New to snakes :)

Hi,
I am new to snakes and ive always wanted one. I have been looking at ball pythons, they seem pritty easy for begginers as do they pertain from biting. So could You help me out some.
What i have.

55 gallon tank 48"x12"
light One heat bulb and two florescent strips just for light.
the snakes at the store look about 2-3 ft

try reading at the caresheet section. you'll learn a lot there.

i did but i was reading other places and i was unshure if a 55 gallon tank would be too big for a snake that size. the store i went to had them in pairs and i was also wondering if the 55 gallon would be good for two ball pyhtons?

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Originally Posted by boogidus

i did but i was reading other places and i was unshure if a 55 gallon tank would be too big for a snake that size. the store i went to had them in pairs and i was also wondering if the 55 gallon would be good for two ball pyhtons?

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never for any reason should any 2 snakes be together unless for breeding purposes!

also since you are new look around here a bit first before you make a purchase. make sure you know what you need and have it setup before you get them. also you better ask them if they are imported wild caught, captive hatched or captive born and bred. also what food they are eating

Welcome!

A 55g is pretty big for a ball python! Lots of people keep them in 10g tanks when they are young and then move to 20g long tanks when they are ready for that. Never keep two snakes together in the same tank unless you are cycling them through for breeding.

As for equipment, you'll need an under tank source of heat as well as a thermostat to control that heat. You'll also need a thermometer and hygrometer for measuring in-tank temps and humidity. Also, you'll need two small hides and whatever you choose to use for substrate (newspaper, aspen, etc.)

Also, food! Yes, your new snake will need to eat and so make certain that you have a reliable food source locally, or a place on the net to order rodents from.

Again, welcome! Ball pythons are great starter snakes as they don't get very big and are relatively easy to keep. Just make certain you have a thermostat (about $100.00) to control your heat source :)

ok ... then i will only buy the one... but the main thing im trying to get to is if a 55 gallon tank will be to large for a ball bython that is 2 ft and growing

i know the tank is big im ok with that but, i wanted to make sure that it wouldnt start freaking out cuz the tank was so big.... plus he will have more room to go about

The snake will more than likely start to freak out with a tank that big; that's what I was saying :)

You'll need to purchase:
a smaller tank, a thermostat, hides, thermometer/hygrometer, a heat source, substrate, and food!

Also, since this is a pet store snake, I'd err on the side of caution and order a can of Provent-A-Mite...

what about a 29 gallon tank... dimensions are like a 20 gal tank except it has more height

or is there a snake that would fit my tank? samthing calm that rarely ever bites and is for begginers? I would like a pet that i can hold

the other thing is, i saw on a site that if you have a big tank as long as thier are alot of hiding places that it would be ok.

Have you looked into seeing if there are any herp shows near you? I got my ball python there and was only $20. I think they are healthier than at most pet stores and most are captive bred which to me is important.

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Originally Posted by boogidus

the other thing is, i saw on a site that if you have a big tank as long as thier are alot of hiding places that it would be ok.

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one of the main reasons why we suggest against getting large enclosures, tanks especially, is that it is so hard to try to maintain proper temperatures and humidity in them, which will only cause a lot of stress and frustration on your part. If your husbandry is 100% perfect and you do have multiple hides, then it is possible to keep a full grown female (or really large male) in a 55 gallon tank.

As far as other good beginner snakes, there are always corn snakes, which tend to get very long but stay pretty lean and they move pretty fast when compare to Ball Python's. For a baby, a 55 gal will still be too big for them though. For a bigger snake, Red Tail Boa's are pretty easy to care for, but they have the potential to get 8 to 10 feet long. Generally most people suggest only getting these snakes if you have had some experience with keeping reptiles/ snakes before, but if you do your research and know what your getting into, I think that you should be fine. The temperments of any of these snakes can vary, some may be very nippy, while some can be as calm as puppy dogs.

What ever you do decide to get, research research research!!!

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Originally Posted by nixer

never for any reason should any 2 snakes be together unless for breeding purposes!

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Originally Posted by starmom

Never keep two snakes together in the same tank unless you are cycling them through for breeding.

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Could someone point me to an authoritative source or proven research that supports this view that two BP's cannot successfully inhabit the same tank.

Thanks.
JohnNJ

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Originally Posted by boogidus

what about a 29 gallon tank... dimensions are like a 20 gal tank except it has more height

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Ball pythons are, for the most part, terrestrial snakes and so do not require height. In fact, the higher the tank the trickier it will be for you to control humidity.

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Originally Posted by boogidus

or is there a snake that would fit my tank? samthing calm that rarely ever bites and is for begginers? I would like a pet that i can hold

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Any snake can bit at any time :) Ball pythons are good because they are very timid and don't require or particularly enjoy a lot of holding. Have you looked into a male Bci (boa)? One would fit your tank (before outgrowing it) and they are more interactive than a ball python, and they are also a good fist larger snake.

Bottom line: Sounds like you would benefit from *really* searching around various sites and discovering about the different snake species and then making your determination about what snake species is good for you :)

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Originally Posted by boogidus

the other thing is, i saw on a site that if you have a big tank as long as thier are alot of hiding places that it would be ok.

