Clyde feeding

http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/j...Picture168.jpg
http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/j...Picture169.jpg
http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/j...Picture166.jpg

Wow, he's quite the aerobatic eater!!!

Interesting pics ;)

Are you holding him while he is feeding? Or is he hanging from something?

Very interesting :rolleyes:

Looks like Clyde is part Bat....lawl:)

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Originally Posted by STORMS

Interesting pics ;)

Are you holding him while he is feeding? Or is he hanging from something?

Very interesting :rolleyes:

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Yes, I wonder also.

guys, I'm pretty sure it's the angle...that's the bottom of his bin...right? he's normal, not hanging.

hes actually dangling from a bar on a computer desk. he does kinda remind me of a bat :) and that bin isnt his thats gonna be for another snake that my boyfriend wants to get he was just setting that up and testing it out. clyde stays in a tank.

First it's the floor, then it's DANGLING FROM A BAR?!

Look, these snakes are NOT green tree pythons! They're not meant for hanging on by their tails. This snake could've seriously hurt itself.

IMO you should be more responsible.

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Originally Posted by BanditNClyde

hes actually dangling from a bar on a computer desk.

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WTFO??? Don't you know that your Ball Python is not an Amazon Tree Boa???


Do you not understand that BPs don't have a prehensile tail that would allow them to eat like that safely?

Do you not understand that your BP will fall doing that...maybe not next time, or the time after that, but it will fall. Make book on it.

Do you not understand that when it falls it can hurt it's self to include broken ribs or internal injuries?

Do you not understand that if it falls while eating and gets startled that it could go on an extended fast?

I understand you feed outside the tank, we've been over that, and if thats the way you feed, fine, but this borders on neglect and mishandling.

Please take some responsiblity...not the kind where you think you know what's best for your BP, but the kind where you really do what's best for your BP.

And everyone jumped on my back for criticizing her herp skills in that last post... I told you! :D

BanditNClyde you need to seriously read a book (nix that... several) about taking care of BALL PYTHONS.

How is that snake not falling? i have to watch mine very closely when i have her out. I catch her trying to fall off my arm all the time. She's a lot smaller though. Maybe she'll get better coordination as she gets older. I still get worried when she's climbing around. I even lowered the branches in her cage. lol.

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Originally Posted by BanditNClyde

hes actually dangling from a bar on a computer desk. he does kinda remind me of a bat :)

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WOW! Just WOW! :disbelief

Lol, neat feeding pics :)

Cool pics!

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Originally Posted by stratus_020202

How is that snake not falling? i have to watch mine very closely when i have her out. I catch her trying to fall off my arm all the time. She's a lot smaller though. Maybe she'll get better coordination as she gets older. I still get worried when she's climbing around. I even lowered the branches in her cage. lol.

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he LOVES to climb on stuff when he has the chance. he likes to dangle off of things too. i wish i got a picture but he was trying to climb up the cabinet area below one of the other tanks. he was holding himself up by this tail and was perfectly vertical :) my other ball bandit loves to climb on things as well and grips sooo freaking tight. i guess i got some climbers!

I've had some of my snakes come right out of the tub and strike & coil...half their body dangling out while they're constricting.... he's not gonna fall...he has a pretty damn good grip from what I can feel.

...Lets not make a mountain mmk?

Wow, people. This is sad.
Must you all attack her? Yes, its not exactly safe for the snake, but that is all you need to say. A simple, "Your snake can be seriously injured this way. Please consider being more responsible" would suffice.

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Originally Posted by demonicchild

Wow, people. This is sad.
Must you all attack her? Yes, its not exactly safe for the snake, but that is all you need to say. A simple, "Your snake can be seriously injured this way. Please consider being more responsible" would suffice.

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I agree with this 100%. I'm afraid some of these sorts of threads are starting to make BP.net look like any other forum out there....with a bunch of cliquish know-it-alls who beat people over the head with their superior knowledge and experience....rather than trying to be a little nice and actually HELPING someone.

A simple post of "There are risks involved in feeding that way...here's what could happen" will get the point across VERY well without making the member put up defensive walls that keep them from learning anything.

