Maternal Incubation Vs. Incubator. Your Views?

What are your views? Would you consider switching over to see the results? Have you dont both and are you continuing to do both? Would you say It's fine to do either or? As my first clutch, Im considering doing maternal incubation. What would be needed for it and what are the chances of the hatchlings coming out exactly the same way they would in the incubator? Let me know your views and opinions please.

Both can been done, you just have a better control when using an incubator, also I personally rather put my female back on feed soon as possible rather then have to wait an additional 60 days.

To me it is a personal preference after you see a female right after she played her eggs you will understand why I chose artificial incubation.

I agree. They are so underweight & mine were all starving after they laid their clutches & I cleaned up. They all ate w/i a week. I can't imagine not feeding them for an additional 50+ days. According to the Barkers, females in the wild sometimes leave their eggs to go feed, but I don't know if a snake in captivity would feed while incubating.

I'm considering MI if I breed my carpet python. We'll see though, I have quite a while before I have to make that decision.

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Originally Posted by MuzeBallPythons

I agree. They are so underweight & mine were all starving after they laid their clutches & I cleaned up. They all ate w/i a week. I can't imagine not feeding them for an additional 50+ days. According to the Barkers, females in the wild sometimes leave their eggs to go feed, but I don't know if a snake in captivity would feed while incubating.

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If i do MI would I be able to offer food? And if i do, What are the chances she eats it? So in the wild they will eat, So If they eat in the wild and are ok.. Will she eat and if so will she still stay wrapped around the eggs? I know its a high chance she wont eat.. but if she does.. will she still protect the eggs? & When they begin to pip do i remove mom or leave her in there the entire process?

I can imagine that if you tried to feed a mother during maternal incubation - you'd also be dealing with the mom having bowel movements. To me the only thing worse than eggs being saturated with water would eggs being saturated with urine. Then what? You have to remove the eggs to clean the cage, and reset everything again?

Maternal incubation in captivity just seems unnecessary to me.

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Originally Posted by elevatethis

I can imagine that if you tried to feed a mother during maternal incubation - you'd also be dealing with the mom having bowel movements. To me the only thing worse than eggs being saturated with water would eggs being saturated with urine. Then what? You have to remove the eggs to clean the cage, and reset everything again?

Maternal incubation in captivity just seems unnecessary to me.

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ur lazy lol . I wouldnt mind hcanging everythin and taking a nice bite for the team :)

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Originally Posted by elevatethis

I can imagine that if you tried to feed a mother during maternal incubation - you'd also be dealing with the mom having bowel movements. To me the only thing worse than eggs being saturated with water would eggs being saturated with urine. Then what? You have to remove the eggs to clean the cage, and reset everything again?

Maternal incubation in captivity just seems unnecessary to me.

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Be careful with all that cleaning. Female snakes that are incubating eggs, will sometimes pass fluid into their coils to help raise the humidity if it starts t get too low. These animals have over time (i.e. millions of years) become very adept at altering humidity and temperature. You will see them tighten their coils, and sometimes loosen there coild in an attempt to regulate temps as well.

Hope that helps,

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Originally Posted by elevatethis

I can imagine that if you tried to feed a mother during maternal incubation - you'd also be dealing with the mom having bowel movements. To me the only thing worse than eggs being saturated with water would eggs being saturated with urine. Then what? You have to remove the eggs to clean the cage, and reset everything again?

Maternal incubation in captivity just seems unnecessary to me.

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Good point. The clutch could be ruined.

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Originally Posted by xXxFluffyEmoxXx

If i do MI would I be able to offer food? And if i do, What are the chances she eats it? So in the wild they will eat, So If they eat in the wild and are ok.. Will she eat and if so will she still stay wrapped around the eggs? I know its a high chance she wont eat.. but if she does.. will she still protect the eggs? & When they begin to pip do i remove mom or leave her in there the entire process?

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Honestly, I do not know of anyone feeding their females while MI. I'm not saying it hasn't been done, but I don't know about it.

As for when to remove the female, I know there are older threads on here about MI which I think go into detail about all that (except feeding while incubating).

I maternally incubated last year, and everything went very well. I had 6 eggs, and ended up with 6 hatchlings.

The only thing I did was after she laid I realized that the humidity seemed too low for incubation (it was OK for every day husbandry). So I changed her bedding to cypress mulch instead of aspen, and I would mist it a couple of times a week to maintain humidity.

As others have said, they've evolved to do it this way. A healthy female can do maternal incubation just fine.

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Originally Posted by elevatethis

Maternal incubation in captivity just seems unnecessary to me.

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Just playing devil's advocate, but really, artificial incubation would be equally unnecessary as they do it just fine on their own.

I think both methods work, and both can be used with equal success.

One thing no one has touched on yet:

The enjoyment I get out of reptiles is all from getting to experience the life and habits and behaviors of these incredible animals firsthand, in my home.

I want to experience maternal incubation. Artificial incubation is just that, artificial. There's something 1000% more satisfying to me having MY snake be bred, lay her eggs, and incubate them, than having some machinery take over for her.

