Question: At what point do you feel comfortable posting info about your animals?

I've been seeing this happen a LOT recently, where new people post about thier animals in videos and Youtube and forums and such.

It has piqued my interest on the subject.


Now, my question is...

If you are posting information online, when do you think is the right time to be teaching others???

How many years of experience do you think you should have before you should be posting things about how to take care of your animals?

Now also, to the video watchers/readers out there, who do you REALLY listen to when watching videos and reading info?

Big name breeders? Small name people?

Very interesting question. Nowadays anyone can make a video and post it online, make a web page or a blog.

When I was young the saying was "Just because it's in print, doesn't make it true".

Is it time with animals or research, what is experienced? I rescued a BP from someone that had it for 8 years with a lightbulb for heat and feed it every other month because they didnt like to watch the mice die. How the thing survived is a miracle but that person could say they have 8 years experience.

When I give someone advice I like to stick to things that are tried and tested which I have learned from breeders/herpoculturalists/vets and have had personal success with myself.

There are some great videos out there from very experienced herpers which are very helpful and there are also a bunch of morons with snakes and cameras too, giving everyone a bad name.

Wiegh the quality of the information by the source that gave it to you.

My kid used to complain that so and so at school said something mean to her. I asked her, what do you think about that person? She said, I don't like her, she is a moron! So I told her who cares what a moron has to say.

If you respect someone or their knowledge, you should listen closely to what they have to say. If they are foolish, why give them a moment of your time. The energy is spent much better on other things;)

Lots of people talk the talk but not many have walked the walk;)

it takes very little experience needed to send people off in a direction that has info, or repeating what you read, though it's nice to make sure to mention that "I read that.."

I'm new to BPs, but very experienced in other herps, especially with wild animals native to the southern US. If someone comes here asking for info on taking care of BPs, I have no problem sending them to the care sheet if no one has done that already and letting them know about my experience and repeating what others have told me.

Excellent post Heather!

Personally, when I watch a teaching video, I search for people I know and trust. I have found that if I just do a random search, there are WAY too many people who give out incomplete or incorrect information. Which could possibly end up harming or even killing a snake. Too many "know it all's" that really have no idea what they are doing are really hurting informational videos. I can think of one guy in particular that is a complete joke, but because he does "funny" vids, the kids love it.

I think after several years of keeping and breeding, posting informational videos could really add to a persons credibility if done correctly.

People like Adam, Brian and a few others make some awesome videos. They know what they're doing and share what they know. They're known and respected. I think that goes a LONG way when choosing vids.

I'd watch videos you make simply because I know you have the experience to back up what you show. Besides, my pastels would enjoy seeing their "mom" get famous! :D

-Grins.- What a great question.

I think it's extremely important for first-time owners to be exposed to the best of the best but that's not often the case. Every Tom and Harry can make a video of feeding an animal or some such thing. It's a dangerous world we reptile lovers live in. One moron can put up a youtube video about husbandry, and some newbie will see it and think it's right. Not everyone does their research.

I think it's important for people like us to be the ambassadors of the herp culture and try and educate those around us. It's important for us to try and help the reptiles we love so much because without that help, the government, in fear, will continue to regulate our ownership.

I have almost eight years of "experience" with ball pythons. Does that mean that I'll go post youtube videos? No. I may have some experience, but I didn't start living and breathing my balls until about four years ago. I don't want to misinform someone, so while I try to help people here and on other forums, I try and impress upon the people I try to help that I'm not perfect and I don't know everything.

Before I got my first ball python, I spent over a month doing research on them so that I could give the one I'd get the best home possible.

I respect the best breeders out there as well as a lot of people on this forum and a few others. I think it's important that these people try and step into the forefront of knowledge so that the morons of the world don't over-educate the newbies. Meh. I think I made sense. Maybe.

I don't post much anymore since there are some people that are very anal about thier way being the best way and the "only" way just becuase they have done it "that" way for years. As soon as you do something different or offer advise that does not match thier own, little wars are started and suddenely becuase you are the new guy you are viewed as the reptile "village" idiot. There is more than one way to make something work, cars run on gas for the most part but some run on diesal, some on propane, even electricity. Looking after reptiles is much the same. There is of course the most common way for which ever species, this would be like gas. Then there are some other ways that are less common but proven successful for some and not for others, this would be like diesal and propane. Then thier are the odd ways you don't here about and the "experts " may think, oh that's all wrong. But how do you know until you have tried it. I'm sure that when it was first thought up, cars running on electricity, thier was many people who thought, ahh that would never work. So point being don't doubt a persons ways until you try it and it fails. And even if it does fail who cares if it works for someone then great. Advise is just that advise, its not written in stone and you wont get hung if you dont take the advise, Take in info from anywhere you can and use it where you need it. There has been advise I have taken from experts that actually made a situation worse. Someone asked me how am I doing this for that animal. I tell them how I am looking after that animal and they are like oh, no don't do that! do it this way instead. So I change what I was doing ,which for me was working, to this expertise way and the animal starts doing not as well, so I return things the way I had them and the animal did much better. I think all advise has its value, within reason of course. If someone tried to convince me to feed my bp an elephant, this is obviously bad advise. So to answer the question when should you feel compforatable? When that info you are posting has been successful for you, and your animal.

