2nd failed attempt at feeding frozen... suggestions?

This Monday, I tried again offering a frozen mouse to Luke (whose last meal was a live mouse, on 4/11/08, according to his breeder). He had refused it last week, but I also botched the introduction (this thread). This time around I decided to do it right. I let the mouse thaw on top of his enclosure for a while (there are holes drilled in the lid), then further warmed it up with a heat lamp. (Prescenting.) I'm positive that he could smell it - heck I could smell it after it thawed, and I'm only human. All through this process Luke did not budge from his hide. Mind you he is also particularly sensitive to lights being on or off, and I made sure it was dark in the room. After it thawed completely and was a bit warm, I dropped the mouse in outside his hide (NOT right up in his face :oops:), and still nothing. Left it in overnight, and he did not take.

I forgot how frustrating it can be when they don't eat.

My other snakes are going to eat on Thursday, but I may wait a bit longer before offering again to Luke.

Is it possible that I could keep offering frozen for months and he would never take them? I know he's hungry as I have caught him roaming around at night a few times. How much more time should I not be worried about his not eating, until it is considered unhealthy and I should just go ahead and do live?

Also, I appreciate everyone who answered on my last post - you all are a great help. :)

Have you tried p/k? That could possibly be a good stepping stone, so to speak, to getting him to eat f/t.

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Originally Posted by blueapplepaste

Have you tried p/k? That could possibly be a good stepping stone, so to speak, to getting him to eat f/t.

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I have been considering it. I am just not sure which is the right step to take. Also, I've never killed a live mouse before, and am unsure about it. The paper bag whack method seems more detached than, for example, cutting the spinal cord at the neck. What would you suggest seeing as I don't have a CO2 chamber?

I do understand your wish to feed f/t however I always recommend anyone to feed the same type prey for at least 4 to 6 feedings before attempting any switch.

Remember that changing environment is stressful for a BP, and keeping one thing constant (like feeding) is always a good idea.

Get him to eat for you first, make sure he eats with consistency for you and than try to switch him.

Your priority is to get him to eat for you first and foremost, switching is secondary.

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Originally Posted by Deborah

I do understand your wish to feed f/t however I always recommend anyone to feed the same type prey for at least 4 to 6 feedings before attempting any switch.

Remember that changing environment is stressful for a BP, and keeping one thing constant (like feeding) is always a good idea.

Get him to eat for you first, make sure he eats with consistency for you and than try to switch him.

Your priority is to get him to eat for you first and foremost, switching is secondary.

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That makes sense. I am not opposed to live feeding; I would prefer that he gets on frozen, but I want to do what's best for him first, and best for me second. Now that being said, I do not want to frighten him with the mouse like I did last time. Would it be smart to hold the [live] mouse out to him by tongs, or just let it run around in there (supervised of course) until he figures it out?

I will try and feed him live on Saturday and go from there... thank you for the advice.

And as a further note: Those bamboo tongs are crap! They broke on me not too soon after I bought them, and now they're just awkward chopsticks... :rolleyes: I'm going to see if the pet store has any metal ones.

And by the way, to Kc261, I completely misread your post in the last thread. For some reason I thought that you said to continue feeding frozen for awhile. So just know that I wasn't intentionally ignoring what you said...

Salzedo absolutely refused f/t for a long time, still does, but he has started taking pre-killed which is one step closer. I'd suggest pre-killed.

Getting the snake to recognize the dead rodent as food, and to successfully take it from the feeding tongs, will be a big step in the right direction.

Hope this helps, and good luck!

You can try what my friend did, he took the F/T mouse after he warm it up under the heat lamp his snake still would not take it so he rub it up on a live mouse and then gave it to his snake and his snake took it in no time. So now that's what he does. Hope it helps. almost mine take F/T's except 1 a Cal. king.

I'm going through the same thing right now. Advice I got from the breeder was to continue with live since he's very young. I did so last week, and will probably feed live again once or twice more before attempting to switch to f/t again with him. I believe that once he really settles in here and is not stressed, maybe he will be ready for me to try again. My new amazon tree boa switched for me the same day I brought him home...wish they could all be that easy. After thawing the mouse out, i put it in some pretty hot water for a min or so to really warm it up and he took it right away. Good luck with yours!

I've been lucky to have two real good feeders. In shed, out of their cage, day or night, rats or mice, they both eat very well. I started them on f/t mice and graduated them to /ft small rats. I thaw the rat out for about an hour, then place it in a small sandwich bag and run hot water over it, then feed with tongs.

One day, my male spider wouldn't take the rat. I tried for about ten minutes to gain his interest and he definitely seemed ready to eat, but would not strike it. I decided to leave the rat in his tub for a little while. Ten minutes later it was gone. Since then, he has never taken from the tongs again.

I guess he found his niche as far as feeding goes, I hope yours finds his/hers.

I feed f/t and I put the mouse in a ziploc in one of those food tote things filled with hot tap water for 15 minutes and then put the heat lamp on him on top of Furio's feeding enclosure and he comes right out, I dangle it for a minute or so and BAM!

Happy Snakey :)

Hope this helps in some way if you try f/t again.

how i switched my snakes was i offered them the food, if they didnt take i would offer next week, and i would repeat. until they got hungry enough to eat.

most fed by week 3.
and now that i think about it.
it was kinda cruel lol

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Originally Posted by icygirl

I have been considering it. I am just not sure which is the right step to take. Also, I've never killed a live mouse before, and am unsure about it. The paper bag whack method seems more detached than, for example, cutting the spinal cord at the neck. What would you suggest seeing as I don't have a CO2 chamber?

