little kinked guy!

ok im sure most of yall remember my little kinked normal that was born over a month ago, well he still has not shed. he is very active, and i even offered him food cause im very worried but nothing. what do yall think i should do?

i dont reeally know what to do since im still new to ball pythons, but just dropping on to say hope hes al right

He may not eat on his own. You may have to try feeding him manually and start the meal in his mouth for him. He should continue to swallow it. He needs to get something in him to get his strength up since hes still young.

That that dont work you can always try the syringe method

Have you tried offering him a hopper mouse, a rat fuzzy, or an African soft furred rat hopper? Was it live? If not it may have to be. Also you can sometimes place that prey item in the snakes mouth and it just "clicks" and they coil and eat it. Try different prey items. He may just need a different one to get him started. Some babies are tricky and some who have problems are much more. I know I spent about six months working with one ball python who was born with a bad neurological problem and next to no head/neck motor controls. It took a long time to get him eating on his own and let me tell you... these snakes are pretty hardy little things. I later was given him due to his problems. He today still has issues with his motor controls but no where near as what they were a few years ago. Keep on trying, do not give up. I've seen snakes with worse looking kinks then that and they are a live and well functioning like a normal snake. I think this guy will be okay once started. Please no not attempt to tube feed him. That should only be used as an absolute last resort. Best of luck to you guys. Keep us updated!!!

thanks all. but does it matter that he has not shed yet. i have tried several different items as food. i do have a pre killed small mouse that im going to leave in his tub over night to see if he might take it but we are praying he starts eating and shedding soon. he did have a small bowle movement so that seems to be working fine.

he won't really shed until he starts to grow so once eating shedding will come. I know my one amale who had stopped eatign only shed once the entire 4-6 months, and since he ate he shedding again I have hopes that after he shed he keeps eating cause i won't coutnt him eating until I know he got 2-3 meals in him in a row.

I do hope you little guy does eat for you . I know some of my were pickie and had to be left alone with the food before they eat .

how bad is the kink? Sorry, not familiar with the history on him...

Personally, if I produce a bad kink, it is going in the freezer.

I would try and assist feed him. I did it for a het pied female the other day. It worked great and seemed to have put her in feed mode instantly. Here is a little help on how to do it. Disclaimer: I am NOT a vet this is merely a method I have used to feed a snake that was jepordizing its health due to not eating. It HAD to be done. Have a bowl ready to cover the snake after you get him started. Oh Yeah, make sure to use a smaller than usual prey item to complete this procedure. 1. Just hold him like you would a venomous snake(you thumb behind one side of the jaw and you index finger behind the other side of the jaw). 2. Thump the pinky so it is dead. 3. Use the head of the pinky to open the mouth of the snake. Once you get the mouth semi-open the snake should kinda open the mouth and allow you to put the head of the pinky in. 4. Push the head of the pinky GENTLY to the back of the snakes throat(you should make sure the head of the pinky goes far enough down the throat of the snake that it is about even with where your fingers are behind the head of the snake, remember you can't choke the snake they are designed to eat and breathe at the same time). 5. Put the snake down quickly and gently, cover the snake with the bowl and leave him be for a few mimutes. If you put the pinky in far enough the snake should have swollowed the pinky. If you use this method keep me posted on how it worked out for you. Good luck on you little guy:gj:

this same thing happened to me this year with my first hatchling. after a month, i started to offer food even though it had not shed yet. it wouldn't take food and didn't show any signs of shed for another week. i started to force feed it and within 2 weeks (2 meals) it shed. it has yet to eat on its own yet so im hoping that it will come around soon. i have tried every trick in the book and have tired ASF and regular rats and mice with nothing.

i say force/assist feed it and it will shed out soon.

Are you keeping him on damp paper towels as a substrate?

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Originally Posted by Mike Cavanaugh

how bad is the kink? Sorry, not familiar with the history on him...

Personally, if I produce a bad kink, it is going in the freezer.

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I agree that having a badly kinked ball the only humane thing to do is put it down. I've not seen pics or really know about this kinked ball, but I assumed that it wasn't all that bad? I could be wrong. OP do you have a picture of him and his kink?

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Originally Posted by frankykeno

Are you keeping him on damp paper towels as a substrate?

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I was thinking this myself last night but never added it in. If not, could be the problem.

I had some normal hatchlings in 2007 take forever to shed. A good month and a half or so.

I would leave him alone, make sure the temps were warm enough(95 hot side) and offer a LIVE hopper mouse at night. Leave the mouse in the tub with the snake OVERNIGHT. Make sure he has a small hide and is still on moist paper towels. Cover his tub with a dark pillowcase if you think he needs extra security.