No one here is "better" than anyone else...I don't care how much experience or knowledge you have. We've ALL made mistakes and we were ALL new at this at some point or another and we're ALL still learning. At least, those with an ounce of wisdom in their brains are still learning and growing. Those who think they know all they need to know and will never make a mistake in animal husbandry...well, I just hope when the day comes you need a bit of compassionate schooling, you get it.

thank you all for those who are backing me up. i know it wasnt the best way of feeding but i failed to mention which was my fault that i couldnt get him off it. he kept gripping tighter and tighter everytime i tried to get him and he needed to eat and i didnt want to stress him too much so that seemed at that moment the best thing to do. he struck it and coiled right up while hanging. he had a good portion of his tail and back side supporting him too. im not saying it was the best thing to do but at the moment it seemed like the best idea. as soon as he ate he climbed back up and then crawled down and then put him back in his tank and then he went to sleep. i respect everyones opinions but if youre trying to get a point across you dont have to be so rude about it :colbert: there is a better way of going about things

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Originally Posted by JLC

I agree with this 100%. I'm afraid some of these sorts of threads are starting to make BP.net look like any other forum out there....with a bunch of cliquish know-it-alls who beat people over the head with their superior knowledge and experience....rather than trying to be a little nice and actually HELPING someone.

A simple post of "There are risks involved in feeding that way...here's what could happen" will get the point across VERY well without making the member put up defensive walls that keep them from learning anything.

No one here is "better" than anyone else...I don't care how much experience or knowledge you have. We've ALL made mistakes and we were ALL new at this at some point or another and we're ALL still learning. At least, those with an ounce of wisdom in their brains are still learning and growing. Those who think they know all they need to know and will never make a mistake in animal husbandry...well, I just hope when the day comes you need a bit of compassionate schooling, you get it.

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Thank you.
And BanditNClyde, it is very mature of you to handle all this without fighting back.

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Originally Posted by demonicchild

Thank you.
And BanditNClyde, it is very mature of you to handle all this without fighting back.

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why thank you. i figure whats the point of arguing when its not gonna get you anywhere. everyone has their own opinions some you may like others you may not but all you can do is take it with a grain of salt and move onl. :)

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Originally Posted by BanditNClyde

why thank you. i figure whats the point of arguing when its not gonna get you anywhere. everyone has their own opinions some you may like others you may not but all you can do is take it with a grain of salt and move onl. :)

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That's a great attitude. :banana:

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Originally Posted by demonicchild

That's a great attitude. :banana:

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why thank you! :D

One thing you can do, is if you go get a situation where your snake is in a potentially dangerous position, is to bring the tub to him. Just raise something up under him so he does not fall.

I have some hatchlings that have such strong feed responses they are out of the tub as soon as I crack it. Which leaves them dangling and constricting. But they are a nice knot of muscles and they tend to be wedged onto the side of the tub quite firmly.

I try and untangle them and support the body so it does not fall (from the tail up is the best way to get a snake to loosen its grip) and place them back in the tub gently.

And if that does not work, I just place the tub on the floor till they relax on their own then I gently schooch them back in.

Bruce

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Originally Posted by Bruce Whitehead

One thing you can do, is if you go get a situation where your snake is in a potentially dangerous position, is to bring the tub to him. Just raise something up under him so he does not fall.

I have some hatchlings that have such strong feed responses they are out of the tub as soon as I crack it. Which leaves them dangling and constricting. But they are a nice knot of muscles and they tend to be wedged onto the side of the tub quite firmly.

I try and untangle them and support the body so it does not fall (from the tail up is the best way to get a snake to loosen its grip) and place them back in the tub gently.

And if that does not work, I just place the tub on the floor till they relax on their own then I gently schooch them back in.

Bruce

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thanks for the advice. hopefully that never happen again but if it does then ill do that :D

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Originally Posted by BanditNClyde

thanks for the advice. hopefully that never happen again but if it does then ill do that :D

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It is a learning curve. We all started with one snake at one time... :D

you are very right. thanks for being so kind :)

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Originally Posted by Nate

I've had some of my snakes come right out of the tub and strike & coil...half their body dangling out while they're constricting.... he's not gonna fall...he has a pretty damn good grip from what I can feel.

...Lets not make a mountain mmk?

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Originally Posted by JLC

I agree with this 100%. I'm afraid some of these sorts of threads are starting to make BP.net look like any other forum out there....with a bunch of cliquish know-it-alls who beat people over the head with their superior knowledge and experience....rather than trying to be a little nice and actually HELPING someone.

A simple post of "There are risks involved in feeding that way...here's what could happen" will get the point across VERY well without making the member put up defensive walls that keep them from learning anything.

