Live feeding vs. pre-killed

[evan385]

I have two ball pythons that are eating live small rats at about 80 grams right now. The one is a young male about 6 months old, he normally eats adult mice but I fed off all of my mice to get breeding rats and the small rats are all I have right now. She'll have babies within the week. I figure if I feed him every 10-14 days instead of my usual 5-7 this should be fine. Well the problem is that I had this rat in there for a good half an hour before he took it. And he only took it when I was trying to get the now terrified and would probably bite me rat out of his tank with tongs. I was chasing him around the tank for a couple minutes trying to catch him when he finally took it. I would say the tongs triggered a feeding response if he hadn't been fed live all his life. I'm thinking that he is intimidated by the rats size which is five-six inches and twice his girth. I was just thinking that he would eat more readily if the rat is pre-killed instead of live. Also I was thinking I should do this for safety reasons, a rat that size in the tank for that long could injure him. Now with my female an 80 gram rat is perfect for her, also I have no fear of the rat biting her before she can constrict it because she never hesitates, always strikes and constricts as soon as the rat comes near her. So I think I will continue to feed her live rats and try pre-killed with my male. Worst case scenario he doesn't take it, I feed him a live one and feed the pre-killed rat to my female because i've gone back and forth live/pre-killed/FT with her and had no problems. Suggestions? Opinions?

[Crawly's Mom]

Live is bad. I never understood just how bad until I recently rescued a ball who was being fed nothing but live. Rats can do some serious damage, even with balls that strike and constrict right away.

If you wanna see the kind of damage this can result in, just take a look at the girl I just picked up... its gruesome and not worth the risk in my opinion.

http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...y-First-Rescue

[Skittles1101]

Feeding live is not bad...it's just not for everyone. I know a lot of people on here who are responsible owners that feed only live. Saying feeding live is bad is like saying keeping a snake is bad, it's just not for everyone. It will also start an unnecessary argument between live feeders and f/t feeders.

I'm sorry to hear about your rescue, but that's not from just feeding live, it's from an irresponsible owner feeding live. Careful how you word your responses on these forums, they can be taken pretty bad.

P.S. I personally feed f/t, so I'm not biased

OP, if you personally are not comfortable feeding live, then feed p/k. I can't p/k a mouse or rat because I'm a pansy, so if I have to feed live, they are alive. I only feed live for a few feedings for babies who refuse f/t prey more than 3 times. I feed them live long enough to get them eating consistently and then I switch them to f/t.

[tcutting]

Live is bad. I never understood just how bad until I recently rescued a ball who was being fed nothing but live. Rats can do some serious damage, even with balls that strike and constrict right away.

If you wanna see the kind of damage this can result in, just take a look at the girl I just picked up... its gruesome and not worth the risk in my opinion.

http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...y-First-Rescue

x2 if you can avoid it, avoid it. My normal BP male i have had for many years has a part of his tail that got nipped off from a rat. NOT WORTH THE RISK if you can get them to eat pre-killed or Frozen/Thawed

and Lgray good point, its not that its "bad" but it has risks.

[evan385]

I've never had any problems with feeding live. If you know what you're doing you can prevent bites. I use tongs or forceps to either hold the rats back legs back so they can't scratch or hold the head back, whichever seems to be more important for the situation. By the way Crawly's Mom, that is nothing. I have seen much worse damage ie all of the skin from the neck gone, multiple severe bite wounds. There's a picture of this online but I won't post it here mostly because I don't want to see that again. My first ball python (Captain Hook) was a rescue. When I got her she had mouth rot, she was dehydrated, she had pneumonia, she had multiple bite wounds and she had mites. This is the result of very poor care by an irresponsible owner, not just live feeding. Also she has broken her jaw because she at some coconut bark/shavings while eating a large meal. Her jaw was halfway down her throat, it was horrible and she didn't eat for two months. I was heartbroken and I thought she was going to die. Anyways I feed live mostly as a personal preference, I like their lives in captivity to be as natural as possible.

[Stewart_Reptiles]

Live is not bad, irresponsible people are bad

I feed over 200 LIVE prey each month have done so for a little while and never had issues and I know I am not the only one.

The problem with people that think live feeding is bad or dangerous is that they based their opinions on tale and/or horrible stories accompanied with pictures that are the result of IRRESPONSIBLE feeding and rarely form their opinion on first hand experience.

Now what I like to see is people choosing for themselves what THEY want to feed to their animal based on being knowledgeable about their feeding options, and be responsible, I don't want them to be scared by others.

I am not saying that because I feed live I say that because that is what I believe, I started off feeding frozen, I now mainly feed live and keep feeding frozen to a few animals so I know what to do with surplus rats during the winter.

BTW Frozen can be "bad" too if we want to go there if done irresponsibly it can kill your animal not just injure it.

So anyway to be back on tract here, it's about being knowledgeable, responsible, and feed what works and is convenient for you and your animals.

[RestlessRobie]

I prefer F/T as well and have had no issues.The main reason for F/T is household sanity my wife and duaghters would be very unhappy if they had to see or hear a mouse or rat squeaking as it was constricted. Just for the info what can go wrong with feeding F/T that could kill a snake? Maybe I am missing something but if the rodent is thawed properly what else could go wrong?
Thanks in advance Deb

[pbjtime8908]

ive gone back and forth on this. at first i fed live because its all i knew and could get. then tried f/t and some would take it and some wouldnt. with the ones that wouldnt, i tried several times and several different tricks to get them to eat f/t but they wouldnt and then as soon as i introduced live back to them they ate no problem. now that ive found a rodent breeder near me instead of having to buy from the ahem "pet store", i feed only live. i just make sure to watch every single feeding to make sure that the snake isnt being bitten or scratched and will hold the prey's mouth until it is dead and then move onto the next. IMO that is responsible because im making sure the snake is not hurt and that it is feeding the same way its ancestors have been feeding since who knows when.

Maybe I am missing something but if the rodent is thawed properly what else could go wrong?
Thanks in advance Deb

the problem here is that sometimes the prey isnt thawed properly and if its too cold, and maybe too warm but im unsure, it can cause regurgitation which is in most cases bad for the snakes health. at least this is all just my understanding of it.

[mainbutter]

I know that plenty of people here are fans of Snakebytestv.

If I understand it correctly, BHB feeds their entire BP collection live. All of you who watch know just how many animals they have to feed, and just how many dollars of snake are "put at risk". Yes there is risk, but it's pretty minimal with smaller rats and even minimal supervision.

The worst thing you can do with live feeding is leave a live rat in with a snake, unsupervised. Watch 'em take it and constrict, and you're golden.

[RestlessRobie]

I was thinking to hot or not thawed was what Deb was talking about but I wanted to make sure. I thaw in the fridge over night then warn in water for 20 min or so. Then hit them with a blow dryer check temp with a temp gun making sure the head is about 95-100 and feed never had a problem eating yet. I am trying to convince the wife not to move the sons snake out of his enclosure to feed but she is still set on it but my other are eating in thier enclosure without a problem so hopefully she will be convinced soon Moving to feed is such a pain in the butt