Abraxas, the new addition

Well my fiance and I went to the local pet store where we got her snake (0.1). They had a B&W Tegu but it was 275, so she looked a little further down the line at a cute little thing that looked like it needed some help and lovin. That cute little thing was a savannah monitor. They had just got him in a few days ago, shipped in from their supplier. They are having to treat him from worms right now so we are letting them fatten him up for us. his name is Abraxas. He looks like a little dragon, which i'm sure you already know, so we gave him a dragon name. Here is a pic of the little fella in my fiance's arms.

https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/fil...6/100_1490.jpg

Not that's an adorable savvy. Can't wait to see more pictures.

I just can't wait til he's fattened up. I want him a little porker when we get him. lol Already got a 30 gallon waiting for him, just gotta get the supplies together to get his home prepared.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Little B-Py

Already got a 30 gallon waiting for him

---

I hope you are not serious about a 30 gallon tank. That sav needs much more room than a 30 gallon. For it's current size, I would have in at least a 4 ft x 2 ft x 2 ft. enclosure. When it gets about fully grown(which could be in 4-6 months if cared for properly), the monitor will require a fairly larger enclosure(I would go 8 ft x 3 ft x 3 ft minimum) to be properly housed.

I would also watch it on the 'fattening up'. If not fed properly, savs are prone to obesity....which in turn leads to fatty liver(and/or other issues) and eventually death.

I suggest picking up a copy of The Savanahh book by Ravi and Bennett. It is the best out there and will give you a much better understanding of the animal.

nice pick up.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by daniel1983

I hope you are not serious about a 30 gallon tank. That sav needs much more room than a 30 gallon. For it's current size, I would have in at least a 4 ft x 2 ft x 2 ft. enclosure. When it gets about fully grown(which could be in 4-6 months if cared for properly), the monitor will require a fairly larger enclosure(I would go 8 ft x 3 ft x 3 ft minimum) to be properly housed.

---

Agreed. To go further, aquariums are for fish and very poorly suited to monitors, which need humidity and deep soil-based substrate.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by daniel1983

I would also watch it on the 'fattening up'. If not fed properly, savs are prone to obesity....which in turn leads to fatty liver(and/or other issues) and eventually death.

---

Agreed. From the not-too-revealing photo, the Sav looks thin and dehydrated. Concern should be more about the parasites being the reason for the emaciation and less about feeding more food to "fatten up".

They are working on feeding him mice with worm treatments to get rid of the parasites so we aren't gonna get him until he is looking more healthy and eating regualarly.

Can he not start off on the 30 with plenty of substrate for burrowing and hides to keep him happy until I can build him a full size? Me fiance and I are looking at getting our own house pretty soon so he will basically have his own room to himself. A glass aquarium would hold humidy quite well since that is what both of our BP's are in and I pretty much never have to mist in there to keep the humidity up. Since it's a glass bottom that is actually holding water now i'm pretty sure it would have no problem with soil based substrate since it currently has 30 gallons of water and about 3" of sand along with about 10-15 lbs of live rock on top of it.

Can anyone point me in the direction of pics of a full sized enclosure? I have an idea but I want to see one completed.

Also, this doesn't look much longer than a 30 gallon, maybe a bit taller but I think that's about it.

The snake isn't a guarantee right now, it all depends on whether he decides to eat and gets rid of the parasites so until then it's a maybe.

From the look of the picture, the sav is at least 12" long. Since a standard 30 gallon aquarium is about 36" long x 18" wide x 12" tall, there will not be much room inside for the animal once you put substrate and hides in the enclosure. It may work for a month or so, but that would about it. When fed properly savs grow fast, you could have a 3 ft.+ monitor in a 4-5 months.

That is just my opinion though.

I would really suggest picking up that book....i think they sell for around 10-15 dollars.

but for a short amount of time would it work?

where can i get the book?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Little B-Py

but for a short amount of time would it work?

where can i get the book?

---

I usually book shop on kingsnake.com, but fall back on amazon.com if they do not have something.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Little B-Py

Can anyone point me in the direction of pics of a full sized enclosure? I have an idea but I want to see one completed.

Also, this doesn't look much longer than a 30 gallon, maybe a bit taller but I think that's about it.

The snake isn't a guarantee right now, it all depends on whether he decides to eat and gets rid of the parasites so until then it's a maybe.

