First bp.

So I finally got around to getting my first bp after years of wanting one. I did a lot of research on them already and just wanted to check in with you guys. I was referred here from a different site. I have it in a 30 gallon tank with aspen shavings for substrate. I have an under the tank heater on one side that I seriously need to get a thermostat for as it only is cranking it just above 80 degrees. Now this is the rough part. I would like to get it to eat frozen and not live now. If it gets too complicated and seems like it will only eat live then I will move over to that, but after having pet rats/mice years ago I will admit to having a soft spot for them. Any advice on that would be much appreciated. Other than that does my cage sound alright? I have a hide on the coolside at the moment and will be getting another very soon. As is he doesn't care too much about the hide and would rather chill in the heated side of the cage.

How big is your snake? Your tank may be a bit too large if you've got a hatchling or jouvenile.

If your UTH is only taking your warm side temp up to 80 degrees, you should move your hide over there. I doubt your BP will ever really move to the cool side of the enclosure, and your BP needs a place to feel secure.

If your BP still doesn't use the hide, he/she may not like the hide. You need one that is just big enough for your BP to fit its entire body in plus a small amount of room to grow. Be sure there is only one entrance to the hide. Many BPs will not use a hide with more than one entrance.

Once you are sure your BP will use the hide, your next hide should be an identicle one on the opposite side of the tank.

A thermostat will be needed for your UTH. Get one ASAP. Your temps are too low and can result in a sick BP.

Feeding frozen/thawed food is easy if your snake will accept it. I'm lucky and have a snake that will eat anything. All I do is put my frozen food in a ziplock bag and sit it in a container of warm water until it is warm.
Make sure it is entirely thawed and push on the belly a little bit to see if there are any frozen spots left inside.
Next, I remove my hides and waterbowl too from the enclosure and and put in my thawed meal. I ust drop mine right in and Indy(my BP) goes right for it and eats no problem.
You however may have to use a paid of long tweezers to move it and trigger a feeding response.


thawed food you can leave in the cage over night, however I wouldn't recommend it. Leave it there for 15 - 20 minutes and take it back out if it is uneaten and stick it back in the freezer. I would only try to feed the same meal twice before you throw it away.

I hope this helps.

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Originally Posted by Elleken

So I finally got around to getting my first bp after years of wanting one. I did a lot of research on them already and just wanted to check in with you guys. I was referred here from a different site. I have it in a 30 gallon tank with aspen shavings for substrate. I have an under the tank heater on one side that I seriously need to get a thermostat for as it only is cranking it just above 80 degrees. Now this is the rough part. I would like to get it to eat frozen and not live now. If it gets too complicated and seems like it will only eat live then I will move over to that, but after having pet rats/mice years ago I will admit to having a soft spot for them. Any advice on that would be much appreciated. Other than that does my cage sound alright? I have a hide on the coolside at the moment and will be getting another very soon. As is he doesn't care too much about the hide and would rather chill in the heated side of the cage.

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How old is your BP? If your BP is a baby or juvenile the cage is just right. Adults will need a 40-55 gallon, 40 is the minimum size for an adult. The Aspen is just fine, I actually recommend that substrate for this species because it's safe to use and easy to spot clean.

Now for your UTH, you will need a thermostat right away because it is too cold in your enclosure if 80F is what the temp is on the warm side of the enclosure. Without proper heating, your BP could get RI (respiratory infection) from not having the correct body temperatures since snakes are cold-blooded. If they are too cold that lowers their immune system allowing the snake to become ill.

I had one of my King snakes switch from live to f/t and I had no problem with it. Feed the snake a mouse/rat about the same size as the middle part of the snake's body. When you thaw out the mice, put the mice in a container of really hot water and it should thaw within 5-10 minutes. Dry off the mouse, and then try wiggling it in front of your snake with tongs. Tongs are always best to use when feeding a snake so you do not have to use your hands which can also cause a bite since your hand is warmer than the food item.