This isn't to say that I don't appreciate incubators, nor am I saying I never want to use incubators. There is quite a good deal of security you get when using incubators, and much more control over humidity and temperatures.

I feel like someone who breeds reptiles and never tries out maternal incubation at least once is missing out on an incredible experience.

For me, it's not as much about as producing as many viable eggs as possible, it's about the animals themselves.

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Originally Posted by xXxFluffyEmoxXx

If i do MI would I be able to offer food? And if i do, What are the chances she eats it? So in the wild they will eat, So If they eat in the wild and are ok.. Will she eat and if so will she still stay wrapped around the eggs? I know its a high chance she wont eat.. but if she does.. will she still protect the eggs? & When they begin to pip do i remove mom or leave her in there the entire process?

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Where is your source that says in the wild they leave their eggs to hunt?

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Originally Posted by xXxFluffyEmoxXx

ur lazy lol . I wouldnt mind hcanging everythin and taking a nice bite for the team :)

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I don't think the point was that anyone is "lazy". How a breeder decides to deal with incubation of eggs is their business. As long as they are doing it responsibly and understanding the process and getting a good result, then in my opinion it's all good.

Disturbing a female snake while she's on her eggs isn't a good thing. Disturbing them even during the process of breeding isn't a good thing and often enclosures do get a bit nasty while pairs are in together. That's not about being too lazy to clean, it's about not disturbing a process or removing scents that the snakes need to key on to certain activities.

I am a year away from having this same problem. I think of this often and Thank You to whom ever started this post. As of now due to limited space, I feel that I may MI on the first clutches. I do not feel that there is a right or wrong way, Just a choice. I do feel if I choose to MI, I will not feed and will keep a close eye on humidity as an assist to the Mother. Glad to hear that others have and do MI. Please keep these great subjects coming for us less skilled owners. PEACE:gj:

I'm a control freak I don't think I'd ever do it, plus I wanna get my females nice fat and healthy again like others have posted I think its an unnecessary risk.

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Originally Posted by Emilio

I'm a control freak I don't think I'd ever do it, plus I wanna get my females nice fat and healthy again like others have posted I think its an unnecessary risk.

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But you do realize that they do it in the wild right? And ball python population THRIVES!.. A lot of them that we have here in the states where once imports..so once again. If they can do it in the wild and be fine.. have the same hatch rates and you can leave the mother with the eggs..why not do it? i am talking from a small owners point of view anyway

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Originally Posted by zombieon3rd

I am a year away from having this same problem. I think of this often and Thank You to whom ever started this post. As of now due to limited space, I feel that I may MI on the first clutches. I do not feel that there is a right or wrong way, Just a choice. I do feel if I choose to MI, I will not feed and will keep a close eye on humidity as an assist to the Mother. Glad to hear that others have and do MI. Please keep these great subjects coming for us less skilled owners. PEACE:gj:

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Your welcome dude. thought it would be good info for us small owners. I have decided i will MI my first clutch and see if all goes well.

Thank you all for your replies :)

You do realize that our captive snakes are fat and lazy compared to wild snakes. Who's to say that the lifestyle we impose on our snakes does not affect their build, stamina and ability to 100% of the time come out of maternal incubation no worse for wear?

It's true females are often completely able to go off feed for those 60 days, however, there is the other side of the coin where people want to provide a steady environment for the eggs, and get their females back on feed as soon as possible.

What ever you choose, think about the snakes NEEDS first, and your WANTS second.

This is my first year breeding pythons and I'm letting my ball maternally incubate. I gave her a humid laybox several weeks before she was due to lay. She laid her clutch on May 30th and has been in the laybox with her clutch for over a month and I haven't had any problems. A local pet store owner said that they would come off their eggs to feed from time to time. I did offer food to mine once but she had no interest whatsoever. I've only seen her leave her eggs once and that was just to leave the box for some water.

Both methods have the potential for success and failure. Artificial incubators can short out or overheat, some snakes just don't make very good mothers, and controllable/uncontrollable environmental factors can always influence the outcomes. So long as you do your research beforehand and have a network of other experienced keepers to call on when you're not sure what's going on or what you should/shouldn't do I think you're okay with which ever method you choose.

My only worry here is of issues that could go wrong..Like the mom turning the eggs over, or her even abandoning them or not giving them enough heat, or giving them too much heat..overall I would just rather incubate the eggs this way at least I know I have control and keep a better eye on their temp and humidity settings..but it's all based on personal preference..

You should have a incubator set up and ready to use if needed...I have definitely heard of females that won't incubate eggs.

Maternal incubation isn't for me or my snakes. Like some others have said, why would I do it when I can artificially incubate the eggs and get the girl back on food? She has already gone months without. I personally don't see the point and never have. We have already created an artificial habit for our snakes, so the viewpoint of them incubating eggs like in the wild doesn't seem to hold water. Just my opinion...

I want more answers lol :)

Someones opinion is just an opinion, here in this post are some results.

http://www.ball-pythons.net/forums/s...ad.php?t=95885