---

I saw a video of his monitor. It's very, very small and young. MUCH smaller than yours.
http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showthread.php?t=77541

I suppose it will work for as little time as possible. Do the best you can. :]

Well I may have to move my ball to a tub to help with temp problems, so how long do you think a 40 gallon breeder would last?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Little B-Py

Well I may have to move my ball to a tub to help with temp problems, so how long do you think a 40 gallon breeder would last?

---

The 40 gallon would be better than a 30, and the breeder probably has more floorspace.
I'm not too knowledgeable about this, but I would try to keep it less than 2 months... preferably less than that.

However, an idea for you. Melamine can make really nice enclosures (permanent or temporary) and is pretty inexpensive for one sheet. You can get a large sheet cut at the dimensions you want and screw them together with some type of glass door. I bet there is a good DIY around here or someone knows what I'm talking about..

:]

a 40 breeder is 36 3/16 x 18 1/4 x 16 15/16

Aside from the space, you are going to have a hell of a time keeping even temperatures in any kind of glass terrarium. You can get by with it for a month or two, but if you want a healthy, muscular lizard instead of a chubby doorstop, start working on an intermediate housing alternative. These are smart lizards and need to have stuff to climb on and burrow in. Stimulation is a must. Let us know how you go...

http://i273.photobucket.com/albums/j...e/p1010008.jpg


Cheers,
Kat

Like previously stated this is only gonna be temporary and last for hopefully a few months at the most.

I have to disagree with aquariums being horrible for monitors. If they are setup properly they work just as well as everything else. I know a few people that use aquariums as "raise up" enclosures for high end Aussie dwarf monitors with great success. I use a glass enclosure to house my baby blackheaded monitors.

It is all about proper setup. A tank with a screen top and high wattage light is only good for making reptile jerky, but a tank with a plexiglass top and low wattage light can be a great enclosure.

To me the issue with aquariums for monitors is size. Their sizes are great for babies and some dwarfs but there are not many tanks that can handle the amount of substrate and space needed for a monitor over 2 feet long.

If you need any help with setting up a temporary glass enclosure properly just let me know.

I think I have the tank figured out...I like the 50/25/25 mixture I saw one one site. I plan on getting 2-60 watt bulbs. I saw somewhere to get the bark hides and there are some cool lookin ones where I get my reps from. I need at least 2 and with the breeder being really wide I know it would be more comfortable to him than the 30. I'm gonna try to get Oakley moved to a 10 gallon this weekend so we can try and get the 40 set up for him so I can get pics put up for feedback.

Why not just put the poor snake in a $3 15qt tub so he can relax. 10 gallons are horrid to heat. The 15qt tub is about the same size, but less head space(they don't need it).

Go spend $3 on your snake so he can get his feeding response back..

10 gallon tanks are not horrid to heat. my other ball is sitting comfy in hers and all the temps are right on it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Little B-Py

I think I have the tank figured out...I like the 50/25/25 mixture I saw one one site.

---

can i see that site ? i have a mangrove monitor on the way

My Savannah Monitor Care Sheet

thanks for the quick reply... its a good read

Ok, so my fiancee went to Emerald Bay today to start stocking up on tank stuff of Abraxas and here is what she got:
large hide
2 75 watt heat lamps
1 red lamp
3 clamp-lamps

Stuff left to get (that I know of)
top soil, play sand, and cyprus mulch for the 50/25/25 mix

Already have:
1 large hide
1 large water bowl
log that spans the width from corner to corner of the 40 breeder.

I know I am missing something...besides a lizard...

We got him last night to try and take better care of him than emerald bay was to hopefully get him healthy soon. We got the stuff for the mix and had to sit it in front of a gas stove last night to thaw it all out. lol. It has only been about 20 degrees outside for the past 2 or 3 days. My fiancee (Ashtin) is going by petco today to get some crickets and superworms to try and fatten him up a little. Would ya'll suggest feeding him live or f/t mice?

Top shot, cold hide, hot hide, log, and water bowl. Not pictured:
removed foliage
tile for basking platform
gladware for superworms
random crickets running around

https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/fil...6/100_1504.jpg

Hot hide
https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/fil...6/100_1508.jpg

cold hide
https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/fil...6/100_1509.jpg

Any more pics need to be seen?

