Need help Asap (anyone experienced please!)

Hello everyone i really need help asap from someone experienced with snake disease and Baytril, i have a burmese python and it just ate 5 chicks 2 days ago, so today i checked the box it hides in and it wasnt clean so i took my burm out (it was a bit more aggressive than before) and i soaked it in some warm water to clean up, it was very angry and was hissing alot than suddnly some bubbles came out of its mouth in the front and i'm not sure if it was RI disease (pics below) , i also made some search about RI diseases before and found that there is a medicine called Baytril and i do have it (Note: i'm from Kuwait and there arent any Reptile Vets here..) so i would do anything to help this snake out if it was sick, please check out the pic's and i also posted a pic of the Baytril , i need advice on how to use it if my snake had RI...its confusing: these are the photos i took after i soaked it in warm water to clean up...:(
here u can see the bubbles in front-is that normal?:
http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p...0/DSC00696.jpg
http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p...0/DSC00692.jpg
a big one this time as she was hissing:
http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p...0/DSC00697.jpg
http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p...0/DSC00700.jpg
after a while it dissapeared :
http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p...0/DSC00683.jpg
And this is the Baytril (i have no idea weither i should be injecting it or using it oraly with that aggresive snake and i dont know the dosage, that is after i'm 100% sure my snake has RI):
http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p...0/DSC00681.jpg

please dont tell me to go to a vet or get hlep because there arent any reptile vets in kuwait but i really would take any advise seriously and yes i keep the snake in a 92f degree area and low humidity with a water bowl (50 gal tank closed all sided but front) and its always inside the hide box..

You need to get an exact weight of the snake so you can get the correct amount of medication. I have never treated a larger python (only Ball Python) so I am not familiar with the amount of baytril per weight of snake but I am sure some one here will know.

I live in Los Angeles and they only time I have had RI's was from low humidity and warm dry air. I reccomend you get your humidity up around 60% and temps on the higher side (94 farenheit).

Take the baytril out of the package to see what kind of bottle. I assume it is injectable which is best.

i thought higher humidity makes it worse, does my snake really have RI? the baytril is injectable its written there in the box and i also got the needles with it ... but i'm not sure if i need to use it and what dosage and how am i going to be possible to inject it in that aggressive python and in what area exactly... confusing

I know having a bigger snake may take some time to get the shots into him. I had to give my bp a shot every 2 days(48 hours), from head to the neck, you hold the snake & use the needle on the side down further past the neck. After injecting it, hold the area. Then give your snake a luke warm bath, & massage him. * this is what I did for my bp when he had RI *

When you give the next shot in 2 days, use the other side of the neck, alternate. I don't know how much you are supposed to give your snake, maybe weigh him & look online, to see if there is any info that may help you.

I hope your snake gets better!!!

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Originally Posted by Tho3ban

i thought higher humidity makes it worse, does my snake really have RI? the baytril is injectable its written there in the box and i also got the needles with it ... but i'm not sure if i need to use it and what dosage and how am i going to be possible to inject it in that aggressive python and in what area exactly... confusing

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If it helps - check out Ralph give meds to a ball python. It's probably pretty similar? I don't know, I'm not a vet...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4nXFNICdDBQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MBPPPJww6m8

You will probably need someone to help you hold the snake, maybe keep the head in a pillow case?

Good luck!

Also, before you go giving anything shots, you also have to take into account you have 5% concentration, which would make the dosage different if you were to find a chart with the dosage amount per lb and it happened to be 10%.

BUT, if someone chimes in about the dosages for 5%, your all set! Otherwise, it's math time! :P

you said you gave the snake a bath .... maybe thats where the bubbles are coming from ..... have you seen any bubbles or popping noises recently, after the bath?

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Originally Posted by Reediculous

you said you gave the snake a bath .... maybe thats where the bubbles are coming from ..... have you seen any bubbles or popping noises recently, after the bath?

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yea i just checked the snake in its box ..has been like many hours since i gave it bath .. still watery thing coming out of its mouth....

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Originally Posted by Reediculous

you said you gave the snake a bath .... maybe thats where the bubbles are coming from ..... have you seen any bubbles or popping noises recently, after the bath?

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He didn't say he gave the snake a bubble bath, :colbert:(its okay i was thinking the same thing)


All joking aside, good luck buddy, I don't know much about the bigger snakes, I hope someone is able to help.

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Originally Posted by Tho3ban

yea i just checked the snake in its box ..has been like many hours since i gave it bath .. still watery thing coming out of its mouth....

