Banana males taking a 20K price drop!!??

[snake lab]

If your asking if ive spent 30k on a morph the answer is no way. The most i ever spent on a single animal was a male spider in 2002 for 14k which was a grwat deal considering they were averaging 18k for males back then. Now i made my money back and then some the following year. Then the crash happened. The market got flooded and the prices dropped like crazy by 2005. Now lets look at this in the big picture. As long as people are putting prices tags in the 20 to 40k price range it brings more intrest into the ball python industry. Therefore everyone benefits cause the more people that come into the industry the more markets stay stable from the low end to the mid range to the high end. Most people that get into the breeding and selling aspect of ball pythons start of small and grow a collection so these high prices help everyone. This trend brought alot of the boa guys over to the dark side as well as the high end retic guys.

[Wh00h0069]

Woah woah woah, are you telling me you paid $30,000 for a morph!?!?!?!!? I love BPs but I don't think I'd ever pay that much for one, normal ones are pretty enough

I'm sure the person buying the snake isn't buying it for their collection. They are most likely buying it to breed and make more. Buying expensive, rare morphs is the best way to make good money in this business. In most businesses, you have to invest in order to make money.

[Wh00h0069]

Oh, and something else I really don't understand. So what if Oz sells his banana for $30k? That's great for whoever buys it. But that doesn't mean everyone else who has banana males has to sell them for $30k! Why does everyone think that as soon as one person drops the price, everyone else does too? That's absurd.

Then why does so many people call MKR and Bigdaddy Wholesaler market crashers?

[JLC]

Then why does so many people call MKR and Bigdaddy Wholesaler market crashers?

Because they didn't just sell ONE snake at a lower price than everyone else was selling for. One snake isn't going to change the face of the market anytime soon, even if he'd given it away for free. MKR and Bigdaddy and the like flooded the market with high dollar morphs at much lower prices. So, not only did they undercut the current market for that year, they also created a ripple effect on the following years' markets by having so many "cheap" morphs out there breeding. They weren't doing this with snakes worth tens of thousands of dollars though....just a grand or two. It's just a different scenario all the way around.

And what's really ironic is that the whole basis for this thread is a false rumor to begin with. He didn't sell the snake for $30k. He got something like $42k plus another $25k in trade for a total value of $67k. Hardly a market crasher.

[Wh00h0069]

Because they didn't just sell ONE snake at a lower price than everyone else was selling for. One snake isn't going to change the face of the market anytime soon, even if he'd given it away for free. MKR and Bigdaddy and the like flooded the market with high dollar morphs at much lower prices. So, not only did they undercut the current market for that year, they also created a ripple effect on the following years' markets by having so many "cheap" morphs out there breeding. They weren't doing this with snakes worth tens of thousands of dollars though....just a grand or two. It's just a different scenario all the way around.

And what's really ironic is that the whole basis for this thread is a false rumor to begin with. He didn't sell the snake for $30k. He got something like $42k plus another $25k in trade for a total value of $67k. Hardly a market crasher.

I agree with you, but the poster that I quoted said that if one person drops their prices then not everyone has to, but that is not the case.

[JLC]

I agree with you, but the poster that I quoted said that if one person drops their prices then not everyone has to, but that is not the case.

Why is that not the case? If one person drops their price on a whole bunch of snakes, then that might be the case....but to drop price on one? That just means one person gets a lucky deal. The rest of the crowd that wants (and has the money to spend on) a banana this year still have to pay whatever the sellers are asking. If there are no other "$30k" bananas on the market, then they'll pay the $50k because that's what they would have paid anyhow, no matter how much the first guy charged for his.

If all the rest of the sellers follow suit based on ONE guy selling ONE snake....then that's their own foolishness and not his fault that they didn't think it through.

[Wh00h0069]

Why is that not the case? If one person drops their price on a whole bunch of snakes, then that might be the case....but to drop price on one? That just means one person gets a lucky deal. The rest of the crowd that wants (and has the money to spend on) a banana this year still have to pay whatever the sellers are asking. If there are no other "$30k" bananas on the market, then they'll pay the $50k because that's what they would have paid anyhow, no matter how much the first guy charged for his.

