp (minimum, in your opinion) will boiling water cause physical burns to my skin? How fast will this occur?

I won't harm an animal with this experiment but I am willing to test upon my own flesh.

I don't know how we got from UTHs melting plastic/burning snakes to testing the effects of boiling water on human skin, but I'm laughing all the same. Not at you though, simply at the juxtaposition of the two events. Feel free to test it, but I'm not sure if your results will be conclusive...

suzuki- I would like to see how this experiment goes. That is to say, would you mind posting a thread with your hypothesis, your procedure, and the results as they play out? I actually still have a (functional) ZooMed heat pad attached to an empty glass 20gal downstairs, and if you don't mind me getting in on the project, I will record the unregulated temps it produces -- on both the outside and inside surface -- a few times a day for the next week. I will also let you know how hot to the touch it is. Heck, I've got free time!

[Slim]

suzuki4life, I've read your responses in this thread, but just to be clear, are you, or are you not recommending that an unregulated UTH should be used to heat a ball python's tub?

[suzuki4life]

I would suggest that prolonged temps of over 100 to be unhealthy for the snake no burns no damage just no digestion. I my research has concluded that prolonged temps of over high 90s can exhibit digestion. So why don't you use the max generally accepted temp for royals in your test 94ºF

My fast test I just did is very simple, tub lid and my hand under it. I used a traceable platinum PRT meter with a fast response time. I measured in 3 min the plastic was 92.6ºF I dropped the tub and measured my hand and it was 94.5º That is only as close to two degrees different as makes no difference. The room temp and start temp for the lid was 72ºF. Measuring the bottom of the tub bare is the only safe way. and removable substrate can be moved so the hottest possible contact temp is what should be measured. I won't start in on the accuracy of pyrometers I'll leave that be.

Lets guess at a higher heat we experience a 4x change (very generous here likely 1.5 or 2x max...) so 8º difference and at 130º -8 122º unacceptably high. Maybe aerogel at 1mm could do what you are claiming.

I would assume that a mammal maintaining an internal temp of 98.6 versus a cold blooded animal could have different read outs.

Right now we need to test the heat transfer through the plastic on its surface versus the surface temp of the pad.I will test the parrallel sides in the direction of the possible animal's position. Once we establish a number, we can start.

By some chance the pad loses huge amounts of heat through the plastic, this might be a moot argument. We are nowhere near the effects on the snake right now.

If I am understanding your findings...you had a 72 degree tub. You raised the tub to 92 degrees by use of a pad but the hand you placed in the tub somehow had a temp of 94 degrees from a surface that was 92 degrees?Not really sure I am understanding what you have written.

[suzuki4life]

suzuki4life, I've read your responses in this thread, but just to be clear, are you, or are you not recommending that an unregulated UTH should be used to heat a ball python's tub?

I said I have done it in the past without issue. I honestly feel that in a proper sized enclosure the snake will move on and off basking spot that a heat pad will not injure a snake. Whether or not it should be used is up to the owner.


I don't recommend placing a thermostat probe directly on a heat pad.

[Slim]

Whether or not it should be used is up to the owner.

Thank you for that clarification. It was not clear to me from your posts.

I don't recommend placing a thermostat probe directly on a heat pad.

This is a separate issue, and one that's been debated at length here before. For me, where you put your thermostat probe is a less critical issue than whether or not you use a thermostat to regulate a heat source.