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Did you try searching for the dosage amount you should use?

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Originally Posted by littleindiangirl

Also, before you go giving anything shots, you also have to take into account you have 5% concentration, which would make the dosage different if you were to find a chart with the dosage amount per lb and it happened to be 10%.

BUT, if someone chimes in about the dosages for 5%, your all set! Otherwise, it's math time! :P

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hmmmmmm so that would bee...:confused: :stupidme:

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Originally Posted by Lewdogg3

Did you try searching for the dosage amount you should use?

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it says :
"The basic dose rate for cattle and sheep is 0.5 per 10 kg bodyweight" .... for snakes it doesnt say....

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Originally Posted by Tho3ban

it says :
"The basic dose rate for cattle and sheep is 0.5 per 10 kg bodyweight" .... for snakes it doesnt say....

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I sure wish I could be more help buddy... Luckily for me I haven't had to treat RI yet...

Moved to the Giant Pythons forum. ;)

If you gave the snake a soak there are a few possibilities other than a respiratory infection...

If it were a respiratory infection, you would've noticed some other symptoms a long with it. Crust built up a long the sides of the mouth, and nostrils. Drooling. Inability to breathe with its mouth closed, wheezing, heavy breathing, etc.

A good possibility is that the snake had drank some water, and after being handled from the soak and acting out aggressively, it expelled some. Some of the water may have mixed with the mucus, and other bile, in the throat and stomach, to give you that foamy appearance. You'll have that occasionally when they have a fresh drink, and are recently handled, or move a lot. They'll even drool a bit out, or vomit some out.

What I would do is keep your temps steady at 89-90F on the warm side for now, with the cool end sitting at around 84F. Keep your humidity at around 60%, and wait it out. See if the symptoms persist. If they do, then look into treatment.

ok so i'll wait for a couple of days and see if its still there

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Originally Posted by Tho3ban

ok so i'll wait for a couple of days and see if its still there

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Make sure to check your temperatures and humidity, to ensure they're correct during that waiting period.

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Originally Posted by AndrewH

If you gave the snake a soak there are a few possibilities other than a respiratory infection...

If it were a respiratory infection, you would've noticed some other symptoms a long with it. Crust built up a long the sides of the mouth, and nostrils. Drooling. Inability to breathe with its mouth closed, wheezing, heavy breathing, etc.

A good possibility is that the snake had drank some water, and after being handled from the soak and acting out aggressively, it expelled some. Some of the water may have mixed with the mucus, and other bile, in the throat and stomach, to give you that foamy appearance. You'll have that occasionally when they have a fresh drink, and are recently handled, or move a lot. They'll even drool a bit out, or vomit some out.

What I would do is keep your temps steady at 89-90F on the warm side for now, with the cool end sitting at around 84F. Keep your humidity at around 60%, and wait it out. See if the symptoms persist. If they do, then look into treatment.

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Excellent words, Andrew...thank goodness we've got the internet and helpful keepers to extend help to our community members who don't have access to vets!

Let us know how your baby does! *hug*

The general dosage for Baytril would be 5mg/kg with a max dose of 10mg/kg in severe cases. You would need to calculate in the mg/ml concentration of Baytril that you have and the weight of your snake (in kg) to figure out the dose. I just want to add that I am not a vet but I have done it once before and it worked for me. That is the only reason that I am putting this out here. Since you cant go to a vet, you may have to just try it on your own if the symptoms get worse/dont go away in a couple days. Make sure you double check every step of your math and measurements before you try to inject anything into your snake though. Good luck!

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Originally Posted by cassandra

Excellent words, Andrew...

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I try :D lol.

5% is equal to 50mg/ml, just like the 2.27% is 22.7mg/ml. Baytril is administered every 24-48 hours IM(intramuscularly) ALONG WITH SALINE, to prevent burns and scarring.

Weigh the snake in kilograms, multiply that number by 5 or 7(mg/kg) and then divide that number by 50(mg/ml).

weight x dosage
% concentration

So, if the snake weighs, say 25lbs which is 11.2kg, you would take the 11.2, multiply it by 5(or 7 for a higher dose), which equals 56(this is the dosage in milligrams that the snake is getting). You then take 56 and divide it by 50, which is the concentration of the drug. This equals 1.12. This last number is measured in milliliters(mL), and is the dose that you will draw up in the syrine and administer to the snake.

