Various BP Questions. :)

Hello! I have had 2 ball pythons for about 4 years now! I had some questions I've been meaning to ask about quite a few things:

First off--Is it okay for these 2 snakes to live in the same tank? They have been for about 4 years. They only eat in separate boxes and are both VERY tame and social.

Also, If they are living in the same tank, will they eventually breed with each other? I read it works better to keep them separated and introduce them during breeding season, but is that 100% necessary?

Third--What size tank should I be keeping them in? Right now I only have a 40gal and was thinking about upgrading to a breeder.

Also, could you classify their types? They're nothing rare, but it would be nice to know. :) (I named them when I was like, 10, by the way. haha)

Ball Python #1 (Saphira) - Female - 35in - about 4.5 years old
http://i42.tinypic.com/2z6dq2b.jpg
http://i41.tinypic.com/euk13n.jpg
http://i42.tinypic.com/2qnxgjt.jpg
http://i41.tinypic.com/15czour.jpg

Ball Python #2 (Flicker) - Male - 33in - about 4 years old
http://i42.tinypic.com/2nibgqg.jpg
http://i43.tinypic.com/hth4k0.jpg
http://i41.tinypic.com/dhg20n.jpg

Any other tips/comments would be nice. I just want to make sure I'm doing everything right.. :P

Thanks!
-Joe C.
:snake::snake::snake::snake:

Can you house snakes together? yes. Should you? no.
Housing ball pythons together can cause a lot of problems. How do you know who is defecating when? If you have them both together, it is impossible to tell which one is defecating regularly. Also if one gets sick, they both get sick, double vet bills. When ball pythons are housed together, one will dominate over the other. This can cause feeding problems.

As for tank size, bigger is not always better for a BP. I would get them each their own 20gallon long tank. This should be adequate for their entire life unless your female gets over 2000grams. By the way, it is much easier to know how big a snake is by their weight rather then by length.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Flicker

Hello! I have had 2 ball pythons for about 4 years now! I had some questions I've been meaning to ask about quite a few things:

First off--Is it okay for these 2 snakes to live in the same tank? They have been for about 4 years. They only eat in separate boxes and are both VERY tame and social.

Also, If they are living in the same tank, will they eventually breed with each other? I read it works better to keep them separated and introduce them during breeding season, but is that 100% necessary?

Third--What size tank should I be keeping them in? Right now I only have a 40gal and was thinking about upgrading to a breeder.

Also, could you classify their types? They're nothing rare, but it would be nice to know. :) (I named them when I was like, 10, by the way. haha)

Ball Python #1 (Saphira) - Female - 35in - about 4.5 years old
http://i42.tinypic.com/2z6dq2b.jpg
http://i41.tinypic.com/euk13n.jpg
http://i42.tinypic.com/2qnxgjt.jpg
http://i41.tinypic.com/15czour.jpg

Ball Python #2 (Flicker) - Male - 33in - about 4 years old
http://i42.tinypic.com/2nibgqg.jpg
http://i43.tinypic.com/hth4k0.jpg
http://i41.tinypic.com/dhg20n.jpg

Any other tips/comments would be nice. I just want to make sure I'm doing everything right.. :P

Thanks!
-Joe C.
:snake::snake::snake::snake:

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1. ball pythons can be housed together, but its kinda frowned upon because they are not social animals and they dont have feelings for each other. if its been working this long and there have been no problems than i see no problem in it. but if they start showing signs of competing for dominance than they should be separated. what looks like cuddling may actually be a competition for there "turf" you might say.
2. im still experimenting with the breeding myself so its not quite my expertise, but given the right circumstances any balls of the separate sex should be able to breed if all is well.
3. 40 gal sounds fine for the two if they aren't going off eating or anything than it sounds like there pretty comfy, upgrading could possibly stress them out.
4. looks like you have 2 pretty good looking normals there.:)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kaorte

Can you house snakes together? yes. Should you? no.
Housing ball pythons together can cause a lot of problems. How do you know who is defecating when? If you have them both together, it is impossible to tell which one is defecating regularly. Also if one gets sick, they both get sick, double vet bills. When ball pythons are housed together, one will dominate over the other. This can cause feeding problems.

As for tank size, bigger is not always better for a BP. I would get them each their own 20gallon long tank. This should be adequate for their entire life unless your female gets over 2000grams. By the way, it is much easier to know how big a snake is by their weight rather then by length.

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Thanks!

Just wondering--how would that cause feeding problems?

