Cohabitating different species

I have interacted with Roman in a handful of threads. He may not be the most conventional keeper, but he KNOWS HIS STUFF.

I've developed a HUGE respect for Roman because I've been fortunate enough to see how deep his research goes firsthand. He was kind enough to share some of the papers he has read with me. And just through listening to (errrr, reading) him, it is very clear that every move he makes with his animals is well thought out, due diligence has been thoroughly put in, and most importantly, his animals health and well being are always top priority.

Now, I will say that this particular cohabitation project is pushing the envelope a bit, but I think Roman is one of very few keepers I respect enough to fully support this project. I can say with complete certainty that Roman put the time in to do the research, weigh out pros and cons and do it the right way.

...and look at that enclosure, that is just gorgeous!!! Pretty much any herp lover's dream come true.

Roman, keep up the great work!!!!

Roman, you've obviously done quality research, & set up a fantastic enclosure. But sometimes previous research doesn't cover everything & you just have to try
something a little "outside the box". Thank you for sharing here so all can learn from your set-up. :gj: Looks like it's a winner!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GoatBoy

Well I see that you really have done the research and have a well made viv. You also care about the animals, and dont seem to be a dummy just dumping animals in together for no good reason.

As far as dendroboard, there are a lot of legitimate scientists and zoologists over there. People who have spent their entire lives doing lab work and field research in South America. Some have literally wrote the books on darts. So, I do take their advice when I can. One thing they DO NOT tolerate is mixing frog species and morphs, as the goal with darts is to keep the gene pool in pristine condition as it is found in nature, and it has been for a long time. If you mix darts you will quickly be ostracised from the hobby.
[...]

---

I did not want to sound as if I thought the dart frog keepers or the users of the other forum were dummies, quite contrary. During my research I was talking to many keepers and breeders here in Germany and they gave me competent and really valuable advice. I am not active on the dendroboard, but I suppose it is the same, especially if there are so many experienced keepers and researchers around there. What I wanted to say was that (nearly) everybody would automatically reject the idea without a real reason. The exception was the curator for Reptiles and Amphibians of the University of Manchester (GB). I met him during a conference last year and talked about my brainstorm and while he didn’t know if it might be possible he encouraged me to at least give it a try.

The notion of not mixing the species to keep the gene pool clear is something I can only agree to, this is something we snake keepers should try to do more often ourselves.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GoatBoy

[...]Your frogs do sound like they are doing well. Just keep an eye on weight and humidity and you should be alright. Please give updates, especially if you start getting eggs. You can pull them or let them grow in the tank.

---

Thanks for the advice, I am not sure if they are really in breeding mode, but I heard the male call out several times…

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by John1982

[...] Well done on the enclosure, Roman. I think the only thing missing(or at least that isn't shown) is a nice, comfy sitting area for you to hang out and enjoy the fruits of your labor.

---

Ahh, you know, there is not much room in front of the enclosure, since it is located in a passage to another room. On the other hand, I am sitting in my office long enough each day, standing and watching them is good for my back.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Craiga 01453

I have interacted with Roman in a handful of threads. He may not be the most conventional keeper, but he KNOWS HIS STUFF.

I've developed a HUGE respect for Roman because I've been fortunate enough to see how deep his research goes firsthand. He was kind enough to share some of the papers he has read with me. And just through listening to (errrr, reading) him, it is very clear that every move he makes with his animals is well thought out, due diligence has been thoroughly put in, and most importantly, his animals health and well being are always top priority.

Now, I will say that this particular cohabitation project is pushing the envelope a bit, but I think Roman is one of very few keepers I respect enough to fully support this project. I can say with complete certainty that Roman put the time in to do the research, weigh out pros and cons and do it the right way.

...and look at that enclosure, that is just gorgeous!!! Pretty much any herp lover's dream come true.

Roman, keep up the great work!!!!

---

Thanks Craig, I really appreciate it. It is always a pleasure to argue with you :D and I think we can only advance our hobby if we try to educate each other, share our knowledge and discuss new or ongoing projects. It is always possible to suffer from tunnel vision, so sometimes it needs somebody else to point out any flaws in your concept.


For this project, I was really weighing pros and cons for more than a year, I was pretty certain that it might work, but there was still a risk involved. In my point of view, if you keep an animal it is your responsibility to do it the best way (for the animal) possible, so I was unsure if it was justifiable to put the frog(s) at risk. But so far I think it is beneficial for both snakes and frogs. Since it has worked out (so far) I try to spread the information in different forums to give a new impulse and help educate other keepers. Not necessarily to advocate mixing species to everyone, but simply to show that it is possible under the right circumstances.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Roman

I did not want to sound as if I thought the dart frog keepers or the users of the other forum were dummies, quite contrary. During my research I was talking to many keepers and breeders here in Germany and they gave me competent and really valuable advice. I am not active on the dendroboard, but I suppose it is the same, especially if there are so many experienced keepers and researchers around there. What I wanted to say was that (nearly) everybody would automatically reject the idea without a real reason. The exception was the curator for Reptiles and Amphibians of the University of Manchester (GB). I met him during a conference last year and talked about my brainstorm and while he didn’t know if it might be possible he encouraged me to at least give it a try.

The notion of not mixing the species to keep the gene pool clear is something I can only agree to, this is something we snake keepers should try to do more often ourselves.



Thanks for the advice, I am not sure if they are really in breeding mode, but I heard the male call out several times…



Ahh, you know, there is not much room in front of the enclosure, since it is located in a passage to another room. On the other hand, I am sitting in my office long enough each day, standing and watching them is good for my back.



Thanks Craig, I really appreciate it. It is always a pleasure to argue with you :D and I think we can only advance our hobby if we try to educate each other, share our knowledge and discuss new or ongoing projects. It is always possible to suffer from tunnel vision, so sometimes it needs somebody else to point out any flaws in your concept.


For this project, I was really weighing pros and cons for more than a year, I was pretty certain that it might work, but there was still a risk involved. In my point of view, if you keep an animal it is your responsibility to do it the best way (for the animal) possible, so I was unsure if it was justifiable to put the frog(s) at risk. But so far I think it is beneficial for both snakes and frogs. Since it has worked out (so far) I try to spread the information in different forums to give a new impulse and help educate other keepers. Not necessarily to advocate mixing species to everyone, but simply to show that it is possible under the right circumstances.

---

Hahahahaha,yes it is.

And you're absolutely right about tunnel vision. I've probably slipped in that direction a bit myself. You know, the whole "if it ain't broke..." deal. But I'd be doing myself and my animals a disservice to think things can't be improved.
You've been influential in expanding my horizons. There's always new information available and studies are ongoing. So I'll be happy to argue with you again soon, hahaha.