Black Eyed Leucistic

Hi guys, not posted in a while but thought I would share some of my excitment and joy with you. So this is the story, buy a pretty clean BEL
http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/a...8/STU_3368.jpg

Find him a hot Fire gal to play with
http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/a...ELXFIRE002.jpg

She laid 6 eggs. Not bad odds?
http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/a...Lbabies046.jpg

And the best bit is that only ONE has the smallest, tiny little yellow dot on the tail, the rest are scale perfect white.
http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/a...BELBABY092.jpg
http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/a...BELBABY097.jpg
http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/a...BELBABY086.jpg
Thanks for looking folks.
Paul

I think those babies are sick. They have NO COLOR! You should probably send them to me so I can nurse them back to health, I'll send you a perfectly healthy snake that has color :8:.


God they are BEAUTIFUL! Those odds are unbeliveable!

OH my goodness they are gorgeous!!! Congrats!!!

Wow....:O i am drooling here. GORGEOUS snakes. WOW!! I am impressed! I agree the odds are unbelievable!! Congrats!!:gj::gj:

Uh-b-b-b-bud-d-dy c-c-can I g-get o-one of t-t-those??? LOL nice batch, GREAT ODDS:gj:

wow wow wow sooooooo soooooo sick! nice clutch.

Congrats, those are super hot!

omg.. first off, those are some amazing odds. please share the wealth!!!

second, those are some beautiful snakes... i cant get over them!

I really like the all white snakes, congrats amazing animals

Now thats what I call ,,,,,,hitting the jackpot :colbert:

WITCHCRAFT!!!!

just kidding nice looking clutch:gj:

congratulations!! leucistics are the best. :D

:DRecognise that pic!!..lol Heres some more Paul if ya missed them
http://www.ball-pythons.net/forums/s...ad.php?t=77140

I want one soooo badddddddd!!!!:tears: You lucky duck!:gj:

AWESOME clutch :O beautyful little critters !!:gj:
carlo

Thank you so much folks for the kindness. I just can't stop smiling.

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Originally Posted by StuartH

:DRecognise that pic!!..lol Heres some more Paul if ya missed them
http://www.ball-pythons.net/forums/s...ad.php?t=77140

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Think we need some baby pics, don't you? :gj:
Paul

They are gorgeous! Beautiful examples of luecistics. :gj:
:bow::bow::bow:

Sigh, I cant wait to get one of those...someday.

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Originally Posted by paul.angelides

Thank you so much folks for the kindness. I just can't stop smiling.



Think we need some baby pics, don't you? :gj:
Paul

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;) Yes mate..next weekend?

Amazing clean BELs !! :gj:

Which BEL line is it?

Those are great. And wonderful odds.

I only got one beef though....

I'm really starting to get irritated by the term BEL.... I never know if someone is going to be talking about

BLACK eyed Leucistics or
BLUE eyed Leucistics.

They BOTH start with a B and they're both white snakes, but from completely different lines and sometimes I get confused and it's just too much for my little brain. :rolleye2::rolleye2::rolleye2::rolleye2::rolleye2:

Wow man, very very cool!

Thereeeeeeeeeeeee Greatttttttttttttttttttttt

your a lucky man. I envy you. congrats and gl.

Good looking little hottie!!!!

Great odds I would love to have a lucy

Freaking amazing odds!!! Congrats man:gj::gj:

Thank you so much guys for all the kind words. The second clutch popped out today. 7 eggs, 4 Fires and 3 CLEAN BELs, yay. Again. really kind comments :gj:
Paul

Wow Paul congrats those are some really nice snakes. I know there is a couple different combinations that will make Blue Eyed Leucistic but what do you combine to make the Black Eye version?

OH no those babiess are TOO awsome

Something's wrong with those babies, you better send them my way.

;)

I don't care what people say, I love the white ones :).

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Originally Posted by RyanGSP

Wow Paul congrats those are some really nice snakes. I know there is a couple different combinations that will make Blue Eyed Leucistic but what do you combine to make the Black Eye version?

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Thanks Ryan. These are from Fire lines. As far as I know they can be made from Sulphur and Spectors but I have never bred with these. I am not 100% sure whats doing on but 8 BELs and 6 scale perfect white and 2 VERY clean ones says something about the animals I'm using. Most lines put out the BELs with yellow patches!!! I will need another season to confirm my thoughts........
Paul

Awesome Paul. What line of fires are you breeding?

Wow! Black eyes are my favorite white snake, and your's are as good as it gets.

Congrats,
Dan

I love the black eyes on the leucistics. Great odds, Congrats!

I actually like the yellow blotches on the Black Eyed Lucy. I also cannot understand how BEL is Black Eyed Lucy, when it just as easily could be Blue Eyed Lucy.

Dave

I too prefer lots of yellow blotching on Black Eyed Lucies, I don't get the ''these are perfect'', we have Bleu eyed lucies that are all white, variation with yellow blotching is quite desirable in my book and not a default.

Regardless, those are beauties, congrats :gj:

ok so how do i get me one?????????:D

:O:O:O:O:O

:gj:

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Originally Posted by EmberBall

I actually like the yellow blotches on the Black Eyed Lucy. I also cannot understand how BEL is Black Eyed Lucy, when it just as easily could be Blue Eyed Lucy.

Dave

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Each to their own, we all like different things and thats the beauty of Balls, versatility... Personally I prefer rare and clean over dirty and common any day. Lot of people go for the yellow patches but a lot of those people are only producing that level of quality :)
http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/a...BELBABY092.jpg
http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/a...48/BADBELL.jpg
Paul

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lot of those people are only producing that level of quality

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Paul, please elaborate on ''that level of quality'', are you saying BEL with blotching are somewhat inferior quality, I would tend to think the black eyed lucies with no blotching are of less value, after all, we have the bleu eyed if someone wanted patternless white snake.