One last thing, your hide should be on the warm side for now. BPs don't spend too much time on the cool end of their enclosure, so keep the hide on the warm side for now so the snake can get somewhat warm. When you purchase the other hide, make sure it looks exactly like the other hide you are using. You didn't mention a water dish, but I'm assuming you have one because it's very important and hard not to forget to have in your enclosure. Make sure you clean out the water dish daily ot every other day so the snake has fresh drinking water.

:welcome:

As far as him staying on the warm side, he seems to be giving up security for heat, get an identical hide for the both sides, until then move the hide to the warm side

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Originally Posted by BallPythonLOVER

How old is your BP? If your BP is a baby or juvenile the cage is just right. Adults will need a 40-55 gallon, 40 is the minimum size for an adult. The Aspen is just fine, I actually recommend that substrate for this species because it's safe to use and easy to spot clean.

Now for your UTH, you will need a thermostat right away because it is too cold in your enclosure if 80F is what the temp is on the warm side of the enclosure. Without proper heating, your BP could get RI (respiratory infection) from not having the correct body temperatures since snakes are cold-blooded. If they are too cold that lowers their immune system allowing the snake to become ill.

I had one of my King snakes switch from live to f/t and I had no problem with it. Feed the snake a mouse/rat about the same size as the middle part of the snake's body. When you thaw out the mice, put the mice in a container of really hot water and it should thaw within 5-10 minutes. Dry off the mouse, and then try wiggling it in front of your snake with tongs. Tongs are always best to use when feeding a snake so you do not have to use your hands which can also cause a bite since your hand is warmer than the food item.

One last thing, your hide should be on the warm side for now. BPs don't spend too much time on the cool end of their enclosure, so keep the hide on the warm side for now so the snake can get somewhat warm. When you purchase the other hide, make sure it looks exactly like the other hide you are using. You didn't mention a water dish, but I'm assuming you have one because it's very important and hard not to forget to have in your enclosure. Make sure you clean out the water dish daily ot every other day so the snake has fresh drinking water.

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Okay now. I see you posting quite a bit of advice on this forum as of lately and I think you need a bit of a reality check. Some of your advice is very good, most of it is not though. PLEASE know what you are talking about before you give people advice on caring for these lovely creatures.


OP: I would say a 30g is way to big for a hatchling. All that space is pretty overwhelming for something so small that has to constantly be worried about getting eaten by something. If you can, get him in a 10g. A 30g is good for a huge adult female. A 20g is good for an adult male.

Sounds like you don't have the right kind of thermometers. A UTH will actually heat up to about 115*F. A digital thermometer with a probe is what you need. Then put the probe right on the glass on the inside of the tank where the UTH is. You still need a thermostat.

Def. Get two identical hides. They need to be able to thermo regulate between the hot and cool side.

A picture would help us out so we can tell you exactly what you need. :)

Also, WELCOME!!

Thanks everyone. I will measure the tank out and the bp asap. I can't take any pictures as the digital camera isn't here right now nor is the card reader. Possibly could use the girlfriends phone, but the quality would be horrible. As far as the uth goes I have a regular thermometer right above it against the glass. I've even felt the substrate and it really isn't too warm there. I'm making a trip into town (20-30 minute drive) so I can pick up some more stuff for it there. Thanks again everyone.

Ya, That tank is HUGE if all you got is a hatching. I have all my hatchings in like, 6 QT rubbermaid containers. If you can't get a smaller cage you best bet is to put a bunch of little newspaper balls or other things to make the cage more like a jungle gym so your ball has tons and tons of spaces to hide under and by, otherwise getting him/her to eat will be a huge problem. Other than that good luck and welcome to a very, very addicting hobby.

Haha, I've already got caught in the tarantula hobby. Both of these are very addicting. The cage is 30"-19"-12". I don't think he is a hatchling though it is definitely a juvenile. I'd measure it, but at the moment I believe it may be eating. I put a frozen feeder in a box with a hole in it and it decided to venture in.

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Originally Posted by Kaorte

Okay now. I see you posting quite a bit of advice on this forum as of lately and I think you need a bit of a reality check. Some of your advice is very good, most of it is not though. PLEASE know what you are talking about before you give people advice on caring for these lovely creatures.