I also ordered one of the PE-2 temp guns from tempgun.com last night so hopefully it will ship monday and be here pretty soon. I know it's not completely necessary because of having the thermometer on the tile but I want it as a nice back up.

for reference....i have a little 8 month rescue sav. he is roughly 10 inches and just getting healthy. he is small, but his enclosure is a 75 gallon with a custom hood made to keep humditity in. once he reaches at least 12-15 inches and get a little meatier, he will transfer to the 6x4x3 cage i have sitting for him. these guys get big, and they are pretty sensitive to there enviroment. so to take him from the pet store the way he is, or even fatter, and throw him in a small cramped enviroment, he will just become stressed, probably want to bite you to death, and more then likely wont eat. if the husbandry isnt good with these lizards, then they will die fairly fast. my little guy is the 4th savanna i have owned, and he is small but still has a foot of substrate to burrow in because they love to do it.

https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/fil...85579_9426.jpg

This is him basking. He seems fine with his tank setup. under his hot hide he has about 8" of substrate to dig in if he wishes but I haven't seen him doing any digging unless that's why there is a bunch of top soil in his water bowl...hmmm....

For some reason I have a Santana song stuck in my head.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by dsirkle

For some reason I have a Santana song stuck in my head.

---

Did I miss something in that statement?

In the ancient times Carlos Santana made one of his most famous albums, "Abraxus".

interesting. didn't know that.

does he sit all day under the heat or is he active. if he is very healthy, he will be all over the place exploring his enviroment. just curious....but you should upgrade to something bigger asap.
a few 2x4's, some plywood and you got yourself a big tank for him. should cost no more then 50 bucks maybe 80 depending on how fancy and maybe 4 hours of your time....

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Little B-Py

This is him basking. He seems fine with his tank setup. under his hot hide he has about 8" of substrate to dig in if he wishes but I haven't seen him doing any digging unless that's why there is a bunch of top soil in his water bowl...hmmm....

---

He is thin, dehydrated, and lethargic. Post pics of the full setup, including the top of your tank to show bulb placement/etc. You'll get better suggestions. Did the Emerald Bay or whatever place mention if it was successfully treated for parasites, as they said they were going to do?

I will post pics later today. They thought he had parasites and I took him to the vet this past tuesday and he checked out fine, just thin.

feed him on mostly insects for now. toss him a few roaches and mealworms. stay away from the rodents for a while, there fattier and if you send those his way your not going to bulk him up but rather make him fat. he needs another cage....seriously this is the most important part about keeping these little guys. no ifs ands or buts about it. 30 gallon glass tank with a screen top is the wrong place for a savanna monitor that size. at least 70 gal is needed with a solid top with some holes and a fixture for a heated area is needed. humidity is to be no less then 55% at all times with this guy.

oh and also...those lights are too high of a wattage, i use 1, just 1 45w flood light for his basking spot, stays at a consistant 115* and if it gets lower its usually because he started taking the top dirt off and getting it farther from the light. instead of getting higher wattage bulbs, rather build the substrate up to get your desired heat.

he is in a 40 breeder as I have previously stated many times. We don't feed him rodents often and he has a bowl of superworms and crickets running around. I am going by the care sheets I have seen everywhere that suggests to use 45 watt bulbs in order to get the proper heat. I am using a screen top that is covered in aluminum foil, BTW.

https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/fil...6/100_1539.jpg

Here is the tank setup. It is kinda a mess cause he destroyed it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Little B-Py

he is in a 40 breeder as I have previously stated many times. We don't feed him rodents often and he has a bowl of superworms and crickets running around. I am going by the care sheets I have seen everywhere that suggests to use 45 watt bulbs in order to get the proper heat. I am using a screen top that is covered in aluminum foil, BTW.

---

I don't know about superworms, but crickets are nasty.
I would think those two sources are a bit small too. Superworms might be alright, but can you get your hands on any roaches?

idk where to get roaches around here. I don't think any places carry them. I have noticed less crickets in the cage but it seems like he isn't eating the superworms anyways.

It is a sad super bowl sunday...my fiancee and I just got back home from getting crickets for Abraxas (we spent the night at my parent's last night). I opened up the top of his cage and put the crickets in and noticed that he wasn't moving, he had half of his body in his hot hide and half out, so I touched him...he didn't move...I picked up his tail...he didn't budge or anything...he was/is dead. I'm assuming he was just too far gone and didn't have a chance.

And to top it off my mom-in-law was sincere for a good 5 minutes then blurted "he is to not be replaced" after she told us that we cannot have any more pets until one leaves. How much BS is that?! Little does she know our "feeder rat" is actually the starter of our "feeder rat" colony. lol. Chock one up for us on the score board.

So to all of you who gave us help, thanks very much, but it just wasn't enough.

RIP Abraxas, 2-1-09.