But weigh the snake first(either in lbs or kg and I can help you convert).

To me, those look like RI bubbles and not mucous mixed with water bubbles.

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Originally Posted by SatanicIntention

5% is equal to 50mg/ml, just like the 2.27% is 22.7mg/ml. Baytril is administered every 24-48 hours IM(intramuscularly) ALONG WITH SALINE, to prevent burns and scarring.

Weigh the snake in kilograms, multiply that number by 5 or 7(mg/kg) and then divide that number by 50(mg/ml).

weight x dosage
% concentration

So, if the snake weighs, say 25lbs which is 11.2kg, you would take the 11.2, multiply it by 5(or 7 for a higher dose), which equals 56(this is the dosage in milligrams that the snake is getting). You then take 56 and divide it by 50, which is the concentration of the drug. This equals 1.12. This last number is measured in milliliters(mL), and is the dose that you will draw up in the syrine and administer to the snake.

But weigh the snake first(either in lbs or kg and I can help you convert).

To me, those look like RI bubbles and not mucous mixed with water bubbles.

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will do! thanks alot!!

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Originally Posted by SatanicIntention

To me, those look like RI bubbles and not mucous mixed with water bubbles.

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To me, they look the opposite. RI bubbles are a little thicker and discolored. Those are somewhat clear, and thin.

Honestly, there should have been other noticeable symptoms a long with this "if" it were RI. There is no reason to jump that far into treatment if its unknown as to what the problem is so far..

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SatanicIntention

5% is equal to 50mg/ml, just like the 2.27% is 22.7mg/ml. Baytril is administered every 24-48 hours IM(intramuscularly) ALONG WITH SALINE, to prevent burns and scarring.

Weigh the snake in kilograms, multiply that number by 5 or 7(mg/kg) and then divide that number by 50(mg/ml).

weight x dosage
% concentration

So, if the snake weighs, say 25lbs which is 11.2kg, you would take the 11.2, multiply it by 5(or 7 for a higher dose), which equals 56(this is the dosage in milligrams that the snake is getting). You then take 56 and divide it by 50, which is the concentration of the drug. This equals 1.12. This last number is measured in milliliters(mL), and is the dose that you will draw up in the syrine and administer to the snake.

But weigh the snake first(either in lbs or kg and I can help you convert).

To me, those look like RI bubbles and not mucous mixed with water bubbles.

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Its about 1 Kg ... from 900 gm to 1000 gm

Edit:
Length: 125
Weight: 1 kg between 900 gm and 1000 gm

I've not seen RI bubbles that were discolored until the snake was in the later(aka death-causing) stages. That's when you start getting mucopurulent material coming out of their lungs.

Water bubbles are bigger, at least in my eyes and don't have the same viscosity. They pop easily, whereas RI bubbles are very viscous and create a film(makes everything slimy).

If you can hold your head up to his/her side and listen to the lung, you'll be able to hear cracks and pops and wheezes if the snake indeed has an infection. Also look for yawning, holding the mouth open slightly to breathe, labored breathing(faster respirations in a calm snake).

If the snake weighs 1kg, the dosage is 5mg/kg, so the snake needs 0.1mL every 48 hours for 3-4 weeks. ONLY IF the snake has a respiratory infection.

Baytril never worked for my snakes that had RI's. Fortaz has been working really well for me though. Hope your baby gets better.

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Originally Posted by pythontricker

Baytril never worked for my snakes that had RI's. Fortaz has been working really well for me though. Hope your baby gets better.

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I think yours is a special case from whay I've read and is not be the fault of the Baytril. Not everything is healed with Baytril, which is why cultures are so necessary to begin with.

Baytril is good and has always worked for me with other animals. But then again, I was working with a knowledgeable vet.

I met someone today who happens to be having lots of pet snakes in his place, and i told him about my snake and what i was going to inject it with , he told me injecting the snake my destroy an organ of the snake , then he gave me this powder thing he said it was an antibiotic he told me to put the powder in a tub filled with water and put the snake in for 3-5 minuts for 3 days, he said it will help alot if the snake was drinking it (i tried but it didnt even drink the water).....does anyone have an idea what this is???

here are some pics:
http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p...0/DSC00704.jpg
http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p...0/DSC00703.jpg

Terramycin? (I put the wrong link first, this ones correct)
http://www.pfizerah.com/product_over...ang=EN&drug=TW

Baytril will not destroy the liver like he's trying to tell you. I'd trust Becky (satanicintention) She is a RVT, and has worked extensively in a vet's office. She knows her stuff!

i noticed that the eyes are getting a little whiter and its belly is like pink..is this good?