No one here is "better" than anyone else...I don't care how much experience or knowledge you have. We've ALL made mistakes and we were ALL new at this at some point or another and we're ALL still learning. At least, those with an ounce of wisdom in their brains are still learning and growing. Those who think they know all they need to know and will never make a mistake in animal husbandry...well, I just hope when the day comes you need a bit of compassionate schooling, you get it.

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Judy, Nate, Members of BP.net,

I step out on a limb to post this, but I will endevor to be respectfull of the staff and members.

I know I have a reputation for being somewhat harsh when I see something I personally do not agree with on this forum. If anyone has been agrieved, I appologize. But, this is not a case of arguing over feeding in or out of an enclosure. It is not a case of arguing over if the cool side should be 78 degrees or 82 degrees.

This is a case of what I concider borderline animal mistreatment. I'll admit that I have no way of predicting if her BP will fall in the future, just as I have no way of predicting any injuries that might result from that fall, but I do know that it's not worth the risk. Risk management is about making informed choices. I have no way of knowing if the OP knows the risks involved in letting her BP hang off things, especially while feeding, so I asked the questions I asked to provoke thought on her part. I would like to point out that the OP has a history of letting people here know "I'll take care of my BP my way, and you can take care of yours your way". Not exactly an accommodating attitude. I shot a strong wake up call her direction, mindfull of her inability to accept a simple post of "There are risks involved...here's what could happen".

I only know one way to point out wrong. Painting it with any other brush risks misunderstanding. Choices are debateable, wrong is not.

I do not want to see BP.net become a place where the wolves run in a pack, if you know what I mean, but I also don't want to let possibly injurious practices slide without strong admonishment. For as long as I am allowed the privilege of being a member of this Forum and community, my interest will always lie more with the well being of the snakes, than the wants of the keepers.

Thank you all for your time.

Tom

Slim, I agree with you. To me this wasn't a matter of bashing on the OP or telling her she's just doing it wrong. Fact of the matter is, these snakes are NOT arboreal and when given the choice, they will not feed dangling from a bar.

I know all of you have seen a BPs tail: they're extremely short. Arboreal snakes have much longer, and MUCH stronger tails. They are just not made to feed in this manner.

I didn't mean to offend anyone either. Just pointing out that, in my opinion, this feeding method is just plain *wrong*.

Thanks,

Hey guys, I'm with Slim on this one. It is borderline animal mistreatment.

Heres where I think the OP went wrong:

1. Its okay to feed outside of the cage. But it is best if its done in a container, with a hide or some sense of security. Computer desk is pretty far from ideal.

2. Ball Pythons are ground dwelling animals. Just because they can hang, does not mean its good for them or that they should. There is little or no truth to say that they "love climbing all over things."

3. It could not have been "what seems to be the best thing to do at the time" to feed it. Even if it was extremely hungry, waiting 10 minutes for it to come out of the dangle would have been okay. It was most likely hanging on so tight because it was scared of falling.

Good points guys and I do understand your passion to help this particular member take the best care of possible for that snake. Just please remember that sometimes the best way to teach someone is to speak in a language they will understand. That's not to say we need to be wishy washy or spoon feed our less experienced members but sometimes it's just a matter of being a tad less judgemental or harsh in our approach.

As for the newer members with very little experience, please remember that creature you chose to put in an enclosure in your home is 100% relying on you to make the right decisions for it. You will mess up, we all have messed up but if you let your ego get in the way of learning how to avoid messing up again, well you do your snake a real disservice.

I personally love this sticky.... :)

http://www.ball-pythons.net/forums/s...ad.php?t=62494

Slim while you often make good point sometimes your way to deliver the message is just atrocious.

I understand correcting someone and I know you do because so you have the well being of an animal at heart however do you think that your way to deliver the message is getting you anywhere beside looking like the leader of a wolf pack?

Don’t you think a softer approach might go a long way? This goes for you as well as the others who have posted so far and whom I would like to remind that they were newbies themselves not that long ago (some still being newbies in my opinion). Are some of you SO perfect that you never made a mistake? :rolleyes:

Do some of you need some of your own medicine so you get a better understanding on how it feels to be on the other side?

How would you feel if next time you ask a question that might seems obvious to some, and people start ganging up on you the way you are doing it here?

I think the OP understands that the excitement of those new additions as well as the excitement of those first successful meals might have make her overlook potential dangers, and I am sure she will be more cautious in the future providing a safe environment during feeding whether it is inside or outside the enclosure.

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Originally Posted by Deborah

Slim while you often make good point sometimes your way to deliver the message is just atrocious.

