Update on Hatchling

Well its been almost a month since little Rubii hatched out. It will be a month tomorrow. She still has not shed. We attempted to feed her a mouse fuzzy but she wouldn't take it. We did however find it dead in her tub. Not sure if she struck it and killed it (no blood) or if it just died because it was young. We are going to attempt to feed her again tonight. And yes, I'm sure she has not shed. She is still the same color (she got a bit darker last week, but she is still that color and she is showing no signs of going opaque).

I freshen her water every morning, so I'm pretty sure she's staying hydrated. I'm going to try pre-scenting this time and see if it makes a difference. I normally do not have to pre-scent since the snakes and rodents share the same room, but I'm going to give it a shot with Rubii. Wish me luck.

You know what they say..... PICTURES SAY A THOUSAND WORDS!!!!

WHERES THE PICTURES!!!!!!!??????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'll take more pictures of her tonight. I actually want to get a picture of her belly and post it for everyone's opinion. Her father is a 100% het pied with markers and I'm wondering if a few markings on her belly that I'm seeing are possibly markers. Even if this little girl isn't a het pied and even if she isn't a girl (my first time popping a ball python) I am so in love with this little snake. :D

Ok i dont get the markings on het pieds, when people post photos and take pics of the bellys i dont know what to look for????

What do I look for????

I don't think I have any belly pictures of Xefaud, my het pied. He has some pretty obvious markers. Markers for het pieds are normally the markings on the belly connecting. Hmm. Let me go snap a really quick pic of Xefaud's belly for you and I'll post it. Its easier to show you then try to explain. Haha. :P

Quote:

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Originally Posted by tjones

Ok i dont get the markings on het pieds, when people post photos and take pics of the bellys i dont know what to look for????

What do I look for????

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The lack of pattern on the belly (leading up to the vent) with solid black lines running on the edges of the belly:
http://www.repticzone.net/images/4266/IMG_2288.JPG
Sorry for the poor quality picture. It was taken in like 2005.

Notice how the belly pattern stops as the black outline starts.

http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r...ke/marker3.jpg

Here is Xefaud's marker.

Ok, here are a few pictures of Rubii. Now looking at Xefaud's marker, I don't think she has a marker, but only breeding her will tell if she's het or not. :P

http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r...e/rubii1-1.jpg

http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r...e/rubii2-1.jpg

http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r...e/rubii3-1.jpg

http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r...e/rubii4-1.jpg

Well, I don't know anything about feeding or shedding babies, but I will say that Rubii is SO CUTE! I love her name. And she has a really clear belly for a normal/poss het, doesn't she? Either way, I really hope she sheds and starts feeding for you! I'm glad to see her. She looks healthy to me.
Good luck!
Seneschal <3

Thanks. My older sister named her. July's birthstone is a ruby so we named her that with a twist. She's not incredibly head shy and as you can see, she is definitely a "ball" python. Its so cute when she forms her little ball. She looks like a brown baseball. :D

I pre-scented for a few minutes and then stuck the little fuzzy in with her. She always turns away from it though. So again (like last week) I took a cardboard box (like they use at petstores to send your pet home in) and put both Rubii and the mouse in it. When I checked about an hour later, she wasn't in a ball anymore but she was facing away from the mouse. *sigh* I really wish this girl would eat. What if she keeps refusing?

Force feeding if it goes on too long I would assume.

Checked on her and nothing. :( Should I leave the fuzzy in with her overnight? It can't hurt her and the worst that could happen is it dies and I just remove it in the morning. Any ideas?

Maybe she's stressed from being moved from her cage to a feeding container? Why not just offer it to her in her own cage?

Also, if it's a rat fuzzy, it may not be moving enough to spark Rubii's interest. Try offering a mouse hopper and then switching her over to rats after a few meals.

I'm feeding her in a smaller container because I have tried feeding her in her own tub, twice. This trick helped when I had a baby corn who was too insecure to feed in his own enclosure. I put him in a brown paper bag with the mouse pinky and he ate that way. After that he was ok to eat in his own enclosure.

Also, she is too small for a mouse hopper. I'm trying a mouse fuzzy, not a rat fuzzy. This hatchling weighs 37g. She's half the size she should be and very very tiny.

she might just be a real slow starter if she has not shed yet i would say she probally is do you have a weight on her.
you might have to assist feed her if she doesnt eat on her own.
i wouldnt ever force feed a bp.

How would I assist feed her? She's 37g.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jay_Bunny

I'm feeding her in a smaller container because I have tried feeding her in her own tub, twice. This trick helped when I had a baby corn who was too insecure to feed in his own enclosure. I put him in a brown paper bag with the mouse pinky and he ate that way. After that he was ok to eat in his own enclosure.

Also, she is too small for a mouse hopper. I'm trying a mouse fuzzy, not a rat fuzzy. This hatchling weighs 37g. She's half the size she should be and very very tiny.

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Oh, ok. That makes sense.

A month is a really long time to not shed. I've had corns (they've all been runts) who didn't shed. For whatever reason they didn't even though their bodies were ready to. They usually have a wrinkly and dull look to them. For them what I did was to soak them in a deli cup with wet warm paper towels for 30 min or so and then gently peel the skin off them.

So something like that may be in order. What size tank/tub are you keeping her in right now? Last year I started mine in 6 qt tubs, but I had one hold out feeding. I switched her to a small zip-loc storage container to live in. She started eating right away. I kept her in that for about 6 feedings before I moved her over to the 6 qt, she was fine after that.

