Questions about breeding rats

[Mike41793]

they shouldnt be weaned fully until 4-5 weeks 3 at the least also you wont want to put two breeding males in together cause they will fight to the death once a female comes into heat the lemale rat carries for 20-22 days normaly and should have a little time to regain weight after each litter or it will take too much outta her bones and body and she will be more suseptible to diseases and those diseases can pass on to her babies which then you feed to your snakes then they pass on to your snakes which can be very disastrous for the snake rat and all involved and if you sell a sick rat to someone and it hurts there reptile you can be held responsible if you intend on selling some of them to help incure your cost of feeding and breeding them they are easy to breed and very easy to overbreed which can cause problems not in the overpopulation fact but the health fact anything else just ask cause i breed rats and have breed them for about 5-6 years now and i dont own snakes but i sell them for pets and feeders

What are some of these diseases that you speak of? If a snakes stomach acids are strong enough to break down everything like bones and fur, then I dont know how many diseases there could be in a captive bred rat that would hurt them. They also have been known to eat carrion in the wild, as someone else said. Im not trying to pick a fight with you btw, just wondering?

[jasbus]

Well, I can't speak for caging rats and lighting, but I have two rat barns, one with the lights on all the time, the other, just during daylight hours. I don't see a difference in any aspect of anything...

[Michelle.C]

If I remember correctly the study I am thinking of focuses on LAN (Light at Night). It was done as a human study, but rats were used to conduct the results. It did show accelerated tumor growth as well as Retinal degeneration. I also read a separate study that focuses on Prohibited Normal Melatonin Secretion when rats were exposed to electrical lights and devices.

I seriously doubt lights have a significant impact on the lifespan of a rat used for breeding feeders, or any rat for that matter. I was simply pointing out that rats are fine not being exposed to excessive lighting. As they are a primarily nocturnal species, even daylight can damage their retina.

Not to say you should keep your rats in absolute darkness. I just don't use extremely bright lights in the room I keep my rats and also keep them on a light cycle. But then again, my rats are pets.

[Blubb]

Thanks a lot Michelle, that's pretty interesting indeed ! I was just asking because I have a problem where I should place the cages, so I was thinking that my storage would fit pretty good. Basically, it's a room with a door, and it is completely dark all the time. I have no problems putting up some light a couple of hours each day. I try to avoid the smell as much as possible in my room, so I rather place the cages anywhere else.

Oh, and I have another question already ! You guys who have the rodents and snakes in the same room, doesn't your snakes think it is feeding time all the time because it smells rat everywhere? Like, your snakes think your hand is the rat because it smells rat everywhere.

I love how all people have their own way of breeding rodents, it makes it more interesting to chose between loads of ideas and techniques. (:

[Michelle.C]

Thanks a lot Michelle, that's pretty interesting indeed ! I was just asking because I have a problem where I should place the cages, so I was thinking that my storage would fit pretty good. Basically, it's a room with a door, and it is completely dark all the time. I have no problems putting up some light a couple of hours each day. I try to avoid the smell as much as possible in my room, so I rather place the cages anywhere else.

Oh, and I have another question already ! You guys who have the rodents and snakes in the same room, doesn't your snakes think it is feeding time all the time because it smells rat everywhere? Like, your snakes think your hand is the rat because it smells rat everywhere.

I love how all people have their own way of breeding rodents, it makes it more interesting to chose between loads of ideas and techniques. (:

I would definitely provide a light source through part of the day. I have a timer that corresponds with our sunrise/sunset. But a 12/12 light cycle would be perfect.

I actually do keep my rats housed in the same room as my snakes. Which I have over 100 rats counting babies (probably 40 adults) and right around the same number of snakes. I have not noticed increased aggression from the snakes, but maybe a slightly stronger feeding response. I just use hand sanitizer between handling snakes, rats, lizards, etc. Even between animals of the same species.

[satomi325]

So, I have thought about breeding my own rats to feed my ball pythons, but I don't really know how I should start the whole process. I have a couple of questions too. Hope I will get some help (:

1) how many cages should I start out with?
2) will 1.4 be good in the breeding cages?
3) do males fight with each other even if the cage is free from females?
4) after how many litters should I stop breeding a female?
5) do females accept other litters than their own in the same cage?
6) about how long does it take for a rat to grow about 100grams?

Help please, I am just a beginner ^^

1)Depends how many snakes you have and how often you feed.
2) yes. that's fine.
3) In my experience, no. I've kept tubs of breeding males together. They're all fine. They sleep, eat, play, and cuddle together. I don't do this anymore, but I've even kept 2 breeding males together in a tub of breeding females once. They did not fight at all. They grew up and were socialized together. The more dominant of them has bred to the females more often, but I have seen the second male breed with the dominant present. He didn't care.. They're sort of like lion coalitions. They're allies from other stranger males and will share females.
4) until you see production decrease. Around a year of breeding.
5) yes. I've had females w/o litters play babysitter for current mamas. Some may need human intervention to adopt. Like if you have a female with too many pups to care for, you can place some of her pups in w/ a another nursing mama. It's best to place babies w/ similar aged babies. Just remove the mother, place the new baby under the litter. Or try and get the baby to smell like the mama, by getting her to pee on the new baby.
6) I'm not sure. 2-3 months maybe??

Rat kittens will wean themselves typically after a week and a half or so..