I've also had to hand-shed the few that took forever to shed. They get dry looking and you just start at their nose and work down. Comes off fine. I don't know why they do this, but sometimes they just need some extra help.

If he's passing waste, that's a good sign.

ok he has shed kind of but he still wont eat he is drying up and i have tried the starting a mouse in his mouth for him several times hoping it click for him and left mice hoppers and rat pinkies overnight and still nothing. i am starting to worry that he is suffering. any addvice.

one thing i would suggest now is force feeding. Find a pinky pump and use that to get some nutrients in him. Hes probably too weak to eat.

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Originally Posted by flameethrower

one thing i would suggest now is force feeding. Find a pinky pump and use that to get some nutrients in him. Hes probably too weak to eat.

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where can i get a pinky pump.

I myself have no idea where to get them but i see them. Someone on here will know for sure where to get them.

EDIT: heres a link that might help. http://forums.kingsnake.com/view.php?id=1202343,1202717

I've seen them on ebay

i just did some searching and found a video saying mix some baby food (chicken) with a little repti cal and water and use a 2.7 catheter and inject down their throat. i found several videos that say this works well. so i think i will go to my vet after work tomorrow to pick up the suplies and hope this will help. they claim that it will not harm them at all.

All the best with him

i feel that a minced pinky would be better and i dont have time to order a pinky pump. how can i mince a pinky.

Hi,

How would you get it into the syringe with the catheter (or whatever) afterwards as well?

Mashing with the back of a spoon in water might work - danged disgusting smelling I suspect but possible.

But when you are then left with a cup of goop whats next?

Can't you just force feed a whole pinkie instead?

Either way the stress on the animal will be high - fair warning it might be enough to finish it off if it is really far gone. :(


dr del

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Originally Posted by dmaricle

i feel that a minced pinky would be better and i dont have time to order a pinky pump. how can i mince a pinky.

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Magic Bullet or a sharp chef's knife???

I don't envy you on that task.

after further research several people have recomended using a meat based baby food mixed with reptical so i'm going to try that. turns out i have the syringe and rubber hose

have any pics i know that one of the guys on the bhb team has worked with a really bad kinked snake and it came out looking normal

i will get pics asap.

Or you can find a empty caulking gun..new at store... and pack 2 rat pink in the blender..add some water but not to much. u want it about like baby food.Then cut a nice size hole in the tip of C.G. and then just ask him to say ahhhhhh....not to fast but dont play around...get it done fast and stress free as much as you can...it worked vary vary well with a paster i got....

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Originally Posted by dmaricle

how can i mince a pinky.

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You can try one of those Slap Chops...


Good luck with your little guy...

i forced fed a pinkie rat pup to my one snake I cheated and used the surgail type forceceps( spelling) and just worked he pinkie down the thoart after 2 times the snake wised up and realised eatin on it own was better. ( now the little sucker won't stop lol she 3time almost the weight of her sibling that was adopted out and came back but I think I know why since they were feeeding mice still.

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Originally Posted by dmaricle

where can i get a pinky pump.

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do NOT use a pinky pump without a vet present these things are damaging and if used improperly can injure or kill the snake.

If you have zero experience assist feeding you need to find a competent herp vet or a good herp person who has dealt with hatchlings before.

ok to day i made the mixture and it all went really well he put up a little fight but then relaxed and it was very simple and i put him back in his tub. i will give him a few days then attempt it again. i followed the exact mixture from the ball python manual. i am very confident in my ability to handle these situations. i just was mainly trying to find out a mixture.

Can you post a photo of him? It doesn't seem right that a snake could be a month old without having shed. Ball pythons normally shed about a week after they hatch, and they don't take their first meal for several days after that first shed.
It's easy to tell from a photo if the snake has had its first shed. Maybe you missed it, if it was stuck under a bowl. Very very rarely, some snakes will even eat them.

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Originally Posted by WingedWolfPsion

Can you post a photo of him? It doesn't seem right that a snake could be a month old without having shed. Ball pythons normally shed about a week after they hatch, and they don't take their first meal for several days after that first shed.
It's easy to tell from a photo if the snake has had its first shed. Maybe you missed it, if it was stuck under a bowl. Very very rarely, some snakes will even eat them.

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i know he just shed do to the fact that i had to soak him several times to get the shed to loosen up. he seems fine it has been several hours now since the feeding. so keep your fingers crossed for the little guy.

this is him in the egg.
http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l8...es/oddbaby.jpg
this is when he was out.
http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l8...cture005-2.jpg

ok i fed him again last night and he is slowly regaining his strength. so i am just happy with the results of this method.

here is a video of the method i use. thanks

YouTube - how to force feed a ball python.

