My ASF trio!

Got my new ASF last saturday. They are more handleable than I thought they would be. One likes to pee when I hold her, but the boy is a doll and the two females are gorgeous.

OK, on to the pictures!


http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...s/IMG_3683.jpg

The boy Gabbagoo!
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...s/IMG_3687.jpg

The girls, ginger and cherry
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...s/IMG_3684.jpg

Cherry
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...s/IMG_3686.jpg

Ginger
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...s/IMG_3688.jpg

The darker female is het for RED like the other fawn. I absolutely refuse to call them albino. The fawns aren't albino, it's a dilution! Speaking of fawn, they have a gorgeous blue grey undercoat, sooo pretty!

The boy is unrelated, put together the day I got them (They're all weanlings). I'm excited to see what I get from them in a few months! :D:D:D

Awwww! I'm getting my little gremlins this weekend from Ed! I can't wait! He said his are pretty handleable as well!

how big are asfs? do they get the same size as normal rats?

Awwww love the fawn. Mine are all grey and white...all 50 or so of them! They breed fast...I always have babies! Good luck with them!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by aaramire

how big are asfs? do they get the same size as normal rats?

---

They grow slower than regular rats and get to be about the size of a medium rat....bigger than mice

Very cute!

enjoy holding them now. Once the babies are here, that will be a distant memmory!

Robin, You are getting some devil dogs???? I thought you didn't like ASF's!? Why the change?


Mike

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OhBalls

They grow slower than regular rats and get to be about the size of a medium rat....bigger than mice

---

I must raise big rats then because no way my adult ASF's are the size of my medium rats LOL. I'd say an adult ASF is about 2 to 2.5 times bigger (by weight) than an adult mouse.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by frankykeno

I must raise big rats then because no way my adult ASF's are the size of my medium rats LOL. I'd say an adult ASF is about 2 to 2.5 times bigger (by weight) than an adult mouse.

---

I agree Jo.

And they are either hot or cold about handling. Either they let you pick them up, or they bloody you every time they can..little stinkers! They are great and breed FAST....I started with about 20 last year and I've been through hundreds so far...weaning about 20 a week.....

You got it right, Charlie. They seem to have no middle road temperment wise LOL. Boy are they protective of their young too, especially the males!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by mcavana

Very cute!

enjoy holding them now. Once the babies are here, that will be a distant memmory!

Robin, You are getting some devil dogs???? I thought you didn't like ASF's!? Why the change?


Mike

---

The change is for some stubborn feeders, and feedback from Joanna on how her stubborn feeders are now feeding great on ASF's.

I'm hoping to get enough ASF to minimize the numbers I need from my regular rats. I won't ever get rid of my regular rats, but I'd like to focus differently with them in the future.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by mcavana

Very cute!

enjoy holding them now. Once the babies are here, that will be a distant memmory!

Robin, You are getting some devil dogs???? I thought you didn't like ASF's!? Why the change?


Mike

---

Speaking of which, I was giving bananas to them this morning, and the boy decided he didn't want to be held and took a nip at me. I surprised because I looked at my finger later and I was bleeding a bit. LOL, they are adorable. At least it didn't hurt! :P

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by littleindiangirl

I'm hoping to get enough ASF to minimize the numbers I need from my regular rats. I won't ever get rid of my regular rats, but I'd like to focus differently with them in the future.

---

Same here - if they produce like bunnies like Ed's experiencing, then I may see about keeping my permanent collection on them. I've also heard positive feedback from people that their snakes convert easily from them to rats, so I'll also see what my experience will be. They certainly would be space savers!

Cool!

Does anyone notice males growing faster than females? My males all shot past my females in terms of growth...

Oh and my wife found out the hard way that ASF's aren't nice. :P She tried picking one up last week and she said it was like picking up a little Tasmanian devil. :taz: Her finger paid the ultimate price... :D

I know my mature ASF male isn't all that much heftier than the females. Not nearly the size difference I see in my regular rats when you compare the big males to the females.

Perhaps when we breed more of these we'll switch more snakes over. For now they really are just for certain of our snakes, because I'm concerned about possibilities of prey imprinting as well as the ASF's taking a long time to hit mature size for our larger snakes. One of our bigger BP rescues can easily take 4 or 5 weanling ASF's at a feeding and that knocks down a litter of them pretty fast.

Other than that they aren't as easy to manage when it comes to cage cleaning. I really don't like having to handle them due to the tendency to bite first and think afterwards LOL. I'm so used to my mild mannered regular rats that when I have to move ASF's to do a full enclosure clean, I go get Mike to do it. They are also, for me anyways, WAY harder to sex at a young age and I'm finding I make a lot of mistakes trying to seperate them by gender to grow out enclosures.