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Yeah- not necessarily. Snakes have their own little quirks and some might be okay while the majority of others would not be okay. I really strongly urge you to hear this: Ball pythons typically do not do well in a 55g tank!

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Originally Posted by JohnNJ

Could someone point me to an authoritative source or proven research that supports this view that two BP's cannot successfully inhabit the same tank.

Thanks.
JohnNJ

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I don't think there are any empirical studies regarding keeping 2 ball pythons in the same enclosed environment. We recommend against doing so given the inherent problems involved: Health concerns (one gets sick, they both get sick); dominance issues over hides and spaces within the environment; male fighting; unintended breeding; etc etc

ok thanks!!! ill look into some other snakes but if i decide to get a python i will use the 29 gallon tank i have or get a new one that is smaller in height!

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Originally Posted by starmom

dominance issues over hides and spaces within the environment; male fighting

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OK. Is there anecdotal evidence of dominance issues or males fighting available?

JohnNJ

Oh jeez John, there's tons :)

Ever seen two snakes that are together (like for breeding) all snuggled up together over the warm side? Yeah- snakes don't snuggle. They are competing for the warmth.

Then there is the trick of putting two males together so that they will fight in order to get their engines revved for breeding.

There are so many valid reasons NOT to keep snakes together; what is a reason for doing so???

ive been looking at a boa.... it seems similar to a python attitude wise but they are a bit bigger? does anyone have experience with those? would it fit in a 55 gallon tank. many websites says thats a perfect size...

and any one know a herp show going on in the massachusettes area

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Originally Posted by starmom

There are so many valid reasons NOT to keep snakes together; what is a reason for doing so???

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I keep reading about not doing it on this forum but I see many, many being successfully kept together, for whatever reason. I'm not arguing the point. I'm just trying get some support for that view other than what's being repeated here.

As an example, it is commonly advised that one should never keep two intact male dogs together for the same reasons you mentioned; dominance and fighting. But the reality is that many, many, many intact male dogs are kept together in the same household every day. Are there dominance issues? Are there fights? Yes but for the most part, and under the correct circumstances, nothing life threatening happens and life goes on. Most of time it's all show. But I would also advise a novice dog owner not to try it, so I understand where you're coming from.

I've never seen a snake fight nor have I kept two adult snakes together in the same tank. I'm just looking for something that backs up that advise.

Sorry to the OP. I didn't mean to hijack this thread.

Thanks.
JohnNJ

Hi John~
I don't think you've hijacked the thread given that the OP was considering purchasing two snakes and housing them together :)

I understand your example of keeping two intact male dogs and understand that it is often accomplished under certain circumstances. I also well understand that the breed of the dog has a lot to do with the success of the keeping!

Keep in mind that snakes are not dogs and we humans know much less about snakes than we do about dogs!

I know that in other countries people tend to keep more than one snake in an enclosure. It seems to work for the snakes, but to what extent? Don't know; and I'm uncertain as to whether anyone does. People tend to broadcast their successes and hide their failures and so learning is made harder for all the rest of us.

All I can say with certainty is that I will never keep to snakes together in one enclosure due to the learning that I have done and due to what I have been taught by others. I don't feel the need to color outside the lines on this one ;) I have not ever seen snakes in the wild keeping each others' company unless it was a den of baby snakes or a den of rattlers keeping warmer (?) during a cold winter at my ranch. Other than that, they seem to be [mostly] solitary animals.

It's a good discussion, John. Kudos!

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Originally Posted by boogidus

ive been looking at a boa.... it seems similar to a python attitude wise but they are a bit bigger? does anyone have experience with those? would it fit in a 55 gallon tank. many websites says thats a perfect size...

and any one know a herp show going on in the massachusettes area

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Its going to be hard to find one snake that is going to fit in any one tank comfortable for its entire lifetime. The attitude of each snake is for the most part on a individual basis while general trends appear to be accurate amongst species. But if your not going to have an appropriate sized enclosure or the right climate then the snake will not be happy. But you never really know, personally my Green Anaconda is the chillest snake I own.

again, if you get a baby snake no matter what you start with a 55 gal is going to be to big. do you already have a 55gal and that is why you are looking for a snake to put in it?

also remember if you get a boa that the cost of feeding is going to go up and up as it grows. are you prepared to feed it jumbo rats or bunnies for the next 20 years, and get it a larger enclosure in a few years?

I believe that the minimum cage size for an adult female boa is at least 6' long and 2' wide, with some vertical space as well since boa's like to climb. For males I think a 4x2 cage is the minimum size. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by boogidus

ive been looking at a boa.... it seems similar to a python attitude wise but they are a bit bigger? does anyone have experience with those? would it fit in a 55 gallon tank. many websites says thats a perfect size...

and any one know a herp show going on in the massachusettes area

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Bci's are very much more outgoing than ball pythons. I have three female Bci's are they are really different than balls. They are curious snakes, climbers, and have a really healthy appetite!

Bci's get larger than ball pythons. And, yep, I'm looking at three 6x2x4 cages for my females!! If you were gravitating towards a Bci, I would suggest going through a breeder so that you get a mellow snake (cough*jimisnakes*cough)

As was mentioned, getting a snake to fit your tank is pretty impossible, IMO. Choose a snake that you really want, get the environment for the snake together and running, and then- and only then- get the snake.