What are the Genetics to... a Crystal

What are the Genetics to a Crystal?

You need to look at this post.

Tom is the one that originated this project.
You will find most of your answers in this thread.

http://www.ball-pythons.net/forums/s...8&postcount=30

I totally missed Tom's post on this subject. Must be in one of the other forums (this is the only one I go to for the most part).

In my limited experience both Bruce and Tom are great guys. Maybe this could have been handled better and hopefully they’ll work it out.

So is Tom going with changing the name of the Super Crystal to Super Special as that and perhaps getting Brian to change the Lesser Crystal to a Lesser\\Mojave (or something without Crystal in it if Crystal is a Speciall\\Mojave combo and his doesn’t have Mojave) could be another way to straighten this all out other than changing the meaning of Crystal.

what? there's a crystal?? How does it look like ??

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Originally Posted by RandyRemington

I totally missed Tom's post on this subject. Must be in one of the other forums (this is the only one I go to for the most part).

In my limited experience both Bruce and Tom are great guys. Maybe this could have been handled better and hopefully they’ll work it out.

So is Tom going with changing the name of the Super Crystal to Super Special as that and perhaps getting Brian to change the Lesser Crystal to a Lesser\\Mojave (or something without Crystal in it if Crystal is a Speciall\\Mojave combo and his doesn’t have Mojave) could be another way to straighten this all out other than changing the meaning of Crystal.

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Work out? hehehe..
Nothing to work out. Read the Post I linked.
Also, Tom posted some pics or his stuff today/(last night?) check out the pics.

I did read your link and that's why I posted that. Maybe I'm too sentimental hoping they could get along but at least maybe they can work out to use the same names (that hopefully make sense) going forward so there will be less confusion.

I haven’t gotten to the new pics yet but will keep looking.

Randy,
Its not that I cannot get along with Bruce... Its just pretty odd waking up to someone changing the name of your project without so much as a phone call. There was a post from Bill Buchman, a month or so ago, talking about how the name was changed and I am still holding out strong, when I never even heard of it! Then when I hear how someone who has never produced a Crystal is leading the name change charge, like he is an authority on the subject with one Crystal breeding season under his belt, lets just say that got under my skin.
As far as figuring out the naming? A Mojave X Special produces Crystals... If you use a Lesser X Special you get a Lesser Crystal... If you use a Butter, I am assuming you would get a Butter Crystal... It doesnt seem too difficult to me.
Now since it is so early in the project, and new breeding results have come in, it is possible that I have produced a Super Special and a Pastel Super Special instead of Super Crystals... If there is Mojave involved then I call it a Super Crystal! If I have produced a Super Mojave/ Special I would call it a Super Mojave Crystal. A Super Mojave/ Super Special would be a Super Mojave Super Crystal... It might not even be possible to produce some of these! Is the naming of the project perfect? Maybe not... But this project is early, and generally speaking, the originator gets the respect of naming what he started.

I think there are much more confusing things going on in the naming of snakes...
KingPins, QueenPins, Queenbees, Jigsaws, etc... Do these names have anything to do with what is exactly in the combo? Wouldnt it take someone interested in these to research them and find out? How is the Crystal naming any different?
What about Goblins/Yellowbellies, Fires/Embers, Specters/Whirlwinds, Vanillas/Lightnings, Phantoms/Mystics... How can we have different names for snakes that are basically the same thing??? Is this more or less confusing than the Crystal naming?
Even with Lesser Platinums... How many years have these been breeding? I could be wrong, but I havent heard of anyone (besides RDR, possibly Nerd, and maybe a couple others) that have produced Platinums from a Lesser Platinum. Wouldnt that be kinda confusing having Platinum in the title of a snake that wont produce Platties without another gene(someone correct me if I am wrong on this)?

To me there seems to be crazy names in this industry with alot of possible confusion invlolved for someone who does not want to do his research... I just dont understand why the Crystal project became the focal point for incorrect naming when it is years behind most other projects, and to me it seems somewhat basic to understand...

They're just jealous Tom.

Screw em.

Besides, crystals are ugly.

What they make isn't, but they sure are.

When do I get mine again?