OP: I would say a 30g is way to big for a hatchling. All that space is pretty overwhelming for something so small that has to constantly be worried about getting eaten by something. If you can, get him in a 10g. A 30g is good for a huge adult female. A 20g is good for an adult male.

Sounds like you don't have the right kind of thermometers. A UTH will actually heat up to about 115*F. A digital thermometer with a probe is what you need. Then put the probe right on the glass on the inside of the tank where the UTH is. You still need a thermostat.

Def. Get two identical hides. They need to be able to thermo regulate between the hot and cool side.

A picture would help us out so we can tell you exactly what you need. :)

Also, WELCOME!!

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Isnt it great how people can ride up on a horse and start bashing otheir peoples opinions? lol. I have a juvinial in a 50gal tank thats evenly cluttered with two identical hides, one on the warm side the otheir on the cool...a log hide in the middle , two water dishes one on each side and fake plants around the back and sides and he absolutley loves it.

It would help if we knew exactly how old/big the snake is. If its a hatchling ( just afew months old) a large open area would be wayyyyyyy too stressful, however thats not hard to fix, just clutter that place up .


One important factor I have learned from BP.net is that every Ball has a diffrent personnality....their are general facts on what they may or may not like but the best way to learn more about your snake and its needs is to watch it and get to know its body language. You know your snake more then anyone else here.

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Originally Posted by Derrick13

Isnt it great how people can ride up on a horse and start bashing otheir peoples opinions? lol. I have a juvinial in a 50gal tank thats evenly cluttered with two identical hides, one on the warm side the otheir on the cool...a log hide in the middle , two water dishes one on each side and fake plants around the back and sides and he absolutley loves it.

It would help if we knew exactly how old/big the snake is. If its a hatchling ( just afew months old) a large open area would be wayyyyyyy too stressful, however thats not hard to fix, just clutter that place up .


One important factor I have learned from BP.net is that every Ball has a diffrent personnality....their are general facts on what they may or may not like but the best way to learn more about your snake and its needs is to watch it and get to know its body language. You know your snake more then anyone else here.

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I don't really know how you determine how much your snake "loves" what he lives in. Probably because you can't.

I am giving the OP advice based on what has worked for the majority of people. The information that ballpythonLOVER gave was incorrect. a 40g is NOT the minimum for a BP. And it is surely not the maximum either.

Can you house them differently? Yes. I am not saying its my way or the highway. But saying that this is the minimum or this is the maximum is incorrect.

All of the information I give out is based on what I have learned and what other experienced members have taught me. I like to give people the easiest solutions for their problems. A 50g tank is not an easy solution. It never is.

The snake is about 14-15".

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Originally Posted by Kaorte

I don't really know how you determine how much your snake "loves" what he lives in. Probably because you can't.

I am giving the OP advice based on what has worked for the majority of people. The information that ballpythonLOVER gave was incorrect. a 40g is NOT the minimum for a BP. And it is surely not the maximum either.

Can you house them differently? Yes. I am not saying its my way or the highway. But saying that this is the minimum or this is the maximum is incorrect.

All of the information I give out is based on what I have learned and what other experienced members have taught me. I like to give people the easiest solutions for their problems. A 50g tank is not an easy solution. It never is.

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Yea saying max and min is definitley incorrect. Sorry bout the personification, its the easiest way to explain that my bp is showing no signs of stress, feeding every week and can tolirate handling. I even personnally feel that BP's and most reptiles in general can only experince basic and primal "emotions" even if they can be called that....however their is a diffrent post for this some where....anyway I used the world love becuse it was the easiest way for me to get the message across..often the world love can be interchanged with like or perfer..I'm not a proper, scientific unimaginative and cold person, not implying that you are, just stating that I dont only see in black and white. Two diffrent people can learn two very diffrent things from the same experince...just trying to say no way is superior exept for obvious things.

And I did not mean that the 50 gal was the solution, but that the cluttering, decorating was.