At this point we have all the ASF's in glass but I'd love to hear people's experience keeping them in plastic bins in racks. I'm concerned about chewing out and escapes. We had one get away on us, we did manage to catch her 2 days later but I lived in dread of a feral colony of ASF's infesting this massive, old house.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by aaramire

how big are asfs? do they get the same size as normal rats?

---

Those ones right there are about the same size as a mouse... and they guy we got them from said they are weaned. I don't know how many weeks that is, but they sure are small. When I got them I was expecting the size of a gerbil or something LOL. I dont know why I was expecting that, but I'm really hoping these little guys breed like crazy.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by frankykeno

At this point we have all the ASF's in glass but I'd love to hear people's experience keeping them in plastic bins in racks. I'm concerned about chewing out and escapes. We had one get away on us, we did manage to catch her 2 days later but I lived in dread of a feral colony of ASF's infesting this massive, old house.

---

I have half of my ASF groups in plastic bins and racks....I put pieces of wood and timothy hay in with them to keep them occupied...But so far (knocks on wood) I have no problem with chewing the plastic...

on a side note..I switched all of my mousers to ASF..very easily...I feel that an ASF is a hardier meal instead of a few mice...but thats just me...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by littleindiangirl

Those ones right there are about the same size as a mouse... and they guy we got them from said they are weaned. I don't know how many weeks that is, but they sure are small. When I got them I was expecting the size of a gerbil or something LOL. I dont know why I was expecting that, but I'm really hoping these little guys breed like crazy.

---

Weaner ASF's are about 2" or so..they look so small and young but they are weaned...lol

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by frankykeno

At this point we have all the ASF's in glass but I'd love to hear people's experience keeping them in plastic bins in racks. I'm concerned about chewing out and escapes. We had one get away on us, we did manage to catch her 2 days later but I lived in dread of a feral colony of ASF's infesting this massive, old house.

---

All of mine are in glass... you don't want to take a chance with devil dogs. even one escapee would be a disaster. They can thrive on very little water, and little food. and they reproduce better then any other rodent I know of. not a nice recepie for a loose rodent in the house.

Plus, I think we really need to be careful with them as a society. If a few of them get loose, and start doing there thing, I GUARANTEE you they will become totally and completely illegal in the states. To be honest, I am surprised there isn't already a ban on them. Once they get out there, they will be here for good. You think people get freaked out about a few loose snakes? Wait until a neighbor catches the first ASF that is "invading the neighborhood."

Lets be careful folks.

Mike

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by frankykeno

I must raise big rats then because no way my adult ASF's are the size of my medium rats LOL. I'd say an adult ASF is about 2 to 2.5 times bigger (by weight) than an adult mouse.

---

Sounds about right.....regular rats don't make it that long around here :P....so I'm thinking medium to be slightly larger than an ASF ....also, I only breed asf....not regular rats so I tend to buy for appropriate size....but you're right they are about 2, 2.5 the size of adult mice...i agree

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by frankykeno

I know my mature ASF male isn't all that much heftier than the females. Not nearly the size difference I see in my regular rats when you compare the big males to the females.

Perhaps when we breed more of these we'll switch more snakes over. For now they really are just for certain of our snakes, because I'm concerned about possibilities of prey imprinting as well as the ASF's taking a long time to hit mature size for our larger snakes. One of our bigger BP rescues can easily take 4 or 5 weanling ASF's at a feeding and that knocks down a litter of them pretty fast.

Other than that they aren't as easy to manage when it comes to cage cleaning. I really don't like having to handle them due to the tendency to bite first and think afterwards LOL. I'm so used to my mild mannered regular rats that when I have to move ASF's to do a full enclosure clean, I go get Mike to do it. They are also, for me anyways, WAY harder to sex at a young age and I'm finding I make a lot of mistakes trying to seperate them by gender to grow out enclosures.

At this point we have all the ASF's in glass but I'd love to hear people's experience keeping them in plastic bins in racks. I'm concerned about chewing out and escapes. We had one get away on us, we did manage to catch her 2 days later but I lived in dread of a feral colony of ASF's infesting this massive, old house.

---

I was wondering the same thing....mine climb up the water bottle and chew the plastic rim of the tank.....I have three cats and a terrier that THINKS he's a better mouser than the cats, but I too would like to switch if possible....

even though I keep little wooden chews, hay, corn cobs and even corn "licks" (usually for birds, like a salt lick but made out of corn...they love 'em)...they still chew on anything....including me...LOL

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by frankykeno

Perhaps when we breed more of these we'll switch more snakes over. For now they really are just for certain of our snakes, because I'm concerned about possibilities of prey imprinting as well as the ASF's taking a long time to hit mature size for our larger snakes.