I just got an e-mail from Tom, thanks. I apologized to Tom regarding the "name" thing. I was not trying to challenge his naming of an animal that he produced and that I purchased. Since I produced a spider x special I was not sure what exactly to call it. I realized I could call it anything I wanted since I produced it. I decided to contact Tom and it was his suggestion to use the morphs names but to put the special name on the cross first. I can totally agree with that as I really don't see that it needs a fancy non-relevant name. So if I read Tom's e-mail to me correctly then what I was fortunate enough to produce is a "special spider" as opposed to a "spider special". Tom, if i'm wrong, correct me.
Thanks
Bruce Delles c/o Twin Cities Reptiles

Tom you're right, there are lots of confusing names and the crystal group shouldn't be singled out. I mean what genetically does "daddy" mean and shouldn't a platy daddy sib be a sibling of a platy daddy and not one type of its offspring? I think RDR has the advantage that he is still about the only one that has that gene so there really isn't much of anyone else yet to call them anything different. I don't even try to keep up with a lot of the combo names any more (I have no idea what all those king and queen things are and don't even try beyond pewter with the pastel cinnamon/black pastel combos) but I have a lot of interest in crystal and just want to use the name right going forward. I can sure see where you have to call a project something while it evolves and it may go places later that make some of the names no longer completely consistent. And lots of names have changed over time in common usage (lesser platinum to just lesser, cinnamon pastel to just cinnamon, enchi pastel to just enchi, etc.).

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Originally Posted by Python Dreams

If I have produced a Super Mojave/ Special I would call it a Super Mojave Crystal. A Super Mojave/ Super Special would be a Super Mojave Super Crystal... It might not even be possible to produce some of these!

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I'm betting the only ones that are possible will be the homozygous special (aka super special), the crystal, and the homozygous mojave (aka super mojave) so maybe the names will not get all that complicated with super duper crystals. What to call it when you replace mojave with lesser/butter/phantom/mystic/Vin Russo/mocha/hidden will be the confusing place.

Im confused:D:D

So a crystal is just a normal appearing snake with a hidden gene, that shows up when combined with any mutation?

I wouldn't say it's normal looking.....but subtle yes.

Akin to yellowbellies, het reds, spectors, spotnoses, fires, vanillas, etc. Nothing drasticly different in some examples....but there are some characteristics that are common on the gene carrier and are noticed with a trained eye. :)

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Originally Posted by Mischke

So a crystal is just a normal appearing snake with a hidden gene, that shows up when combined with any mutation?

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What form of inheritance are they?

Actually the "normalish" looking snake is called a special. The crystal is actually a combo between a special & a mojave. The photos that John posted of my snakes last week were INCORRECTLY named to John by me. I'm just trying to keep everything the way that Tom originally named the start of the project.
Bruce Delles c/o Twin Cities Reptiles

A Crystal is a Mojave/Special combo... A Crystal has nowhere near a normal appearance....
Crystal Female
http://i552.photobucket.com/albums/j...g?t=1235779505
A "Special" has somewhat of a normal appearance like Specters, Vanillas, etc... Hence the name "Special"... Its kinda normal, just "Special". I would snap a striaght "Special" photo, but everyone ate in the last hour... "Specials" appear to be a co-dominant trait that is on the same allele as a Mojave... A Crystal is somewhat of a Super since when bred to a normal, you either produce Mojaves or "Specials"... Next I will try and explain it in Spanish!:P
Pastel "Special"
http://i552.photobucket.com/albums/j...g?t=1235779617
"Super Pastel "Special"
http://i552.photobucket.com/albums/j...g?t=1235779640

Thanks Bruce! I took awhile to come up with my post and you beat me to it!:)

So when you cross a "special" to a lesser/butter/platinum, etc do you still get crystals, or something similar? Or is it unique to mojaves?

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Originally Posted by blueapplepaste

So when you cross a "special" to a lesser/butter/platinum, etc do you still get crystals, or something similar? Or is it unique to mojaves?

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Based on the name (Crystal) given the Special x Mojave combo by Tom -- which SHOULD be respected/adhered to, any other BEL would require completely different name of it's own. One would think that any of the Blue Eyed Lucy's would look "somewhat similar".

I plan on making some Butter, Cajun Butter, and maybe my Lithium x Special combos next season -- if the girls all keep eating.;) I don't think you could make anything less than a FANTASTIC :banana: combo with a Special x BEL pairing. Exciting possibilities for sure.:D

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Originally Posted by Bill Buchman

Based on the name (Crystal) given the Special x Mojave combo by Tom -- which SHOULD be respected/adhered to, any other BEL would require completely different name of it's own. One would think that any of the Blue Eyed Lucy's would look "somewhat similar".

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Yeah, that would be my guess, too. That they'd look similar, I was just wondering if this had been confirmed.