Home page issue

Hey gang,

Just noticed we have a shot of a guy getting bit by a snake on our home page. A lot of people come visit us here. Is this really the kind of image we want on our home page?

Heck ya! J/k... I didn't find it offensive towards the community forum. But then again.. I like the snake bytes tv feeding.

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Originally Posted by Jenn

Hey gang,

Just noticed we have a shot of a guy getting bit by a snake on our home page. A lot of people come visit us here. Is this really the kind of image we want on our home page?

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Why should the fact that snakes bite be offensive to our visitors? This is a forum that explores all the different aspects of reptile keeping from the cute HOTM to feeding pics and issues. The fact is snakes bite, you deal with them long enough and it is just another part of owning them. No different than cat owners getting scratched or parrot owners getting bit. It really is no big deal just a part of being a snake keeper. I can see how it might see aggressive or violent but it is just a standard part of owning snakes :gj::gj::gj:

Good looking out though.

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Originally Posted by Jenn

Hey gang,

Just noticed we have a shot of a guy getting bit by a snake on our home page. A lot of people come visit us here. Is this really the kind of image we want on our home page?

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I completely understand were you are coming from, but you have to remember, that snake is in a facility that has thousands, upon thousands of snakes. They do not get handled like your snakes. They are not really the "pet" snake that we all have.

Don't get me wrong. It doesn't bother me at all. I have a bunch of snakes and cats and dogs and have never been bit myself. But I was just thinking about all the "tire kickers" who stop by to see if they may indeed get "bit by the snake bug" like we all did.

There is just so much bad press out there on snakes already without us scaring away someone before they even really understand what it's all about.

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Originally Posted by Jenn

Don't get me wrong. It doesn't bother me at all. I have a bunch of snakes and cats and dogs and have never been bit myself. But I was just thinking about all the "tire kickers" who stop by to see if they may indeed get "bit by the snake bug" like we all did.

There is just so much bad press out there on snakes already without us scaring away someone before they even really understand what it's all about.

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Well, if they don't realize snakes bite before they get to this site, they shouldn't be owning snakes.

I totally agree with Jenn, in fact I had been thinking about making a similar post.

Yes, snakes bite. So do cats, dogs... almost any animal that is kept as a pet. But most of the time when you have a video loop that is only a few seconds long, cat people, dog people, etc aren't going to use part of that valuable time showing one of those animals biting.

I think it is worse because the person getting bitten basically panics, drops the snake, and runs away. Pat pointed out that this is a big facility where the snakes don't get handled as often and so they don't get as tame as pet snakes do. Ok... but shouldn't that also mean that the people handling them should have lots of experience and therefore be able to react more calmly?

Like Jenn said, I know snakes bite. I've been bitten by my own snake. So to me, I don't see that clip as a negative thing. But how will others see it? Especially those who don't like snakes or maybe are on the fence? When we, the herp community, have the choice of putting out a few seconds of video clip, why choose one that falls more on the "bad press" end of the spectrum? If a clip with lots of action was wanted, choose a feeding clip that isn't as slow motion as the feeding clip chosen. I don't know about the rest of you, but every time I've ever seen a snake feeding, it has struck and coiled much faster than that one. It is a cool clip because of being able to see what is happening instead of a blur, but I just mentioned this due to the "if more action was wanted" angle.

I watched a show called "The Big Squeeze" (I think) which was supposed to be all about the giant constrictors. I was tremendously disappointed that a big percentage of the time was spent on attacks on humans. While I think mentioning that it does happen and can be fatal for the human is responsible, I think devoting so much time to it blows it out of proportion and people watching it may end up with the idea that most people who own giant snakes end up either dead or at least having experienced a life threatening attack. The same is true for this little snakebytes ad... about 1/3 of it is a snake attacking a human. But that isn't 1/3 of what snakes are about. Why not choose to show more of the positive stuff?

I know the ad is something put together by snakebytestv, not bp.net. I hope they'll decide to change it.

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Originally Posted by kc261

When we, the herp community, have the choice of putting out a few seconds of video clip, why choose one that falls more on the "bad press" end of the spectrum?

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I can totally see you point 100% bad press is not needed. However again we are a reptile forum and not a main stream search engine or news station. People that come here are interested in reptiles the majority of them being snakes. Chewy reacted the way he did because...well thats Chews I imagine it hurt.

To me it really not that big of a deal I mean if I was a visitor of a boxing forum I wouldn't be put off by a loop of some one getting KO'ed. It all part of the whole package. I'd rather them see what they were getting in to instead of getting it not understanding hey they bite and the releasing them into the wild. Now thats bad press.

Again I really don't see the problem.

If I'm not mistaken, that's Brian B. getting tagged. If someone can't see the humor of that much experience getting the sharp end of the snake, they need a humor chip update.

I found it amusing. Of course, I am somewhat jaded.

Bellybites, while HIGHLY amusing, are painful, which is, in a twisted sort of way, even more funny when you consider that he should know enough not to be bitten at all.

I also thought it looked like Brian, but I could be mistaken as I don't know him or Chewy personally. It looks like he was picking the snake up and got bit on the arm, startling him more than anything since he didn't see it coming...