Would a glass separator work for dividing the cages? The only way i could afford a new cage now if I sold the old one afterwards, so having 2 separate cages isn't really an option for me. :/

Quote:

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Originally Posted by joshn6805

1. ball pythons can be housed together, but its kinda frowned upon because they are not social animals and they dont have feelings for each other. if its been working this long and there have been no problems than i see no problem in it. but if they start showing signs of competing for dominance than they should be separated. what looks like cuddling may actually be a competition for there "turf" you might say.
2. im still experimenting with the breeding myself so its not quite my expertise, but given the right circumstances any balls of the separate sex should be able to breed if all is well.
3. 40 gal sounds fine for the two if they aren't going off eating or anything than it sounds like there pretty comfy, upgrading could possibly stress them out.
4. looks like you have 2 pretty good looking normals there.:)

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Thanks! :D

What should I look out for as signs of "dominance"?

Welcome to BP.net. You have some very nice balls. If you do a search you will find a ton on housing. There is a lot to read here and there are a lot of smart people willing to help.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Flicker

Thanks! :D

What should I look out for as signs of "dominance"?

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one laying on top of another, kinda looks like cuddling but its really trying to claim its space.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kaorte

Can you house snakes together? yes. Should you? no.
Housing ball pythons together can cause a lot of problems. How do you know who is defecating when? If you have them both together, it is impossible to tell which one is defecating regularly. Also if one gets sick, they both get sick, double vet bills. When ball pythons are housed together, one will dominate over the other. This can cause feeding problems.

As for tank size, bigger is not always better for a BP. I would get them each their own 20gallon long tank. This should be adequate for their entire life unless your female gets over 2000grams. By the way, it is much easier to know how big a snake is by their weight rather then by length.

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Or you could put them in tubs for cheaper, heres how to set them up:

http://www.ball-pythons.net/modules/...warticle&id=40

a 31-41q sterlite would be all each one would need (separately)

Tubs are easier to clean and hold heat and humidity better

Quote:

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Originally Posted by joshn6805

one laying on top of another, kinda looks like cuddling but its really trying to claim its space.

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interesting, i never knew that.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by zackw419

interesting, i never knew that.

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yea two males during mating season in the same cage is kinda crazy. YouTube - Ball Python Combat

Quote:

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Originally Posted by joshn6805

yea two males during mating season in the same cage is kinda crazy. YouTube - Ball Python Combat

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looks like they are wrestling, they don't seem to be trying to hurt another.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by zackw419

looks like they are wrestling, they don't seem to be trying to hurt another.

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yea, just a serious game of tag.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Flicker

Thanks!

Just wondering--how would that cause feeding problems?

Would a glass separator work for dividing the cages? The only way i could afford a new cage now if I sold the old one afterwards, so having 2 separate cages isn't really an option for me. :/

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A glass separator could work, but I would try to find a way to make it opaque so they cannot see each other. It would also make the enclosure feel more secure for them.
If you are tight on money, then I would suggest a tub setup. You can setup each tub for about $30 minus a thermostat and proper thermometers, which are a must!

While it's hard to argue with 4 years of success, moving them to seperate enclosures is advisable. If nothing else, to prevent potential health problems from cross contamination if one gets sick.

Tubs are really easy to set up, and not very expensive.

I know everyone is suggesting to separate them, and I'm considering it, but if I were to keep them together what would be some things I could do to help relive stress? (They're not showing any signs of stress yet, but I want to be sure.)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Flicker

I know everyone is suggesting to separate them, and I'm considering it, but if I were to keep them together what would be some things I could do to help relive stress?

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Sorry, but this is a very counterintuitive question. It's like asking, "My house is filling up with water, but I don't plan to leave, what can I do to keep from drowning"?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Flicker

I know everyone is suggesting to separate them, and I'm considering it, but if I were to keep them together what would be some things I could do to help relive stress? (They're not showing any signs of stress yet, but I want to be sure.)

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Nothing :/
Have you ever noticed them "cuddling" or being overly active?
-or-
Do they stay in their hides most of the time?


Really, I would just separate them, it is the best thing you can do for them right now. Check craigslist, you might be able to find some cheap (or free) tanks there, if you don't want to go the tub route (which is in my opinion, far superior).

I didn't see anyone say this yet, but if they have been living together for 4 years you may want to get them resexed. At that age, depending on what they weigh they may be ready to breed already, and that they have not yet it may mean they where missexed, you may have 2 males, or 2 females. While it may be that they have not bred because of inproper temps/humidity, there could always be the question of sex, I was sold my first BP as a male, but after some resarch I found that he was a she.
And tanks are horrible to keep up humidity. I have been working on the tank my orrigional girl is in for the last year, she will be moving to a tub after I build a rack for the rest of my new babies.

Good luck with them, and welcome to BP.net, this place is great, very informative.

you guys also forgot about them eating each other
you say male and female well what about eggs or if the female becomes egg bound.

if you had a roomate would you want to have to sit in your friends feces

I had two of my ball pythons housed together for awhile early on, but have since separated them and I believe that they have both benefited. I find multiple enclosures easy to maintain and more appeasing to the eye. I too, recommend separating them and possibly having them re-sexed.

Also, would you please post a few pictures of your setup?

Thanks!