Uh..aren't their eyes still closed at this time?? Yeah?
It takes 3 weeks minimum for a pup to wean. I would wait until you see them eating and drinking on their own before removing them from the mother.

they shouldnt be weaned fully until 4-5 weeks 3 at the least also you wont want to put two breeding males in together cause they will fight to the death once a female comes into heat the lemale rat carries for 20-22 days normaly and should have a little time to regain weight after each litter or it will take too much outta her bones and body and she will be more suseptible to diseases and those diseases can pass on to her babies which then you feed to your snakes then they pass on to your snakes which can be very disastrous for the snake rat and all involved and if you sell a sick rat to someone and it hurts there reptile you can be held responsible if you intend on selling some of them to help incure your cost of feeding and breeding them they are easy to breed and very easy to overbreed which can cause problems not in the overpopulation fact but the health fact anything else just ask cause i breed rats and have breed them for about 5-6 years now and i dont own snakes but i sell them for pets and feeders

Uh.... ?!

Actually, the less lights rats are exposed to, the better. I read a study a while ago about rats being exposed to too much household lights can be damaging.

As far as males fighting, I've never had an issue with that. I only breed my female rats once every few months, so my males all live communally in a large cage. I even have a male that the females will always beat up if he's alone, so I put his brother in with him when it comes time for him to breed. If raised together, males will develop bonds too.

Exactly what Michelle said. Males will bond together if they are raised and socialized together.

Also, I've heard of something similar regarding photo period exposure.
I'm not sure about rats, but I've read many publications about ferrets and how it could relate to adrenal disease. Since pets no longer live under a natural daylight schedule. Adrenal disease in ferrets are tumors and may be caused by the unnatural over exposure of lights due to living in a human household. So it's about hormones.

Oh, and I have another question already ! You guys who have the rodents and snakes in the same room, doesn't your snakes think it is feeding time all the time because it smells rat everywhere? Like, your snakes think your hand is the rat because it smells rat everywhere.

I love how all people have their own way of breeding rodents, it makes it more interesting to chose between loads of ideas and techniques. (:

I have rodents and snakes in the same room. My snakes don't react at all to the rodents in the room. Maybe for the first few days, but after that they went back to their normal behavior. Mine only get excited if the rodent is physically in their tubs.

[Blubb]

It seems like it is okay to have several females with litters in the same cage (although someone mentioned the opposite in page 1) so I will go with that. My goal is to produce at least 1 litter each week, so I guess I will need about 12 females and ~4 males to start with? How do you guys keep track of which female you should breed and which female that shouldn't? Let's say I have 1 cage where the breeding takes place, 3 cages with females (4 females in each one) and 1 cage of males (about 4 males). I'm afraid that I will put a female who should rest into the breeding cage. Any suggestions?

[satomi325]

It seems like it is okay to have several females with litters in the same cage (although someone mentioned the opposite in page 1) so I will go with that. My goal is to produce at least 1 litter each week, so I guess I will need about 12 females and ~4 males to start with? How do you guys keep track of which female you should breed and which female that shouldn't? Let's say I have 1 cage where the breeding takes place, 3 cages with females (4 females in each one) and 1 cage of males (about 4 males). I'm afraid that I will put a female who should rest into the breeding cage. Any suggestions?

I guess, all I can suggest is keep good records.
Personally, all my females look different so there's no chance for me to mix them up. You can get an ear notch for rats/mice and tag their ears for identification. Sharpie mark on their ear or the base of their tail works too, but has to be repeated every week or two as the ink fades.

To avoid mixing up females, you can categorize their cages as well.
So like,

Breeding Cage
Female 1 Cage: Pregnant
Female 2 Cage: Litter
Female 3 Cage: Rest

You can keep the females in their designated cage to avoid stress and just rotate a cage card that states their status. So for example, when Female 3 Cage is done resting, you can rotate a male into their cage to start breeding. Move the female 2 cage card to rest, etc etc.

You could probably even narrow down the males to 1 and just keep rotating him with the breeding stage cage.

These are just suggestions. In the end, you can do whatever you want.

And females in a group tend to synchronize their heat schedule (like humans), so they'll all go into heat at once...So you may not get a litter a week with this system. If you wanted a litter a week, you may have to make the groups smaller.

This shows a good example of litter a week w/ 12 females:
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j2...ngCalendar.jpg

Hope I didn't confuse you.

[Blubb]

I guess, all I can suggest is keep good records.
Personally, all my females look different so there's no chance for me to mix them up. You can get an ear notch for rats/mice and tag their ears for identification. Sharpie mark on their ear or the base of their tail works too, but has to be repeated every week or two as the ink fades.

To avoid mixing up females, you can categorize their cages as well.
So like,

Breeding Cage
Female 1 Cage: Pregnant
Female 2 Cage: Litter
Female 3 Cage: Rest

You can keep the females in their designated cage to avoid stress and just rotate a cage card that states their status. So for example, when Female 3 Cage is done resting, you can rotate a male into their cage to start breeding. Move the female 2 cage card to rest, etc etc.

You could probably even narrow down the males to 1 and just keep rotating him with the breeding stage cage.

These are just suggestions. In the end, you can do whatever you want.

And females in a group tend to synchronize their heat schedule (like humans), so they'll all go into heat at once...So you may not get a litter a week with this system. If you wanted a litter a week, you may have to make the groups smaller.

This shows a good example of litter a week w/ 12 females:
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j2...ngCalendar.jpg

Hope I didn't confuse you.

That's actually a great idea ! I will still probably feed f/t to my snakes as much as possible, so I might not need a litter per week at the moment. A litter should last about 3 weeks here. I guess I will start small and go bigger if needed. Thanks (:

[Annageckos]

I have one large breeding cage with two males and a few females in it. They all get along just fine. Then I have a few cages with just females and young and one with just one male and two females. I also have a cage with two pet males. The only issue I have with the rats is if I don't remove the young before the next litter is born the new litter tends to get trampled. So I remove the young rats into a grow out cage when they are about four weeks old, or before the next litter.