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Originally Posted by Elleken

The snake is about 14-15".

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Yeah, you just have a hatchling on your hands and a large tank like that will last it up until it is an adult. However, a large tank at a young age isn't the best solution for you or the snake. Personally I think a 20g tank is great until the snake is 2 1/2 - 3 feet long.

The bigger the tank, the more difficult it gets to keep your heat and humidity correct. You also spend more time and money on cleaning and decorating. A larger tank means more bedding, more decorations you need to clutter up the space and more engergy required to heat that space. Your snake's enclosure should almost seem cramped. This is where they feel most at home.

Would things like cardboard tubes and stuff like that work for clutter? I mean cheap yea, but could they be used?

Eh not really. They tend to absorb moisture from the air making it harder to maintain humidity. You could go to the dollar store and get some fake plants for clutter :)

Alrighty, I just didn't know if they needed something to hide under or just around. I'll post a picture of the set up as soon as I get my camera together.

Well I got some pictures of the little one.

http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m...s/IMG_6745.jpg

http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m...s/IMG_6746.jpg

http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m...s/IMG_6748.jpg

http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m...s/IMG_6749.jpg

http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m...s/IMG_6751.jpg

Cool looking little dude. Looks like he has a lot of yellow.

As far as thermostats go... it wont make your UTH go hotter. If you feel it isn't hot enough get a digital probe thermometer. It might be hotter than you think!

Aw what a cute little worm!

:)

pic of set up?

Got a few pictures of the set up here we go. At this size would it be alright to feed it rat pups?

http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m...s/IMG_6752.jpg

http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m...s/IMG_6753.jpg

As long as the rat pups you get aren't thicker than the thickest section of your snake then he should be fine to take them.

Those hides are too big. You want something that your snake can curl up in a ball and be touching on 3 sides. I just recently tried to increase the size of my snakes hides because she was lifting them up when she got in a high coil, and she didn't like them one bit. I would try to find something much smaller, like not much bigger than the water bowl you have now. In fact you are going to have a hard time keeping your temperatures up so you might try two hides about the size of the water bowl and a bowl about the size of one current hide.

Yeah just make sure the rat pup is as big around as your snake.

nice pics, as it was already stated, the hides are a bit larger than normal. also, to make ur bp feel more secure, cover 3 of the sides. i used black paper o.O, and it seemed to work fine, but theres also alternatives :gj:

u will soon find that keeping teh humidity and temps correct in the glass tank is a very difficult job, doesnt look like u hav a heat lamp which is a great start. i wasted money on red bulbs / heat lamps which only damaged the ambient temps and humidity, and caused not only ME stress, but my bp (went off feed). took that off, and things got better (good shed, calm, etc...)

but yes, security + hide sizes + maybe a little more foliage (bc of 30g tank) + and GL with the transition from live to frozen :gj:. i cant offer advice with that bc i havent even solved my own problem. i love mice and rats too =p

Yea, I'm going to give him some more time and try a frozen rat pup. If it comes down to it I will buy live feeders. I'm starting to become ok with it. Just need to realize its to satisfy my snakes needs. Is it ok to mist the cage with aspen for bedding?

u can, just monitor the corners and sides of the enclosure. u dont want to build mold or bacteria on the sides. i mist my tubs, but they're on paper towels as substrate so its nice and humid. careful misting =p


Edit: also, forgot about the wooden logs, careful if ur misting those too, nice home for bacteria is an old dead wooden log

Will a stressed ball eat or do they usually refuse food if too stressed?

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Originally Posted by Elleken

Will a stressed ball eat or do they usually refuse food if too stressed?

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Usually, yes. Although I have heard of over active snakes eating as well.

I fed mine for the first time. I had tried a few times with frozen rat pups but it didn't take so I tried with a live mouse. I was there the whole time and it had struck at it once and missed then retreated to a hide. I decided to pick up the mouse by the tail (with tongs) and held it against the glass and it came out and got it faster than I expected. Was interesting to see my snake feed for the first time.