pastels and spiders?

so i have a few questions first off

1.what do i get when i breed a pastel to a spider?

2. how do you make a killer bee?

3. is there a way to make a spider?

4. what do you get when you breed a pastel to a pastel?

thanx

pastel to spider = bumble bee

killer bee not sure

pastel to pastel = super pastel

only way to make a spider is to buy a spider and breed it

Pastel to spider = 25% Bumblebee, 25% Spider, 25% Pastel, 25% Normal

Killer bee = A super pastel spider, so either by breeding two bumblebees or by breeding a spider to a superpastel, or a bumblebe to a pastel, or by breeding a killer bee to a normal and hoping, or to a pastel.

Pastel x Pastel = 25% Super pastel, 50% pastel, 25% normal

You must breed a spider to a normal in order to get a spider.

*Ugh* this whole killer bee thing again...

Super pastel to spider will NOT give you a killer bee...

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Originally Posted by panthercz

*Ugh* this whole killer bee thing again...

Super pastel to spider will NOT give you a killer bee...

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well then why dont u correct them?
The Killer bee Spider is a result of crossing a Bumble Bee with a Pastel Jungle.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by panthercz

*Ugh* this whole killer bee thing again...

Super pastel to spider will NOT give you a killer bee...

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hahahahahahaha

Here we go again, I think I'll keep my mouth shut on this one

so a killer bee could be te result of bumble bee to bumble bee

bumble bee to pastel. but a super pastel to a spider will give you bumble bees both parents need the pastel gene

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Originally Posted by Spider

well then why dont u correct them?

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Because 10 other people will chime in with wrong answers anyway and you end up with a thread like this one: http://www.ball-pythons.net/forums/s...ghlight=killer

It seems very few people understand a punnet square so why bother trying to explain how and why a killer bee is a super pastel spider, but *not* a super pastel bred to a spider.

oh thanx so much, genetics are so confusing but oddly this time i get it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by panthercz

Because 10 other people will chime in with wrong answers anyway and you end up with a thread like this one: http://www.ball-pythons.net/forums/s...ghlight=killer

It seems very few people understand a punnet square so why bother trying to explain how and why a killer bee is a super pastel spider, but *not* a super pastel bred to a spider.

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SORRY!!!!!!!:8::rofl:

Wouldnt a super pastel X spider give you bumble bees, spiders, and pastels? Well in theory.

...and normals!

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Originally Posted by starmom

...and normals!

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Well I was thinking of a ideal clutch lol. :D (fine you caught me i forgot)

super pastel to a spider will give you bumble-bees and pastels only. You will NOT get normals and you will not get a plain spider. Because a SUPER pastel will make every single animal a pastel. There for if you get a spider it will automatically have the pastel gene, therefore making it a bumble bee.

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Originally Posted by starmom

...and normals!

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Super pastels do not throw normals...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by starmom

...and normals!

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Sorry, you will get no normals breeding a superpastel to anything. Everything will at least be a pastel. Breeding a superpastel to a spider will give you pastels and bumblebees. Thats all.

Hmmm...grabbing more coffee and another piece of paper for punnet squares.....another eraser too :D

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Originally Posted by starmom

Hmmm...grabbing more coffee and another piece of paper for punnet squares.....another eraser too :D

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The Co-dominant section should help:
http://www.ballpython.ca/genetics.html

I'd also like to direct our newer members to a great sticky at the top of this very forum to help explain genetics:

http://www.ball-pythons.net/forums/s...ad.php?t=52847

The basic thing to remember, and if you get it you can figure everything else out, is that genes come in pairs - one from mom and one from dad.

With the exception of some gender chromosome genes each animal has two of everything. Each offspring gets one and only one of the two copies of each gene from dad and likewise from mom. That pair, one from dad and one from mom then make up the set the offspring has available to pick from when passing on a single copy to the next generation.

Another important concept is that there are many many different gene locations. So there are many different "normal" gene versions, at least one for each location. In general, each of the mutations we have seen so far in ball pythons is at a different location with its own different normal version. A notable exception is the white snake complex (lesser, mojave, phantom, Vin Russo, latte, possibly others) where there appears to be a number of different mutations of the same gene.

When the pair of genes for a certain location match that is refereed to as the homozygous genotype. When the pair is different (i.e. one mutant and one normal) then it's the heterozygous genotype. A homozygous normal for albino has two normal versions of the albino gene, one from each parent. A homozygous albino got the albino mutation from each parent. And a homozygous pastel (aka super pastel) got the pastel mutation from each parent. We can always figure out which version of a gene an animal that is homozygous will pass on because it doesn't have a 2nd type to pick from. A super pastel will always give the pastel mutant version of the pastel gene because it doesn't have the normal version of the pastel gene to give. Likewise, you can't produce a super pastel without the pastel gene being present on both sides because each parent can only give one copy and both must give pastel to create super/homozygous pastel.

Now spider has proven to be at a different gene location from pastel. So each parent gives one copy of the gene at the pastel location and also one copy of the gene at the separate spider location. A just plain pastel is homozygous normal for the spider gene so will always give the normal for spider copy along with one or the other of its pastel copies (either normal for pastel or the pastel mutant copy). A bumblebee can give either known versions of the pastel gene (normal for pastel or mutant pastel) and either known versions of the spider gene (normal for spider or spider mutant).

A Punnett's square is a way of looking at all the possible different combinations each parent could give and putting them together in all possible combinations. Each square then represents a possible outcome for one egg and the number of like squares compared to the total number of squares then represents the likelihood of that outcome. But as long as you can remember the two copies each parent has and if the mutations you are interested in are different genes or not you should be able to figure anything out using the principle that each parent contributes one of their two copies of each gene to the offspring.