Please look over a newbie's checklist!

My wife and I are pretty die-hard animal lovers and through a bit of trouble with my 29g planted aquarium, I happen to have two of these tanks (30" L x 12" W x 18" T) available that I do not trust to hold water. My wife has already claimed one for a Crested Gecko that we will be getting in about three weeks, and once that terrarium is settled I would like to get a Ball Python for the other one.

I've been doing a lot of reading, and I consider myself a conscientious pet owner so I'd like to get a some opinions form more experienced herp owners to ensure I'm not making any missteps.

I have already:

29g Aquarium
Zilla Wire Mesh Top w/ 8 clips

I'm planning on purchasing:

Under tank heater - 8" x 8" or 8" x 12"
CHE bulb/lamp
2 identical hides
Large water dish
2 digital thermomter/hygrometer combos

For decorations (I greatly prefer the natural look) I was going to make a background out of polystyrene foam coated with sand, painted and sealed with a hard matte sealer, a substrate of repti-bark or coconut fibre over a repti-carpet base, and a combination of driftwood and plastic plants.

The terrarium will be in my basement which does have a very low average temperature, so I don't want to undersize my heating pads or CHE.

Does this sound like a good start? Anything else I need to consider?

Thanks!

Sounds nice. Just a few suggestions:

Loose the repticarpet!! DO NOT use that stuff as it is torture to clean and harbors bacteria like nothing else. Instead, use a layer of newspaper/newsprint under your substrate layer. Much easier to clean and cheaper.

Be sure to get a thermostat to control your UTH! It can be anything from the $30 ReptiTemp from ZooMed to a $110+ Herpstat, but make sure you have your heat sources controlled.

I would recommend staying away from a CHE if you can help it and instead using a second UTH if needed for the cool side and a regular bulb of 50watts or less for ambient. CHE's really drain the humidity of any enclosure.

That background sounds awesome, but make sure you also cover the two sides as well as the back for security.

I think that's about it. Otherwise it sounds good. :) I'm sure others will add anything I forgot.

Sounds good, the carpet is out then. I was going to cover three sides with the styrofoam as well, it should almost look like a creivce or gully when it's done. In theory anyhow.

The thermostat is no trouble, I meant to include it in the list. So should I get two UTHs, two thermostats, a double-duty daylight and basking bulb, and a nighttime bulb then? Is that sufficient for a room that hovers at the mid-to-low 60s?

you dont really need a day and night bulb with a bp if there is a decent amount of ambient light during the day.i use a black bulb all day and the day night cycle from my bearded dragons tank lights the room enough for my bp during the day

I do need a basking bulb though, so won't that double as a day bulb anyhow?

As for ambient light, there will be a TON. This tank will be about eight to ten feet away from my Reef when it is set up. That tank is pumping out over 650w of T5HO lighting...

None of that light will be direct, as the reflectors do a good job of pointing it all downwards, but it will light up the room pretty well.

yea i just meant you dont need a regular white bulb and a night bulb you could just use a black bulb all day

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Originally Posted by beardieguy

yea i just meant you dont need a regular white bulb and a night bulb you could just use a black bulb all day

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I'm not sure I understand what you mean by 'black bulb'?

ditch the CHE. also cover 1/2 to 3/4 on the screen top tp hold in humidity.

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Originally Posted by TheKingInYellow

I'm not sure I understand what you mean by 'black bulb'?

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A blacklight bulb.

You could also use a moonlight bulb. They don't make the whole room glow purple like blacklight bulbs do. :)

With room temps that low, I would certainly get two UTHs and two t-stats, and add a lamp over the center for ambient. Since my home is also rather cool, I use a day and night lamp for my tanks to keep up the ambient. My bulbs are only 25watt, though, so not a great deal of light and only just enough heat.

Basking bulb? BPs spend most of their time inside their hides, so their 'basking area' is their warm hide. Hence the use of UTHs. Even when they get out and about, they explore a bit then return to a hide. If you use lamps at all, it should only be low watt to boost ambient air temps in the tank, since you apparently don't need extra lighting. :) P.S. I'd really like to see some pix of that Reef setup! I love a good aquatic tank...

Okay, that makes more sense. I had it in my head that I needed a basking bulb. I might just get a low wattage standard day bulb then, and a red or blue night bulb. I do like to see my animals. I'll certainly do two UTHs and two Thermostats. I'll probably get the 8" x 12" UTHs so that most of the tank will be in contact with a heat source.