Look at my signature down there...

I felt I had to put that in all my posts just so you know I'm very new to this thing and to take that into consideration when reading my posts. But, at the same time, I spent weeks fixing my humidity issues one time that I felt it's okay for me to share what I did to solve the problem. Also, I responded to some newbie asking how they should handle their snake. I thought my input would be helpful because I started as a snakophobic 2 months ago and after a week of observation and learning, now I am comfortable picking up the 3-foot bp by myself, so I distinctly remember what I did to get comfortable which may be something that somebody who has been handling their snakes for 10 years would not feel the need to mention anymore. I mean, for example, a lot of experts would say, pick up the snake gently. Well, for a newbie, "pick up a snake", may not be enough information (it wasn't for me). I remember when I was figuring out how to pick up our snake I had to ask myself, how do I approach the snake? What part of the body to touch? How can I tell if the snake is ready to be picked up? You know what I mean? So, a newbie like myself might have some insights that is helpful to somebody with their first bp that experts have taken for granted.

Ok there were alot of great answers.

Heres my thoughts. In this hobby there is always someone who has more/less knowledge than me. Now I may not be able to advise someone how to asperate an egg bound female so if I need that info I call on someone with more experience. However I can advise someone how to assist feed or set up a Ball's new home.

I think that as long as you feel comfortable with your level of knowledge then passing that knowledge on to those seeking it isn't a problem.

I think the right time is when the poster knows something about keeping animals that someone else does not. For example, if someone that has been keeping a snake for a few weeks knows that they need correct heat and humidity because of research that they have done, then that is the correct time. I do not think that anyone should give out wrong information, so someone that does not have very much experience should make sure the information is correct before giving to someone else.

I guess~ for me~ I don't feel a great ambition to "teach" anyone. If someone asks a question I have the answer to I'll answer. Unless it's already been answered with what I consider a reasonable answer. Sometimes if I feel the answer already given is stupid I'll politely post an intelligent alternative. If I'm feeling particularly full of it (usually when I'm full of bourbon!) I may point out that the first answer was stupid~ but usually I attempt to answer politely and preface such with statements such as:
In my expierience...........
What I tried was..........
This worked for me............
I read that............

BUT~ when I try something new I love posting about it. Not as a "Teaching" tool for others but more as a "Look~what I'm trying!" Sometimes it works out great. The CO2 chamber I built and wrote up the instructions for are still on my web site and a lot of people use those plans to design thier own kill tanks. Sometimes it doesn't work~ there are pictures of the enclosure I built out of a cheap carport and tarps for my Turkeys last year on a homesteading site I go to..........No one uses that idea.......cuz mine turned into a giant Box Kite! LOL~ good idea in theory~ but in practice it sucks!!

I guess it really depends~ if it's something I KNOW I very rarely go out of my way to "TEACH" others though I will share my knowledge~ if it's something I'm learning......I love to share the process with anyone else who might be trying to do the same thing!

Excellent post. I think about ego alot. I have come to realize that if I could only get out from behind my own ego I would be a much better person. It's fun to be smart, and to help others. It gives us a sense of self-worth and bolsters our self-esteem. It also seems to be human nature to want to share things that we have learned recently, as opposed to things we have known for years.

So in answer to Heather's question... I feel comfortable sharing my experience now, however, I did it a lot more before I was actually qualified to do so.

You nailed this one Heather, thanks.

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Originally Posted by Jenn

It also seems to be human nature to want to share things that we have learned recently, as opposed to things we have known for years.


You nailed this one Heather, thanks.

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I agree. It's usually done with good intentions, but it's not always the best info. I think the right time to become somewhat of a "teacher" is when you have read everything out there for a baseline, raised up snakes for long enough and learned from experience and knowing the snakes that there are different ways to do things, other than the forum dogma, that keep your animals thriving. I don't see any problems with people making basic husbandry videos or posts with recycled basic information as long as it's not bad information, but we've all seen novices and so called experts make videos with ridiculous information. But as far as being a "teacher", I don't think that this is a topic where the teacher can stay one lesson ahead of the class and try to teach. A solid baseline and a few years of dedicated experience is a good starting point. You can read everything out there and think you know it all, but once you've had some hands on experience with a handful of snakes you start to realize that you don't know all that much. At that point you start experimenting and trying new things and seeing what works best for your snakes, and at that point it becomes more beneficial to share what you learn.