I understand correcting someone and I know you do because so you have the well being of an animal at heart however do you think that your way to deliver the message is getting you anywhere beside looking like the leader of a wolf pack?

Don’t you think a softer approach might go a long way? This goes for you as well as the others who have posted so far and whom I would like to remind that they were newbies themselves not that long ago (some still being newbies in my opinion). Are some of you SO perfect that you never made a mistake? :rolleyes:

Do some of you need some of your own medicine so you get a better understanding on how it feels to be on the other side?

How would you feel if next time you ask a question that might seems obvious to some, and people start ganging up on you the way you are doing it here?

I think the OP understands that the excitement of those new additions as well as the excitement of those first successful meals might have make her overlook potential dangers, and I am sure she will be more cautious in the future providing a safe environment during feeding whether it is inside or outside the enclosure.

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i very much agree. like i said before i DIDNT PURPOSELY do that. and i said that id make sure it would never happen again.

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Originally Posted by BanditNClyde

i very much agree. like i said before i DIDNT PURPOSELY do that. and i said that id make sure it would never happen again.

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Yes but understand the passion our membership has for these snakes. Sometimes that does mean a sharp retort and hurt feelings but in the end, this is (or should be) about the best possible chance for a healthy snake and a confident snakekeeper. For me, egos have to go by the wayside when a living creatures needs are the issue.

As long as we all strive for a sense of balance and maturity, I think we do a darn fine job of sharing wisdom around here if I do say so myself. :)

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Originally Posted by BanditNClyde

i very much agree. like i said before i DIDNT PURPOSELY do that. and i said that id make sure it would never happen again.

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So you fed it like that by accident? :confused: You DID PURPOSELY feed it like that. There is no denying that.

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Originally Posted by Deborah

Slim while you often make good point sometimes your way to deliver the message is just atrocious.

I understand correcting someone and I know you do because so you have the well being of an animal at heart however do you think that your way to deliver the message is getting you anywhere beside looking like the leader of a wolf pack?

Don’t you think a softer approach might go a long way? This goes for you as well as the others who have posted so far and whom I would like to remind that they were newbies themselves not that long ago (some still being newbies in my opinion). Are some of you SO perfect that you never made a mistake? :rolleyes:

Do some of you need some of your own medicine so you get a better understanding on how it feels to be on the other side?

How would you feel if next time you ask a question that might seems obvious to some, and people start ganging up on you the way you are doing it here?

I think the OP understands that the excitement of those new additions as well as the excitement of those first successful meals might have make her overlook potential dangers, and I am sure she will be more cautious in the future providing a safe environment during feeding whether it is inside or outside the enclosure.

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Deborah,

I spent 23 years training, teaching, and mentoring individuals who, when placed under my supervision, did not have my knowledge or experience. My job was to pass on what I knew in order to get them to my level, with the hope that they would someday surpass me and carry it to the next level.

If you feel my methods of imparting knowlege and correcting mistakes are atrocious and pack leader like, I fear there is little I can do to change your opinion of me. I am not an ignorant man, and I have the ability to adapt to new situations, however, some methods have worked for me for many years with people of vastly disparate backgrounds.

Do I need a dose of my own medicine? Well, it wouldn't be the first time, failure and humility are often the best teachers of any lesson. Pretty good reinforcement as well. I have been on that side of the fence many times and with far more important things hanging in the ballance than how to feed a snake or set up a Iris tub.

I have made many, many mistakes both in BP husbandry and in life. If I do not do my best to ensure others don't learn from the mistakes I've made, then they were truely made in vain. If I can help keep one BP from being mishandled, then in my opinion, a few ruffled feathers is a small price to pay.

How do you think I will feel if have to read a "My BP just fell and is injured", thread posted by someone whose attention I feel I could have gotten?

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Originally Posted by Buttons

So you fed it like that by accident? :confused: You DID PURPOSELY feed it like that. There is no denying that.

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Was that necessary? :confused: Did you just miss the last few posts that were made?

Deborah,

I think the reason for responding so "aggressively" was that one of the OP's last threads resulted in a similar discussion. You probably consider me to be a newbie, and I most definitely am. I am by no means experienced, and I'm learning everyday.

However, to always give people the advice trying to sound nice doesn't always work, IMO. Sometimes you just have to get straight to the point, and in this case it might have been slightly aggressive and "wolf pack"-like, but I believe sometimes this is just necessary.

Didn't/don't mean to offend anyone.

