ASF Litter sizes

Hey, I just had my 2nd litter of ASF rats which is good but the litter sizes are really small. I know sometimes when its the girls first time producing they have small litters but only 8 babies in one and 5 in another? Am I doing something wrong? How do you get litter sizes up? Is there better protein combos? Seems so not worth the time money and effort at this point :-(

It really depends on the ASF. You can't expect the same size litter you would get out of a normal rat. These are different species.

I've gotten twelve at my highest, but I've only had a few litters. :] I'm sure there have been plenty others with lots more in their litters.

Try giving the females that you want to be pregnant different, more nutritious food. I've heard that food can make a difference. But don't count me on that one. :]

what size are your breeding groups and what is the size of there enclosures?

Ive had 2 litters, both moms were first time breeders. First litter was 12 and second was 17. Mine are kept in 1.2 trios and fed Mazuri

We keep ours in a 1.2 trios. We have found that if you let them grow up a little we usually get about 20 per litter feeding kent 23% rodent diet. We do add a little alfafa to help the mothers nurse. but I do know that if you have smaller asf they do not produce as well. Some friends of ours soft furs are not as large as ours and don't produce the numbers we do.

My first 2 litters were 17 and 15. ( I believe, I counted 6 times lol) First time mothers, un-related, and on Mazuri 6F.

It will increase as they get bigger, as long as they are not over crouded. If your adults are smaller then average, freshen the blood line up!

So in a 20 gallon long whats a good ratio is 1:3 ok?... I give Nutriphase rat/mouse food.
Crude Protein (min) 16.0%
Crude Fat (min) 7.0%
Crude Fiber (max) 10.0%
Moisture (max) 12.0%

I supplement that with the Kaytee forti diet which as 21% protein but they dont really eat it much. Most just gets buried in the bedding. Like I said I try and supplement with crickets once a week, I give lots of veggies and fruit. What am I doing wrong?

What is a good size adult female for breeding? My girls aren't that big but they are like 6 months old. I think there like 65grams

That sounds about right to me. Have they been inbred for a while? I'm not sure on nutriphase, but it sorta sounds like that mix seed crap... Kaytee I KNOW is crap...

This is a good diet. Fed with a high quality lab block or dog food.
http://www.ball-pythons.net/forums/s...ad.php?t=28391

not as far as I know I picked them up from a guy by me and hes pretty good with rotations and what not. I thought it might be that too but it seems unlikely. Are my protein percentages to low?

The protein sounds okay, but the overall ingredients does have a play into the quality of feed as well. If it's a mix, more than likely the rats will pick out what they like the best, and not necessarily what they need.

Like I said, I don't recall nutriphase, but I do know Katyee is pretty certifiable as overpriced crap.

Thanks for the help I really appreciate it. I think I'm going to try some of that dog food mix It seems pretty intense but hey if it gets my animals healthier I'll do it. Pretty much the dog food, fruit mix, and good wheat source should do it right.

Yea, I just feed mine the Mazuri lab blocks, and give them treats of seeds and veggies. Works out well. :D

Well I'm gona go with you on he Kaytee lab blocks as crap because the rats seem to have no interest in them. The dog food vs maruzi is just off personal preference huh? Do you usually get that offline or do stores carry it?

Anyone have a consensus on whether I'm better off going with the Mazuri 6f or a dog food?

I buy Mazuri from any Purina dealer. I have a local feed store that orders it for me all the time.

I would say mazuri over the dog food, simply because it's already made for rats and their needs and really doesnt require any supplements.
If you can't get Mazuri, the dog food will work otherwise.

I assume your using the 6f correct?

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Originally Posted by njdevils783

I assume your using the 6f correct?

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Yup, :P

I have been using 6f too and we have nice large litters. I really like Mazuri and any feed store can order it for you if they don't carry it on the shelf normally.

http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p...9/LastScan.jpg

This is a tag off the mazuri bags that we feed.

Thanks everyone for all your help, I'll be picking some up this week. :-)

I've got two main sources for my ASF's. The first colony is a little smaller and had first litters of about 8 and a record so far of 13 for a later litter. The nice thing about this colony is that they don't bite.

Just got a first litter from a new bigger animal colony and I couldn't believe how wide the girl got before having 17 babies. The down side is these ones act like they would bite given the chance.

So now I'm going to try to set up hybrid colonies and see if I can eventually get the good temperament with the large size and litters. Anyone try this yet and find it hard to do (i.e. maybe a gene that makes my first colony nice also actually makes them less prolific or the same gene that makes big litters promotes aggression)? I suspect it's just that one source was selectively bred for temperament and the other for production and you tend to loose ground on whatever you aren't actively selecting for.

I’m feeding 6F with a supplement of millet based bird seed which they really seem to like and I was told helps babies grow faster. Apart from the biting which I seem to have accidently gotten some good genes for my only complaint about ASF’s so far is slow grow out. Since they don’t eat much I guess it doesn’t matter as long as I set up enough grow out tubs and eventually get the pipeline full. I’m thinking wean at 4 weeks and then grow out another 4 weeks?