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dirty and common

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Dirty meaning, the yellow blotching gives it a dirty look? I've not hatched any black eyed yet, are you saying you normaly get more dirty ones then clean ones in any given clutch?

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Originally Posted by the odds god

Paul, please elaborate on ''that level of quality'', are you saying BEL with blotching are somewhat inferior quality, I would tend to think the black eyed lucies with no blotching are of less value, after all, we have the bleu eyed if someone wanted patternless white snake.

Dirty meaning, the yellow blotching gives it a dirty look? I've not hatched any black eyed yet, are you saying you normaly get more dirty ones then clean ones in any given clutch?

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When someone talks about a Leucistic animal they usually mean an animal that is pure white and lacking cell pigmentation. As we know this is not strictly the true sense of a Leucy but its what is known to be the holy grail. Now, Eric Davis was the man several years ago here in the UK that first produced them and has produced many since. We exchanged emails last year on the subject and it was his opinion that no one had produced a pure white Black Eyed yet. Here is a post from THIS year from Ember Reptiles which has 3 members, Eric being one of them. http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/snake...ic-royals.html So after ALL these years they finally produced their FIRST pure white animal this year after MANY animals that had yellow patches. So yes, the pure white ones are VERY rare. There are one or 2 breeders in the States that have produced the odd one as well. To my knowledge no one anywhere has produced 6 pure white animals out of 2 clutches (8eggs) using the Fire line. The other 2 have 2 DOTS of yellow but not patches. So when myself and almost any breeder talks about a clean BEL, Black or Blue they mean the WHITEST and LESS marked animal possible. I have held almost every Blue combo going and in my opinion when aged not one looks as clean as these guys. So yes, I do feel an animal that is not pure white all over is of lesser quality and as there are hundreds of them with yellow patches and a handful without then they are more rare. This is subjective opinion and I know many will disagree but I would be very surprised if someone that was hatching out lots of yellow Black BELs would feel a pure white one to be infirior and sell for less money????
Paul

and pauls local to me....if only i had the cash...
paul the females i am going to bring down are at a mates being bred to a pastel at the moment..........

im sure ive already commented on this lot matey but imo your the luckeyest chap in the east mids!!!! other than me with boas...

i might bring you some stuff over when we both get a free day..

Jon

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Originally Posted by carisma

and pauls local to me....if only i had the cash...
paul the females i am going to bring down are at a mates being bred to a pastel at the moment..........

im sure ive already commented on this lot matey but imo your the luckeyest chap in the east mids!!!! other than me with boas...

i might bring you some stuff over when we both get a free day..

Jon

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Cheers mate. Busy this weekend and next but pm me and we WILL sort a day out...
Paul

:O WOW is all I have to say!!!! :gj:

personally i have one that has some yellow blotches i like it but i also like the straight white ones. as far as how many totally white ones are produced doesnt really matter. to say one if inferior to the other is total do-do.
both have different directions and i think that both are the same equal quality no matter if it has yellow or not.

This may have been mentioned.. but will you breed the normal to something or back to a lucaristic? to see what happens??

Just wondering.

carol

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Originally Posted by Montessa Python

This may have been mentioned.. but will you breed the normal to something or back to a lucaristic? to see what happens??

Just wondering.

carol

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There is no normal there, its a Fire. Fire x Fire = Black Eyed Leucisitic.

As mentioned before my views are subjective but going on the term Leucisitic meaning lack of cell pigment then a pure white snake in my opnion is superior by definition but that by no way means more desirable...Again, I challenge anyone to produce both and feel the white snake equal or less in derirability.
Paul

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Originally Posted by nixer

personally i have one that has some yellow blotches i like it but i also like the straight white ones. as far as how many totally white ones are produced doesnt really matter. to say one if inferior to the other is total do-do.
both have different directions and i think that both are the same equal quality no matter if it has yellow or not.

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I agree with you, but it would still be nice to get it sorted out. I picked up a dark sulfur with the intention of eventually producing a black eyed leucistic with as much yellow blotching as possible. It would be nice to know which of my normal females to breed him to in order to eventually achieve this effect. Do I go with the darkest ones? The ones with the most granity patterns? The ones with the highest amount of yellow? Or what?

stunning.

refferring to the above post. what "normal" in that clutch he had 5 BEL's and 1 FIRE. when breeding a black eyed leucy to a fire you will end up with 50% fire and 50% bel's (unless your totally lucky like paul)

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Originally Posted by paul.angelides

There is no normal there, its a Fire. Fire x Fire = Black Eyed Leucisitic.

As mentioned before my views are subjective but going on the term Leucisitic meaning lack of cell pigment then a pure white snake in my opnion is superior by definition but that by no way means more desirable...Again, I challenge anyone to produce both and feel the white snake equal or less in derirability.
Paul

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I've produced both, actually 2 pure whites and one yellow blotched, and I pretty much only show off the one with yellow blotches. All the local reptile people, not ball python people just local herpers, prefer the one with yellow blotches.

Eric

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Originally Posted by Eric Sandoval

I've produced both, actually 2 pure whites and one yellow blotched, and I pretty much only show off the one with yellow blotches. All the local reptile people, not ball python people just local herpers, prefer the one with yellow blotches.

Eric

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im more than happy to take the pure white one off your hands if your not as proud of them :P lol