---

Keep in mind. bout a month ago I started a thread on this exact subject... the fear of once you feed ASF, they won't go back to rats.

Well, lots of people posted, and there was not a single person who said there snakes were not willing to take rats after feeding ASF's. Not a single person.

Does that mean it is impossible? of course not. Does it suggest that you likely won't have a problem switching back to rats if need be? YES.

Also, yes they take longer to grow... more than twice as long. but when you figure in that the smell is nothing compared to rats..... and when you consider that they eat probably 1/3 as much as same size rats.... You can keep twice as many with LESS smell, and LESS food, and LESS upkeep as rats.



Mike

For those concerned with chewing, I have exercise wheels in with mine and they spend so much time on those they haven't touched any of the chew toys I've offered. Nor do they display any behavior that resembles any form of trying to escape. :cool:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by panthercz

For those concerned with chewing, I have exercise wheels in with mine and they spend so much time on those they haven't touched any of the chew toys I've offered. Nor do they display any behavior that resembles any form of trying to escape. :cool:

---

Great idea :)...I have considered that....I won't use a metal wheel for any long tailed rodent as I have pulled one too many tangled tails out of them...a solid wheel would work great if I could find a metal one.....

hmmmm.....there's an idea for a weekend project!

Those are actually some pretty looking rodents. I especially like that golden looking one. All the ASF's/Multimammates I've seen before have always looked kind of rougher and wilder. I guess it looks like they're really domesticated now. Will that affect their scent or appeal to wild ball pythons?

Does anyone know where I can get a trio of these in NW indiana/illinois? I've been looking every where and I can't find anything

I am thinking of switching over to only ASF's mainly because they have NO odor that I can smell. I got my first trio in march and havent changed the bedding yet. It doesnt appear soiled and still smells like fresh-cut wood shavings. Should I change it anyway??? I have probably changed my rat bedding about 3 times since then... How often do you guys completely clean the cages out for ASF's? Also, I know ASF's take longer to grow, but how long does it actually take to reach their adult size? A few months? More?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MarkS

Those are actually some pretty looking rodents. I especially like that golden looking one. All the ASF's/Multimammates I've seen before have always looked kind of rougher and wilder. I guess it looks like they're really domesticated now. Will that affect their scent or appeal to wild ball pythons?

---

All of the ones from the guy were solid colored with the light head stripe. He says all he has are fawns and het for fawns in his colony. I absolutely love the fawns and can't wait to see what the new blood from the male throws.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Corrupter

I am thinking of switching over to only ASF's mainly because they have NO odor that I can smell. I got my first trio in march and havent changed the bedding yet. It doesnt appear soiled and still smells like fresh-cut wood shavings. Should I change it anyway??? I have probably changed my rat bedding about 3 times since then... How often do you guys completely clean the cages out for ASF's? Also, I know ASF's take longer to grow, but how long does it actually take to reach their adult size? A few months? More?

---

Yes, I would change the bedding. Never know whats growing in the bedding.

How is your trio doing, are they producing for you yet?

Alan

No, not so far. When I got them they were just weaned. I don't actually expect anything for the next couple of months. ;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OhBalls

Great idea :)...I have considered that....I won't use a metal wheel for any long tailed rodent as I have pulled one too many tangled tails out of them...a solid wheel would work great if I could find a metal one.....

hmmmm.....there's an idea for a weekend project!

---

We do use the small wire wheels from Walmart (less than $5) for the ASF's and I've yet to have any tail injury issues.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Corrupter

I am thinking of switching over to only ASF's mainly because they have NO odor that I can smell. I got my first trio in march and havent changed the bedding yet. It doesnt appear soiled and still smells like fresh-cut wood shavings. Should I change it anyway??? I have probably changed my rat bedding about 3 times since then... How often do you guys completely clean the cages out for ASF's? Also, I know ASF's take longer to grow, but how long does it actually take to reach their adult size? A few months? More?

---

Even if you can't detect an odor you do need to change bedding on a reasonable schedule. Just because you can't smell their pee doesn't mean they aren't walking on urine soaked bedding after enough time has gone by.

Funny thing I've noticed with both our breeding colonies is that the females seem to thrive on breeding back to back litters. I've always avoided that with my regular rats because it does seem to run the females down a bit but these ASF females seem to do very well with it. I've watched them closely and with every litter the females seem to bulk up even more until they are as big or bigger than my males. Granted it does look to me to be a group run by the dominant female(s) so they do tend to get to the food bowls first, but I thought any female animal nursing a litter while carrying one, producing so much, would just naturally be a bit drained. My breeder females are big, husky ladies just bursting with good health which is nice to see.