Thanks for all the advice.

The reef is still under construction, but I've got all the equipment. It's my other major project to get done before the winter. I just need the stand to be finished, and I'm on my way.

If you want to see where the 29g tank came from, my 29g planted FW log is right here: http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums...d.php?t=145786

Other than a thermostat, and maybe a nightbulb. I would also get something to help the snake feel more enclosed such as a backing on the tank, and maybe some vines or something in side it.

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Originally Posted by the_Ryno

Other than a thermostat, and maybe a nightbulb. I would also get something to help the snake feel more enclosed such as a backing on the tank, and maybe some vines or something in side it.

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Yup, there will be a three-sided wrap around rock wall.

Have you ever considered a reptile cage?

I already have the aquarium due to some problems with them holding water. Rebuying the tank/critter cage is not really an option.

I hear you there. It's the whole 'I already have it, so why not find a good use for it' thing. As long as it's secure, with any cracks siliconed up and a good tight top, there's nothing wrong with using tanks. :) IMO, and in my experience, they actually work BETTER than tubs.

Remember that you are required to post pictures ASAP. :D

No problem with pics. If you look at my 29g build log, there is no shortage of pics there :)

The 29g is perfectly siliconed, there are no cracks, and the seams never actually let go, they just looked bad and I wasn't about to trust that tank with that much water on the floor above my entertainment centre!

Anyhow, made another purchase today. An 11" x 17" ExoTerra UTH for the cool side, and an 8" x 8" ExoTerra UTH for the warm side. Can't find thermostats though. I made another post about trying to find a Canadian online vendor for herp stuff...

I recommend getting your stats from Rich at ReptileBasics.com. I believe plenty of Canadians have ordered from him with little to no trouble, and he is the BEST! :) Good prices, awesome customer service, and great speed with shipping.

Other than that, I'm not sure what to suggest as far as getting supplies up there. :oops:

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Originally Posted by Argentra

I recommend getting your stats from Rich at ReptileBasics.com. I believe plenty of Canadians have ordered from him with little to no trouble, and he is the BEST! :) Good prices, awesome customer service, and great speed with shipping.

Other than that, I'm not sure what to suggest as far as getting supplies up there. :oops:

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Thanks for the tip. In most cases, there is a good online vendor for stuff here, you just have to find them :)

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Originally Posted by Argentra

I hear you there. It's the whole 'I already have it, so why not find a good use for it' thing. As long as it's secure, with any cracks siliconed up and a good tight top, there's nothing wrong with using tanks. :) IMO, and in my experience, they actually work BETTER than tubs.

Remember that you are required to post pictures ASAP. :D

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I agree except in my experience I have reptile cages, but I like them way better than tubs. I think that tubs really prohibit the natural movement that my snakes in the cages have every night. I am working hard to get cages for all my snakes :D

Yoinks those thermostats can get expensive.

Is there any advantage to those over something like this which is a third the cost:

http://www.captaindragonreptilesuppl...p16896206.html

Don't get me wrong, I try not to skimp on areas of animal health or wellness, but I also try to keep reasonable budgets :D

Well, I have a Johnson and a Ranco but I also have 5 of those ZooMed ReptiTemp 500R stats. They are a dial type, and so you have to tweak a lot, but they work. Great for using until you can save up for the bigger better stat. Eventually you should look into getting something more precise, but that will do fine in the meantime.

Currently I'm running my QT BP tubs off two of those, and no problem, even in weird weather Colorado. :)

Okay, I have my ReptiTemps for the moment, and I picked up an IR tempgun too. I've done some checking and it looks like the basement is an ambient temp of about 67 right now. I'm sure it will be a few degress colder in winter.

So, I should have enough heating with the 11"x17" UTH and 8"x8" UTH, but I'm curious about handling. How long is a ball okay out of the heated area in a cooler room? Does it make a difference if they are being held or not?

I think you're going to have a hard time getting the ambients up in the tank with just a UTH; that's pretty cold.... But that's what you do now: get it set up and running and tweak it some and see where it is in a week. Also, you might try some rigid insulation around the sides and back to help keep the heat in.

Well I have to bring the ambient up 13 degrees or so on the cool side, and 20+ on the warm side. I thought UTHs were particularly good at this?

Should I be looking at a species that will handle 5 degrees or so cooler? I can also get Jungle Carpet Pythons, but I'm not sure that this terrarium will be big enough for one...