So while the paper bag trick is good, she may need to be somewhere smaller all the time, and then be fed in her cage and avoid stress of moving.

Also, have you only tried mice? Try a rat pink instead. Or if you have access to ASF, try that.

You still have lots of options and lots of time before its panic time.

She is in a 16qt in the main rack. I know that is too big. I wasn't able to get a hatchling rack like I needed because we hit a financial snag halfway through incubation (husband lost job). Now we are just waiting till he gets his paycheck and I'll be ordering a hatchling rack.

I haven't tried anything but mice since she's so small. I don't have access to anything but mice and rats. She doesn't even look like she's ready to shed yet. She's still shiny.

So I could try moving her to a smaller container, but I don't have anything smaller.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jay_Bunny

How would I assist feed her? She's 37g.

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this sticky should help

http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...assist+feeding

Thanks. She didn't take the fuzzy last night. She just kind of sits there and if it comes near her she moves away from it. :( Should I pull the fuzzy out and feed it to something else and try again next week or start thinking about assist feeding her?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jay_Bunny

Thanks. She didn't take the fuzzy last night. She just kind of sits there and if it comes near her she moves away from it. :( Should I pull the fuzzy out and feed it to something else and try again next week or start thinking about assist feeding her?

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thats really a tough call. because shes so small perhaps shes not ready yet. or it could be the shed issue. it could just be that she has not caught on to feeding. ive had a few ch babies that did this same thing. perhaps someone with alot more experience could shed some light on the subject

You can definitely put her in something smaller. I have the AP rack for the 1756/54 tubs. But for hatchlings I put them in 6 qt tubs with the lids on in that rack. I can fit three of them side by side. This is better for me anyways as I don't want to buy a hatchling rack that won't even be in use all the time.

So I'd try that. If you still dont' want to, at the very least put lots of fake plants, crumpled paper, hides, etc so she is totally secure.

I will definitely try to make her feel more secure. How long can she go without food though? I have adult females that went 4 months, but those are adults. Rubii is a little baby. I can't imagine her going so long without food.

Jay,
I see that someone has linked my post above on how to do it. I have two snakes that need assisting this weekened. I think I will try to do it tonight, and post up some pics in that thread (since I did promise that anyway). I waould say that at that size, I typically do not wait too long. I would go ahead and assist that snake now. Sometimes assist feeding helps them to realize that they need to eat, kind of like a reminder. I would assist with a large mouse pink/small mouse fuzzy. In other words, something smaller than you would normally feed.

With all of that said, one of the animals I am assisiting right now has had 4 assisted meals, and is about a month old, and just shed yesterday. Sometimes they do that. In my opinion, what happens is they are dehydrated from a lack of absorbing enough yolk, and the skin does not slough efficiently. Make sure you keep the animal sprayed, and they will usually shed within 4 weeks of hatching. I would bet your's will shed after a few meals.

Also, if you need to, please feel free to give me a call.

I hope that helps,

Thanks! Something I'm wondering about though. She has an ever so slight kink right behind her head. Will this be a problem with assist feeding? I'll go get a picture of it so you can see.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jay_Bunny

She is in a 16qt in the main rack. I know that is too big. I wasn't able to get a hatchling rack like I needed because we hit a financial snag halfway through incubation (husband lost job). Now we are just waiting till he gets his paycheck and I'll be ordering a hatchling rack.

I haven't tried anything but mice since she's so small. I don't have access to anything but mice and rats. She doesn't even look like she's ready to shed yet. She's still shiny.

So I could try moving her to a smaller container, but I don't have anything smaller.

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Go to Walmart and buy a six quart tub, line it with paper towel and a water dish and stick her in the incubator if you don't have other heating for the tub. The six quart tub is $1.

Then after a few days, put the live prey item in the tub with her and leave her be for at least an hour.

At some point, if she's still refusing, you're going to need to consider assist feeding her.

I will do that right now. Thank you.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jay_Bunny

Thanks! Something I'm wondering about though. She has an ever so slight kink right behind her head. Will this be a problem with assist feeding? I'll go get a picture of it so you can see.

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Depending on severity, it could be a problem. With that said, if it looks like she can eat on her own, in regards to the kink, then she should be able to be assist fed.

The kink is directly behind her head. She can turn her head in both directions.

http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r...ake/rubii4.jpg

Look directly behind her head and you can see how the marking goes to the left and then flows normally with the rest of the body. That part of the marking is where the kink is. But she can turn her head and such, so maybe it won't be a problem. What do you think?

We offered her another meal and she's not taking it. We even tried scenting it with an asf. She has no interest in the feeder. If no one thinks the kink will be a problem, I'd like to try assist feeding her.

Also, I weighed her today to see if she'd lost any weight and according to the scale, she had gained 2g. The scale read 39g. Is this from her drinking water? I weighed her 3 times to make sure and it definitely says she gained 2g.

I would say assist. I was going to get some pics today of an assist feeding, but the three animals I have been assisting all took their meals on their own. I guess I'll have to wait for another problem feeder this year.

Let us know how it goes Jay.

(Hubby here) We're trying to assist feed, and seemed to be having a good bit of luck... She got all the way to the back feet before she decided she wasn't going to eat the darn thing. We're trying to put the pinky's head back into her mouth, but she keeps letting go of it.

We got her to begin eating twice. Both times when she got it half way down, she'd stop and spit it back out. After the second time, she seemed really tired so I put her back in her little tub (6qt) and left her alone with a hide and a water dish. She's in the incubator so its nice and dark.

I was thinking of having someone else try and assist feed her after she has a few days to rest. What do you think?