I'm confused. I know I know, so unusual.....

But I sort of figured that anytime I was talking snakes I was teaching, purposely or not, and anytime I was listening I was learning.

Sometimes I was learning what not to do, but a lesson is a lesson.

I had a kid ask me this one time, while I was giving a demonstration, the kid was maybe 7 and had never touched a snake, doubtful he had ever seen one in person, but the little bugger had been reading; why do snakes have nostrils if they smell with their tongues?

I had never considered that question until that day. I had been keeping snakes for several decades before I heard that question.

I think I may have been that kid back in the long ago. I honestly can't remember a time after I was about 14 when I wasn't sharing what I know/knew with fellow herpers, no internet back then, but we did this thing called talking and used this device called a telephone that had all these wires and parts and intricate rituals that had to be followed in order for it to work.

I started working in a pet shop when I was in high school and have been teaching people about reptiles as a profession ever since.

But I suspect my case is not typical.

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Originally Posted by wilomn

I'm confused. I know I know, so unusual.....

But I sort of figured that anytime I was talking snakes I was teaching, purposely or not, and anytime I was listening I was learning.

Sometimes I was learning what not to do, but a lesson is a lesson.

I had a kid ask me this one time, while I was giving a demonstration, the kid was maybe 7 and had never touched a snake, doubtful he had ever seen one in person, but the little bugger had been reading; why do snakes have nostrils if they smell with their tongues?

I had never considered that question until that day. I had been keeping snakes for several decades before I heard that question.

I think I may have been that kid back in the long ago. I honestly can't remember a time after I was about 14 when I wasn't sharing what I know/knew with fellow herpers, no internet back then, but we did this thing called talking and used this device called a telephone that had all these wires and parts and intricate rituals that had to be followed in order for it to work.

I started working in a pet shop when I was in high school and have been teaching people about reptiles as a profession ever since.

But I suspect my case is not typical.

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You're right about teaching and learning, but I took the question to ask about writing and making videos about husbandry, feeding and breeding. I probably took it the wrong way, but as far as that goes I think that before you have sufficiant hands on experience to know that what you are doing is making your animals thrive, you risk giving out bad information that is better off not being out there for new keepers who are looking for good information, and also experienced keepers looking for newer information. I'm thinking of the lady on expert village who has a ton of informational videos about ball pythons, and who probably has good intentions. They are simply wrong and dangerous for anyone who watches them and follows her advice. If people like her actually read a good book on the subject, then put it into practice for long enough to learn the animals and make neccesary changes to her husbandry, they wouldn't look like such fools, and new keepers wouldn't be starting off with harmful information. I just hate seeing videos that are meant to teach new keepers proper husbandry, then showing yearlings eating pinkies in a 55 glass fish tank with a log hide, reptile carpet and a 120w spot light and 65 degree ambient temps.

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Originally Posted by PythonWallace

You're right about teaching and learning, but I took the question to ask about writing and making videos about husbandry, feeding and breeding. I probably took it the wrong way, but as far as that goes I think that before you have sufficiant hands on experience to know that what you are doing is making your animals thrive, you risk giving out bad information that is better off not being out there for new keepers who are looking for good information, and also experienced keepers looking for newer information. I'm thinking of the lady on expert village who has a ton of informational videos about ball pythons, and who probably has good intentions. They are simply wrong and dangerous for anyone who watches them and follows her advice. If people like her actually read a good book on the subject, then put it into practice for long enough to learn the animals and make neccesary changes to her husbandry, they wouldn't look like such fools, and new keepers wouldn't be starting off with harmful information. I just hate seeing videos that are meant to teach new keepers proper husbandry, then showing yearlings eating pinkies in a 55 glass fish tank with a log hide, reptile carpet and a 120w spot light and 65 degree ambient temps.

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Nope, I didn't read the question properly. It specifically askes about posting, using this newfangled technological hooey, not about jibber jabbering in person.

Great points all around though.

Some snakes apparently have an ok sense of smell through their nostrils. I read it one time in a science article... Dont ask me to cite my sources.

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Originally Posted by littleindiangirl

Some snakes apparently have an ok sense of smell through their nostrils. I read it one time in a science article... Dont ask me to cite my sources.

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Yes, but if their primary scent input is not in the nostrils, why do they have them?

In case they lose their tongue. Duh jeez, you'd think I was teaching preschoolers.... :nerd:

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Originally Posted by wilomn

Yes, but if their primary scent input is not in the nostrils, why do they have them?

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to breath without opening their mouth?

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Originally Posted by littleindiangirl

In case they lose their tongue. Duh jeez, you'd think I was teaching preschoolers.... :nerd:

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Interesting answer.

THIS preschooler sort of thought it was for breathing.

See there, I let my guard down and learned something today.

I had no clue that a snakes tongue could become lost. I always thought they were firmly attached, as are ours.

