They Ate them all!

I picked up a trio of ASF's about 6 weeks ago and one of them looked prego when i got her. Jumping ahead three weeks ago I seen two pinkies in the cage and I believe they were from the smaller of the two mothers I have because she was the one always tending to them.
Fast forward to yesterday, I woke up to little squeeks and see one of the females had approx 12 pinkies, and as of this morning there are none left. Now this would have been her first litter so I am assuming this is the reason?
The other two from the other mother are starting to run around and get more and more active.

Should I let her have another litter and see if it was just a first time mother thing or should she ........ :tears:

rk

Id give her a shot at another liter... if she eats them, snakey food she becomes... ;)

is there a possibility she buried them under the substrate?

No, its like a horror movie in there. There are parts around the cage.

o man. sorry to hear that

mine did the same. i got 4 older females and male. only to had litters no bigger than nine babies. they ate most of them. out of 35 babies i was able to set up 2 breeder groups. 1 male and 3 females in one, 1 male and 2 females in another. when they had thier first litter she ate 2 of them but left the rest so i had nine left.

How are you keeping them and what are you feeding them?

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Originally Posted by littleindiangirl

How are you keeping them and what are you feeding them?

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ditto. I have NEVER have a mom come even close to eating an entire litter. Most I have ever had eaten was like 2.

They are in some rat tubs i believe they were from big apple herps. They always have a full water bottle, eat Tek Harland rodent food, care fresh bedding. have a rodent house thing on one end of the cage to hide in and a wheel they broke but still play with.

Like I said though the other mother had a small litter her first litter and they are running around still

I would also double check and make sure that you actually have the number of males and females that you think you do. I made a mistake and had two males in the cage and lost my entire first litter.

No that I can be sure of, I even looked again last night.

multies normally eat there first litters , i have a few groups with multiple males in 1 group has 5 males to 5 females there first breeding 4 females have had babies for just over 7 days

yeah my group has 1 male and two females. I was hoping for a good litter to get one more trio going.

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Originally Posted by simon

multies normally eat there first litters , i have a few groups with multiple males in 1 group has 5 males to 5 females there first breeding 4 females have had babies for just over 7 days

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I wouldn't say it's normal... I haven't had any cannibalism experienced in my girls first litters. Each one of them has had on average 16-18 for first litters....

I have had a mouse eat all her babies the first time, so I didnt know if it was an ASF thing.

No, I dont feel like it's an across the board type of thing. It's definitely not impossible, but I honestly feel like ASF's are exceptional caretakers just like domestic rats and the cannibalism is low compared to mice.

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Originally Posted by littleindiangirl

I wouldn't say it's normal... I haven't had any cannibalism experienced in my girls first litters. Each one of them has had on average 16-18 for first litters....

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Originally Posted by littleindiangirl

No, I dont feel like it's an across the board type of thing. It's definitely not impossible, but I honestly feel like ASF's are exceptional caretakers just like domestic rats and the cannibalism is low compared to mice.

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agreed 100%

i guess im going to give her a second try to see if it was as first time thing or she will retire

ive had this happen many times with the ones that i had and out of multiple groups. i fed them many many different common foods and i had as many as 50 babies eaten at a time out of different trios. i ditched the effort period and i know of quite a few actual breeders that have had the same problems every now and then.

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Originally Posted by nixer

ive had this happen many times with the ones that i had and out of multiple groups. i fed them many many different common foods and i had as many as 50 babies eaten at a time out of different trios. i ditched the effort period and i know of quite a few actual breeders that have had the same problems every now and then.

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Thats funny, I haven't heard of it happening. I have been breeding them for a while now, and have not experienced this. It seems obvious to me that either something was wrong with the setup, the diet, or that particular line of ASF.

mine have only ate around three in the past 6 months,mice on the other hand eat them all im done with mice! my female mouse had babies yesterday & there were little pink parts all over the cage 5 survived now they are in with a AFS litter getting taken very good care of by the ASF trio.

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Originally Posted by mcavana

Thats funny, I haven't heard of it happening. I have been breeding them for a while now, and have not experienced this. It seems obvious to me that either something was wrong with the setup, the diet, or that particular line of ASF.

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I have to agree with Connie and Mike here. The only time I've had cannibalism problems, is due to dehydration (of course, my stupidity, salt lines on the water bottle tricked me into thinking it was 3/4 full.)
And even then, it was weanlings that were killed. My ASFs now, won't even eat babies that die naturally.

Are you supplementing fruits and vegetables and proteins? I don't know how that food is, but you might want to change over to a good hardy lab block.

He said he was feeding Harlan, so I doubt food is the issue...I dont see any problems, and we are still waiting for our first ASF litter. Sorry for your loss and good luck setting it back up.

Before this next litter you get, you can give them a 1/4 cup of sunflower seeds a few days before they pop, but only give it once a week. Anymore and their fur will get very greasy and yellow, not to mention sunflower seeds are high in fat.

Give them paper towel tubes to chew on, non treated wood blocks to chew on. Things to hide in....

If they still eat after this second litter, get some new breeders.

OK. I will try the sunflower seeds and stuff, do you put it in a bowl or just in the cage? Also i do give them toilet paper rolls already they love to play with them.
On a side note when will the little ones start feeding and drinking on their own? About what week?

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Originally Posted by P-Regius

OK. I will try the sunflower seeds and stuff, do you put it in a bowl or just in the cage? Also i do give them toilet paper rolls already they love to play with them.
On a side note when will the little ones start feeding and drinking on their own? About what week?

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Once they can run around easily, their eyes will be closed but they'll go to drink and eat what mom has.

I give them a small bowl with the seeds in them.

Ok, on my breeder cages the top of the cage that indents down is the hopper, so i guess the babies need something a little lower to get food from

Well female #1 had her second litter two nights ago and I have not see any parts around the cage and they seem to be taking care of them better. So hopefully it was just a first time thing. I also gave them some grapes and other stuff to eat, figure maybe eating a grape is better than a baby.

Congrats! I think she'll be much better this time around. Babies dont always birth easily, and if the birth was traumatic, the mother is more likely to destroy the litter if they weren't already dead. But it sounds like she is doing well this time. Keep it up!