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I've only ever used a chamber. You can make one somewhat cheap using paintball co2 tanks and what not. I bummed one off a friend that was into paintball, so it was pretty easy. Never tried the other ways.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Deborah

I do understand your wish to feed f/t however I always recommend anyone to feed the same type prey for at least 4 to 6 feedings before attempting any switch.

Remember that changing environment is stressful for a BP, and keeping one thing constant (like feeding) is always a good idea.

Get him to eat for you first, make sure he eats with consistency for you and than try to switch him.

Your priority is to get him to eat for you first and foremost, switching is secondary.

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I agree, established animals can be switched much easier than a new addition who is still transitioning.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by icygirl

This Monday, I tried again offering a frozen mouse to Luke (whose last meal was a live mouse, on 4/11/08, according to his breeder). He had refused it last week, but I also botched the introduction (this thread). This time around I decided to do it right. I let the mouse thaw on top of his enclosure for a while (there are holes drilled in the lid), then further warmed it up with a heat lamp. (Prescenting.) I'm positive that he could smell it - heck I could smell it after it thawed, and I'm only human. All through this process Luke did not budge from his hide. Mind you he is also particularly sensitive to lights being on or off, and I made sure it was dark in the room. After it thawed completely and was a bit warm, I dropped the mouse in outside his hide (NOT right up in his face :oops:), and still nothing. Left it in overnight, and he did not take.

I forgot how frustrating it can be when they don't eat.

My other snakes are going to eat on Thursday, but I may wait a bit longer before offering again to Luke.

Is it possible that I could keep offering frozen for months and he would never take them? I know he's hungry as I have caught him roaming around at night a few times. How much more time should I not be worried about his not eating, until it is considered unhealthy and I should just go ahead and do live?

Also, I appreciate everyone who answered on my last post - you all are a great help. :)

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Is there a reason you are refusing to feed live? I'm sure it's posted here already, just havent' read it all yet.

Edit: I read one of your other questions. PRE-SCENT is critical. Once they start poking their heads out, I throw a mouse in, they take it and I leave the room. When I come back, they've eaten and gone back into their hides. The second mouse, I dangle by hand right outside their hide until I see a head poke out. Then I pullt he mouse back a little and let him go. Successful feeding, everytime.

Don't forget to pre-scent with live too if that's how you decide to go.

Everyone please note, I explained that I did pre-scent with the thawed mouse, but it was a no go. I will definitely be pre-scenting with the live one as well, which will hopefully go better. I haven't forgotten about that!

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Originally Posted by Skoalbasher

Is there a reason you are refusing to feed live? I'm sure it's posted here already, just havent' read it all yet.

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I want all my snakes on frozen, ideally, because it is easiest for me. I prefer to store a lot of frozen rodents rather than care for live ones - plus live rodents would not be welcome at my home, nor in my new apartment (okay, so technically no pets are allowed, but live rodents smell more than snakes do and I don't want to get caught). Thus if I feed live, it means I need to go to the pet store every week to get a mouse, and it is slightly more expensive that way.

Once again I am not morally against live feeding, and I am not refusing to feed live. I just wanted to switch Luke over to frozen, and I guess I was going about it wrong. I will be offering live for the next couple feedings and then I will attempt with frozen again. I will let you know how it goes.

Again, does anyone have suggestions for HOW I should feed live, exactly? E.g., should I dangle the mouse by the scruff on tongs, or should I just release it into the enclosure (supervised)?

I recently got my first ball python, I feed only FT coz I live in the UK...left it a couple of weeks after getting her to attempt the first feed - thawed the mouse, heated using hair dryer - no interest at all. Tried this again a week later, nothing, then another week, nothing again.

After reading some good advise, i defrosted a mouse, left it for 12 hours, re-froze it again, then defrosted and heated with a hair drier...2 seconds in the feeding tub and she had struck and coiled, she ate it straight away. She has done this over and over again - never fails.

Apparently the refreezing breaks down the mouse's cell membranes and makes it easier for the snake to scent...does comprimise the protein content but I feed every 5 days to ensure she gets all the food she needs.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by icygirl

I want all my snakes on frozen, ideally, because it is easiest for me. I prefer to store a lot of frozen rodents rather than care for live ones - plus live rodents would not be welcome at my home, nor in my new apartment (okay, so technically no pets are allowed, but live rodents smell more than snakes do and I don't want to get caught). Thus if I feed live, it means I need to go to the pet store every week to get a mouse, and it is slightly more expensive that way.

Once again I am not morally against live feeding, and I am not refusing to feed live. I just wanted to switch Luke over to frozen, and I guess I was going about it wrong. I will be offering live for the next couple feedings and then I will attempt with frozen again. I will let you know how it goes.

Again, does anyone have suggestions for HOW I should feed live, exactly? E.g., should I dangle the mouse by the scruff on tongs, or should I just release it into the enclosure (supervised)?

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when i feed live, i put the mouse in the enclosure (still in the 'take home' box from the store) for about 10 minutes to prescent. Usually in that time my bp comes out and is hunting. then i open the boxx and gently dump the mouse into the enclosure, outside the hide my bp is in. It sniffs around for a minute or so and as soon as it gets within range for my bp to strike, the deed is done. I like doing it this way because the mouse is relatively calm and is not expecting anything, which means it is less likely to bite, in my opinion.