Thanks,

Matt, you are not a newbie, at least not to me. But the difference here is not how much experience you have, is how much you are willing to learn. Like you said, it seems to you and many others, including me, is what the OP said from previous threads.

Like feed in or out of enclosure debate. Here are the reasons the OP posted:

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Originally Posted by BanditNClyde

there are many reasons:

1.they dont swallow substrate they cant digest

2.wont confuse your hand with food everytime you go to pick it up

3.Feeding on a plastic bag is cheaper and more sanitary because you dont have to worry about cleaning up their tank and redoing substrate and all you got to do is rinse down the plastic bag

4.if rats/mice poop or pee you dont have to worry about cleaning that up because itll be on the plastic bag versus in the tank

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Yet feeding upside down from a computer desk does not really follow with some of those reasons.

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Originally Posted by zhang317

Matt, you are not a newbie, at least not to me.

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My friend, the truth is that I am. ;)

I've only been keeping BPs since November!! I am so totally a newb, just didn't make (too many) mistakes, because I've been keeping snakes for longer than that.

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Originally Posted by DutchHerp

My friend, the truth is that I am. ;)

I've only been keeping BPs since November!! I am so totally a newb, just didn't make (too many) mistakes, because I've been keeping snakes for longer than that.

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Buddy, I've been reading your posts, about advice to others, husbandry issues, and your setup. You are underestimating yourself.

Time is not a issue. With the desire to learn, you have learned a lot in a short time. And it shows in your posts. Lets not get off topic.

PS. not being creepy or anything, but you are a really active member of this forum.

I also don't mean to offend anyone on these boards, but I agree that you do need to be blunt sometimes to get the point across. Sugar coating what could be a serious problem could make that person more nonchalant about an issue. By no means am I an expert, but I've had several years of taking care of snakes and I feel I have a good grasp on keeping my snakes happy and healthy.

I just feel like before you should have a pet you should pretty much know the in's and out's of taking care of it. You should do as much research as possible and be prepared. Granted, when you get the pet, everything changes... things happen that is unexpected. But I mean you aren't going to feed your newborn on a shelf because it wants to be there. You put your child in a safe place and feed them. It's just common sense.

I'm not trying to ruffly feathers and I don't think there is a "wolf-pack" mentality... I just think there are some people who are very blunt because they are concerned about the well-being of the snakes. :)

In my opinion there is blunt and there is bludgeoning. I don't see any problem with someone saying ... hey that's a really bad idea. You shouldn't do that, but instead do this. That's very different than saying you're an idiot for doing this and this and that. Do you see the difference? There's no sugar coating, but is clear and to the point without a verbal thrashing. Now, if the poster is clearly ignoring the advice and copping an attitude then you can have at them.... as long as you stay within the rules. ;)

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Originally Posted by tigerlily

as long as you stay within the rules. ;)

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Which to my knowlege I have :)

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Originally Posted by Slim

Which to my knowlege I have :)

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Yes you have, but you were closer to the bludgeoning than the direct confrontation in this particular case. All in all, I think your posting style is very effective and direct. Just every now and again it's a bit more than necessary and this felt like one of those cases.

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Originally Posted by Deborah

Was that necessary? :confused: Did you just miss the last few posts that were made?

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I certainly didn't miss the last few posts. I also didn't miss where she claimed she didn't purposely feed her snake that way. Maybe I'm not too up on my reading comprehension but there's no way the snake was accidently fed that way.

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Originally Posted by Buttons

I certainly didn't miss the last few posts. I also didn't miss where she claimed she didn't purposely feed her snake that way. Maybe I'm not too up on my reading comprehension but there's no way the snake was accidently fed that way.

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So you are saying you intentionally just ignored the warnings to tone it down a bit?

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Originally Posted by Buttons

I certainly didn't miss the last few posts. I also didn't miss where she claimed she didn't purposely feed her snake that way. Maybe I'm not too up on my reading comprehension but there's no way the snake was accidently fed that way.

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Good than tone it down - Last warning.

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Originally Posted by Buttons

So you fed it like that by accident? :confused: You DID PURPOSELY feed it like that. There is no denying that.

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yes i did feed it like that, and im not denying it. but what i was trying to get across is that i didnt purposely put him up there.

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Originally Posted by BanditNClyde

yes i did feed it like that, and im not denying it. but what i was trying to get across is that i didnt purposely put him up there.

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Interesting pictures but I'm confused. :confused: Was he on the desk and you put the mouse on the floor for him to eat and he struck at it from the desk?