Usually that means they are going blue for a shed... I would NOT soak him in terramycin any more.

Baytril is fairly mild and as long as you keep him hydrated, his liver and kidneys will remain flushed out. I would NOT use the terramycin, it's normally for eye infections and likely won't do a thing for the snake if it has a respiratory infection.

I would wait until after he sheds and check his mouth and listen to his lung before starting treatment. If he is still wheezing, popping or has bubbles in his mouth, then he DOES need to be on a good antibiotic for at least a month. This is to ensure that the bacteria is completely gone.

Injections need to be given in the muscles to the side of the spine, in the first 1/3 of the snake's body. They have a renal portal system and the medication will just be filtered out of the body and will be useless if you give the injection any lower than halfway down their body.

Get some plain sterile saline from your vet and mix that with the Baytril ONLY when you're drawing it up to give the injection. Draw up the Baytril first, then draw up 0.5-1.0cc of saline with it, swish it around a bit to mix, and then inject. This will prevent burning and scarring and the snake won't mind it as much. After you have injected and are pulling the needle out, put your finger over the injection site and hold pressure. You can rub the medication into the muscle too, to help it disperse instead of seeping out of the skin.

my snake didn't shed yet...now her eyes are completly milky whitish it has been 3 days .. i also found something very annoying.. i was looking closely at the snakes head and found some little Bugs walking on her .. i found 3 actually ! what is that? is it harmful ? :confused:

Sounds like mites! I would order this product

http://www.pro-products.com/miteandtemp.html

Follow the directions, and usually one treatment of the cage will irradticate any mites and eggs.

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Originally Posted by littleindiangirl

Sounds like mites! I would order this product

http://www.pro-products.com/miteandtemp.html

Follow the directions, and usually one treatment of the cage will irradticate any mites and eggs.

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they don't take visa's and they dont do international orders (kuwait) :(
can i get rid of this with my powder medicine or anyother way?

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Originally Posted by Tho3ban

they don't take visa's and they dont do international orders (kuwait) :(
can i get rid of this with my powder medicine or anyother way?

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No, the powder is an anti-bacterial used for cows drinking water to treat some bacteria in the gut that I don't recall the name for...

Here is another website I got from Google, I don't know if this will work for you.
http://www.worldpetstore.com/prov6oz.html


If not....
Have any bleach? It will be VERY hard to treat all the mites this way, especially with a large burmese...

Switch out his bedding to a paper towel or newspaper. Leave all decorations out of his cage except for a plastic water bowl.

Wash his cage with a mixture of bleach and water. 1 oz for 1 gallon solution, Soak all of his things in it to kill any eggs or mites. Clean the enclosure thoroughly, making sure to get all the nooks and crannies.

When done, rinse very well, so there is no residue left behind.

Bathe the snake in some water with a few drops of dishsoap, that will only kill any adult mites on him.

You should redo these steps after 2 weeks again, and then after 2 weeks do it again. Even so, you may still miss some mites or eggs themselves. This is not a fool proof solution and takes a lot of work.

Mites are nocturnal, so you may never see them on the snake itself...

should i do that right away or should i wait for the snake to shed? her eyes are veery milky now and her skin is alot brighter than before ..it has been like 4 days but nothing happened..

Which one? The Provent a mite or the bleaching of her enclosure?

Provent a mite you can do as soon as you get the can. You don't actually use the PAM on the snake itself, but on the enclosure and perhaps the surrounding area. That's why it's so effective because of the residual effect of the spray. I believe I read somewhere that it's effective for up to a month, effectively killing all the adults, eggs and any strays that happen to wander onto it. Usually it takes only one treatment to rid all of the mites.

The 1 oz for 1 gallon solution bleaching of the entirety of the large enclosure and furniture is not anywhere near as effective and will take persistence for many weeks. I'm not sure how easily burmese shed, but you'll want to do everything at once.

With the bleaching of the enclosure, you will have to treat several times just to be sure you got all of the eggs, killing adults isn't so hard, but once the eggs hatch, you'll be re-infested in no time at all.

I would do a search for Provent-a-mite, or Black Knight II. Both are incredibly effective, it's just up to you to find a seller that ships internationally. The website in my last post says they ship internationally, and the PAM is actually on sale for $19. Well worth it, especially since it is so effective, you'll have the can for a long time.