If all the rest of the sellers follow suit based on ONE guy selling ONE snake....then that's their own foolishness and not his fault that they didn't think it through.

You are right, but the poster that I quoted did not say just one snake, he said, "Why does everyone think that as soon as one person drops the price, everyone else does too? That's absurd." I took that to mean that if one person drops the price of their animals that no one else has to follow suit. IMO, that is not the case. If people see someone selling an animal for a lot less, then they are less willing to pay premium price for the same type of animal.

Also, some ball males can breed within the first year. Therefore, if so someone does drop their price, then the buyers can buy males and breed them to as many females as possible to mass produce them that same year. The could then sell them for lower prices the following year.

[CapeFearConstrictors]

Let's say 10 people have 2 banana males each to sell this year. One person decides to sell theirs for $30k because they're nervous and want to get a quick sale. Their two males sell very quickly. There are now 18 banana males available. Why would the other sellers need to drop their price? The lowballer is now out of stock. Anyone wanting to get into the project now has to pay the asking price of one of the other 9 breeders.

Now, the following year things might be different. The two people who bought those $30k males might have their own males to sell. If they are smart, they will charge a premium for them and make a fortune.

I'll tell you right now, if I were able to get my hands on a banana male for $30k, and the typical asking price next year is $50k, you can be sure that my asking price will be right up there with the rest of them. Now, if they stop moving at that price, then the asking price should be lowered, but isn't the idea to get the most return on your investment?

[Wh00h0069]

Let's say 10 people have 2 banana males each to sell this year. One person decides to sell theirs for $30k because they're nervous and want to get a quick sale. Their two males sell very quickly. There are now 18 banana males available. Why would the other sellers need to drop their price? The lowballer is now out of stock. Anyone wanting to get into the project now has to pay the asking price of one of the other 9 breeders.

Now, the following year things might be different. The two people who bought those $30k males might have their own males to sell. If they are smart, they will charge a premium for them and make a fortune.

I'll tell you right now, if I were able to get my hands on a banana male for $30k, and the typical asking price next year is $50k, you can be sure that my asking price will be right up there with the rest of them. Now, if they stop moving at that price, then the asking price should be lowered, but isn't the idea to get the most return on your investment?

I see what you are saying, but look at it this way. Do you really think that there are another 18 people who are willing to pay $50K for each banana? If not, then the sellers will either have to sit on their animals or sell for a lower price. Since their are 9 other sellers, they will need to compete, and sell for less. Since people has already seen them selling for $30K, then they may not be willing to pay a premium if they think they are able to get it lower.

Also, if the two people who bought the two banana males breed them the same year to multiple females, then they will have an abundance of them the next season. Say they make ten bananas each from the two males, now there are twenty more bananas on the market plus all of their competitors, so everyone has to drop their price.

I have seen this same thing happen time and time again in the ball python market.

[CapeFearConstrictors]

Ozzy sold his banana male pretty quickly. That tells me (along with other rumors I've heard) that these are a hot selling item when offered for sale. There's a lot of buying that goes on behind the scenes that nobody talks about. If there were 18 male bananas available for sale right now for $50k, I bet they'd all be sold by the end of the year.

Granted, with the news about males that create males, the price is going to drop over the next few years because of the abundance of males, but they won't be in the sub $10k range for a long time, I'd bet. I actually see the prices of these 2nd and 3rd generation males going UP from where they currently are. If males that throw mostly females sell for $67k this year, how much would a male that gives you mostly males go for?

But yes, as there are more males available, the prices will inevitably drop. However, that doesn't mean it has to crash. Just because one person sells at a lower price doesn't mean everyone has to. That would be like all furniture stores lowering their prices because one showroom has a going out of business sale selling things at cost. Once the low baller is out of stock, people will pay the market price. They don't have any other choice.