A Badly kinked normal that you have to force feed with a tube?

Sorry, but especially after seeing that picture, I would have to disagree with not euthanizeing it. It's not like it is a insignificant little kink on the tail.... that is a major kink in the middle of the snakes back... In the middle of his digestive system.

How exactly will you measure if it can successfully live? If it finally at some points eats by itself? How do you know it is not uncomfortable or in pain all the time? Refusing to eat as a hatchling when its siblings are all eating just fine is a good indication of this I would think.

But, it is your snake and you can do as you want. Not trying to hijack your thread so I will no comment any more.

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Originally Posted by Mike Cavanaugh

A Badly kinked normal that you have to force feed with a tube?

Sorry, but especially after seeing that picture, I would have to disagree with not euthanizeing it. It's not like it is a insignificant little kink on the tail.... that is a major kink in the middle of the snakes back... In the middle of his digestive system.

How exactly will you measure if it can successfully live? If it finally at some points eats by itself? How do you know it is not uncomfortable or in pain all the time? Refusing to eat as a hatchling when its siblings are all eating just fine is a good indication of this I would think.

But, it is your snake and you can do as you want. Not trying to hijack your thread so I will no comment any more.

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thanks for your concern and the future of this little guy is still not for sure. but i have found a few cases of kinked snakes that as they grew the kink improved greatly. and if this guy does not start eating on his own soon i may still have to put him down. but he did shed and goes to the bathroom just fine, so his digestion is working. so i cant just put him down. everything seems to be working fine for him and he gets around great. so i cant just put him down, now if i start seeing problems other than visual ones i will do the rite thing. but again thanks for your concern.

well my thoughts are with you and I wsh you AND him the best of luck.

Hope everthing goes well with him!~

Daniel

I got two rescues in from a pet store, both were ch and had not shed their hatching skin in about 3 months.
Nor had they fed, it was bad.
I did some research and found if you can use chop sticks or other small forceps and get the snake to open its mouth, have another person hold the forceps or sticks for a moment, THIS is from the SIDE of the mouth.
I put a pinky in the mouth, up to the forceps and then had the person slide them out.
Leaving the pinky in the mouth, I pushed a little more to get the teeth into it. Then left it alone.
I had to do this once for one snake and twice for the other, and they ate on their own after that. I did not force it down the throat, and they both ate that way..
Just a thought, I hope it will help.

Carol

You guys.... Dont go jamming random objects into a snakes mouth. These tools CAN cause injury!

Use a speculum under the observation of a vet, so they can SHOW you how to use these tools properly, and make the entire process of force feeding/assist feeding easier on the animals. PLEASE.

http://img.auctiva.com/imgdata/9/9/5...3711252_tp.jpg

Hows the little guy doing, is he eating and shedding or did you have to put him down?

Agreed, speculum sets are sold by places like Big Apple Herp and The Bean Farm. I picked one up ages ago for administering worming meds (I have some WC garters, and a new albino I acquired a couple years ago turned up with pinworm, so lots of panacur going on, lol).

However, I have found it easier when assist-feeding the stubborn starters to just use the tip of the pinky-rat's nose to gently open the mouth. If you're force or tube-feeding the speculum would be the best choice.

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Originally Posted by WingedWolfPsion

However, I have found it easier when assist-feeding the stubborn starters to just use the tip of the pinky-rat's nose to gently open the mouth. If you're force or tube-feeding the speculum would be the best choice.

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I agree. For assist feeding, a speculum is not really necessary in my opinion. I've had to do quite a bit of assist feeding in the past and using the prey item to open the mouth works great for me.

I think you are much better off assist feeding a day old rat pink than tubing him every time. If you do it right there is no way for him not to eat the pink and it would give him a much better meal than that mix. Assist feeding seems to get them to figure out eating on their own as well. I have never had to assist feed more than twice.

I agree though. Assuming he eventually eats on his own I wouldn't put him down if he can pass stool. I have seen some pretty horribly kinked snakes do fine. Ralph has a video on youtube of a few of his caramels that look really bad.

YouTube - Kinked Caramel Albinos

Is he gaining weight at all with this method of feeding?

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Originally Posted by Jay_Bunny

Is he gaining weight at all with this method of feeding?

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i have since forced a pinkie and now he is killing on his own. so he is getting stronger every day.

Glad to hear he's figuring it out