I'm going to go pull some tongues right now and see what happens.

Think that on today's web it is important to:

1. Look closely at the level of experience of the person giving the advice

2. Don't assume something is 100% proven just because one person said it. Look for additional evidence / information, ask "experts" that you trust to corroborate

3. Ask yourself if the advise makes common sense and does it conflict with how the animal operates in the wild

Justin

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Originally Posted by mcavana

to breath without opening their mouth?

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Thats what I was gonna say.

I read the reason they use there tounge is because they dont inhale very much air when breathing, like a mammal for example, so they dont get as much of an air sample. So they stick their tounges out to capture more scent molecules in their enviroment.

Their breathing system is very primitive in comparison to ours since they dont use as much energy as a warm blooded animal would and dont need as much oxygen. Thats why a bad RI can drown them whereas we could just blow our nose or cough stuff up.

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Originally Posted by mcavana

to breath without opening their mouth?

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Ha! I was just showing my 7-year-old son that green pitviper on that other post (that's a really cool snake, mom! according to him) and I checked on this thread and saw this question so I turned around and asked my 7-year-old what he thinks about the nostril... He rolls his eyes and says, "So he can breathe, Mom!". Okay, okay, so I have to admit that didn't occur to me (see my signature below - not an expert which is the point of this thread)... anyway, my 7-year-old proceeded to tell me sea snakes have "closed nostrils" so water can't get in... it only opens when they go out of the water. And I ask him, where'd you learn all this? Thinking this is just another one of those "my best friend Charlie said" thing. So then he goes to his room, picks up his "Uncover COBRA" book flipped to the page about the Cobra's nostrils and showed me the exact paragraph that mentioned the nostrils with a picture of the cobra's nostrils next to the sea snake...

This is the same son who asked our ball python vet if he has ever treated a flowerpot snake... the vet asked, "you mean, the blind snake?" And he responded, "yes, the Braminy Blind Snake, but not the Bahamian Blind Snake because I think that is different"... I just look at him like, huh??? And the vet actually thought that statement made sense.

Okay, I have a cool son. :D
Now, if only he can answer his math questions as well as snake questions...

Great post! I think you read my mind since I was thinking about this yesterday. Honestly, I would only post videos about dog/cat care at this point because I have over 15 years' experience keeping them, as well as working at several vet offices. As far as my reptiles, I don't think at this point my knowledge is so broad that I could feel confident telling (better yet, showing) others how to do things properly. These are living, breathing creatures that I could inadvertently end up harming by providing the wrong information.

That being said, I listen/watch the keepers with a good reputation. It's easy to pick up who on this forum knows what they are talking about & who just has a sad ego problem. I cannot take the advice of keepers that I do not respect and admire-and that has to be earned.

I by no means call my self an expert, I have only been in this hobby for two years. When I first started out, with one ball python in a tank, a member of this site found that we lived in the same city. He invited me to his house to see his collection, and I was hooked. We became friends and he took me under his wing, and taught me alot. He's helped me through rat breeding, rack building, and quite frankly, changed my life. My collection has expanded to 30+ snakes in just two short years, who knows what the next decade will hold for me. I now know what I want to do for the rest of my life. I recently started making youtube videos showing off my collection and sharing some of my knowledge, and I've gotten a lot of positive results.

This site has been a huge part of me growing as a person, and a reptile keeper, and hopefully it will be a help to many more who come after me. But I think right now, with my experience and knowledge gained, most of it from this very site, I feel comfortable posting info about my animals to help others get from where I've been to where I am now.

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Originally Posted by Mike Cavanaugh

to breath without opening their mouth?

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So did this prove to be the right answer then?! Do I win a prize??? :8:

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Originally Posted by wilomn

Interesting answer.

THIS preschooler sort of thought it was for breathing.

See there, I let my guard down and learned something today.

I had no clue that a snakes tongue could become lost. I always thought they were firmly attached, as are ours.

I'm going to go pull some tongues right now and see what happens.

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Ha ha. Earlier this year or last...anyway a while back, on another forum someone had a snake that did loose it's tongue.

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Originally Posted by snakelady

Ha ha. Earlier this year or last...anyway a while back, on another forum someone had a snake that did loose it's tongue.

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Jen Harrison if I remember right.

Bump for the people who missed this...

Been noticing it alot again...

Hmmmm

I personally don't give advice unless I know for sure that it will or has worked. With people like Wes around, I don't want to give out stupid information and then get ripped a new one. I may have gotten a little ego when I first started keeping snakes, but since I've calmed down. This site gives out ALOT of information, I think coming here and reading alot makes you think you know just about everything, lol.

As for who I trust to listen to, I seek out opinions and explore all options before I make a decision. If it were something life threatening to my BPs, I would most likely trust a bigger sized breeder, or a trusted member on this forum.