I do need daylight bulbs for this terrarium anyhow, should I just get a pair of 50w or so clamp lamps and let the temps drop a bit at night?

To some extent but it won't raise the ambients 20 degrees; there is a point when you'll cook the snake :O
Radiant heat panels help a lot with ambient temps but I don't think you can use them in a tank because they are installed on the 'ceiling'.

Hmm, in a room that cold it'll be really hard to get the ambients up without a space heater (which might be a good idea for you). You can raise it a little with lamps, but not enough.

I may have missed it, but what are your temps now on all sides? Have you insulated the tank with cork or foam board?

As for other snakes that could handle those temps, what about a corn? :) They are SO much easier to care for, handle lower temps, and are really sweet. Just to let you know.

I disagree on the carpets; I've used them to great success. I have 2 carpets for each cage, one in the cage and one out that I can clean. The thing I love about th carpets is a) you can cut small holes in the carpet and thread thermostat probes in so that they don't move around and stay right above your UTH and b) your snake can't get to the glass where the UTH is adhered and c) it makes it easy when cleaning the cage; roll up the carpet with aspen, put it in a bag and take it outside to your trash can/dumpster, shake!

Oh, another thing is that the carpet stops a lot of the shifting and rearranging of the subtract that your snakey is bound and determined to do. =)

I wash them with mild dish detergent and a few drops of bleach and rinse really well, then hang outside to dry and cook a bit in the sun. Bam, clean.

You could try a 75w infrared. I run that all day and it heats up the middle and cool side of the tank middle to 85 and the "cold" side to about 78. Good luck!

To answer a few questions:

The tank will have a foam decoration on three sides, varying from 1/2" to 2" in thickness.

Space heater is not really useful in this area, the entire basement is open concept.

I expect temps to increase once the reef aquarium is in. About 235g of water heated to 78 degrees will help with ambient temps.

I have to admit that I'm seriously consider that jungle carpet python now. It can handle the cooler temps, are semi-arboreal (which is something I like) and are not significantly more difficult to keep than BPs.

In any event, I'm not in a huge rush, and I have an advantage. The Crested Gecko tank is going up first with only a 8" x 8" 4w UTH for heat and two cheapo desk lamps with CFLs for Day/Night lighting. I can use my temp gun to monitor the temp in that tank and see what the gradient looks like.

In some ways, jungle carpets are actually easier to keep than balls. They're nowhere near as fussy about food and they don't require as much humidity. You will need a different cage setup in the future, and they start out a little nippy as babies, but most of the time they calm down.

If you go to www.acreptiles.com he has some really good information on carpet python care :gj:

Thanks for the link. There is a local Carpet breeder, and he has Jungles and IJs.

I hate to end up not getting a BP after getting all this advice from BP owners on a BP site, but the Carpet might just be the better chioce for me at the moment.

Well, I grabbed a 100w IR bulb and a reflector today to deal with the ambient temps in the tank. With the heat light, I might swap the 11x17 UTH for another 8x8 that I already have. This gives me two 4w 8x8 UTHs and a 100w heat lamp to bring up my 67 degree-ish ambient temp.

Having said that, after doing some more reading and considering what my ambient temps are like, I've also put a hold on a hatchling female JCP. I think that the JCP will do better with the lower ambient temps and the reduced humidity that goes with it. I also think that a species known to be tricky eaters is not necessarily the best snake for a first time keeper. I know JCPs are more nippy but I've lived with parrots for the last fifteen years. A bite from a JCP will have nothing on the damage caused by an angry Amazon...

I know she'll outgrow the 29g in about 2 years, so at that point, if I'm still loving snakes, I'll get a BP for this tank.

Thank you for your help! I hope I haven't betrayed the BP brother/sisterhood :)

:P I have never ever kept a reptile in my life. One day I went out and bought a Ball Python (Yup after reading hours and hours and setting up the tank and getting everything ready first of course) and mine has had no trouble eating since I bought him. I believe it is really a hit or miss with that. I am a first time owner with a BP and lovin every minute of it :P but hey if another type looks more appealing to you by all means :) and I dont think you have betrayed us.

I'm not naive enough to think that this will be my first and only snake anyhow. A BP may still be in my future, and sooner than I think :D

Thanks to all of you who offered advice. I'm setting up my enclosure today, and I've started a thread over on the Morelia forum if anyone wants to see it and follow along with my first snake experience!

Here's the thread.