As for the original issue posted, I don't see a problem with it being that this IS a reptile forum. I also kinda got a chuckle out of watching it... :rolleye2:

My 0.02 - Snakes bite sometimes. No sense in trying to hide it or dilute it so it is more palatable. They are wild animals and people should know that. No better way to display that fact than a video clip, imo.

its def not brian! looks like chewy

I think it's great that we can all laugh at someone getting bit by a snake. But when some Legislature who knows nothing about snakes, needs to make an informed vote on whether to outlaw our hobby, and visits our site for information... Will they laugh too?

I'm sort of thinking some of us may be a bit jaded about snake bites... and I'm sure Brian would switch it immediately if asked.

But, I am still of the mind that it is not offensive, and is an advertisment for snake bytes, where one of the highlights are feeding and snake bites.

People are fascinated by snakes and snake biting, that's why there are shows around like the big squeeze that only depict snake's attacking humans and eating their dogs...

But if those same people click on the small ad for snake bytes and watches the episode expecting more snakes biting people and blood... they will also discover the wonderful world of snakes through that show. Meet brian and his crew, see the awesome NARBC show.... and get so see some feeding vids and bites.

Considering it's a rotating ad, it's not on every single time you refresh the screen. If someone is offended by snakes biting, than perhaps snakes are not for them in the first place.

Do you know how many times I've been bit by my snakes in the past year? NONE
Do you know how many times I was bit by my cat last night (had him for 3 weeks now)? About 30 times.
How many times I've been bit by rats? Bad bites w/ blood: 3 times Nips: a whole heck of a lot

Still... its an ad for snake bytes that's doing it's job by showing the public what they want to see.

Do you think it would be as effective if it was a shot of a snake sitting calmly in brian's hands? Or gliding through his fingers and just being calm? I dont think so! I think no one would even look at that ad! Shock value, leads to clicks, leads to further understanding of snakes and their nature.

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Originally Posted by Jenn

I think it's great that we can all laugh at someone getting bit by a snake. But when some Legislature who knows nothing about snakes, needs to make an informed vote on whether to outlaw our hobby, and visits our site for information... Will they laugh too?

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Maybe they wont laugh but they will be informed. I agree that wreckless irresponsible information and actions on the part of some reptile owners is some of the reason we are even worrying about how this might effect it. But I feel it is better to be honest and not try and candy coat any thing in this hobby. We should be saying "these are snakes, this is how they eat, you might get bit, it might get big" I think if we would quit with the gilding of the lily so to speak there would be fewer irresponsible keepers getting in to this.

just my two cents

that mountain & mole hill saying comes to my mind.

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when some Legislature who knows nothing about snakes, needs to make an informed vote on whether to outlaw our hobby, and visits our site for information... Will they laugh too?

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That's a bit of a far stretch. Do politicians visit forums to gather information?

To me it looks like the snake hit's the floor :O that worried me more the guy getten bit. Snake's bite thats the way it is. I also agree that snake is most likely not handled on a regular basis. That could explain the bite

show's called snakebytes and this is a promotional video.

Oh yeah and some snakes really bite;)

it does say "SnakeBytes.TV" right under it:weirdface

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Originally Posted by nathanledet

That's a bit of a far stretch. Do politicians visit forums to gather information?

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I think politicians actually gathering information on a subject before legislating it was enough of a stretch.

yeah.. umm. snake BYTES.

See the word play there.. if the name of the show was Snake Hugs.tv, I could understand where the problem is.

If you go to a car site, and there's a video of a car crashing on the front page, are you gonna stop driving?

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Originally Posted by Jenn

I think it's great that we can all laugh at someone getting bit by a snake. But when some Legislature who knows nothing about snakes, needs to make an informed vote on whether to outlaw our hobby, and visits our site for information... Will they laugh too?

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I agree with this, although I also agree with Nathan saying that a forum is probably not the first place a politician comes to gather information. I'm more worried about the teen who is trying to convince his/her mom/dad to let them own a snake, and shows them this site, and so the mom/dad gets pushed further in the "no snakes" direction.

As far as Connie's post about "some of us are jaded about snake bites" and "those who are offended shouldn't own snakes"... wow. That seems a bit over the top considering Jenn and I have both said we aren't personally offended, just concerned about the impact it may have on who knows who might see it. (For the record, neither of those 2 quotes are word for word Connie's, but I believe I kept the meaning the same. If I didn't, Connie please clarify.)

Yes, I agree that showing this clip of a snake biting will get clicks and will get people to watch snakebytes. But are the ones who are hoping to see "more snakes biting people and blood", the same ones we, the herp community, want to attract? IMHO, showing the public what they want to see is not always good. Shock value may lead to clicks, but it is not a good thing. I find it very ironic and hypocritical that the herp community as a whole complains a lot about the bad press that snakes get. But when snakebytes puts out an ad that shows that being bitten by a snake is 33% of what owning snakes is about (based on it being one of 3 brief clips), that is just fine. Huh?

I absolutely agree with all of those who say that we should not try to hide that snakes bite sometimes. Some bites can be really bad, even fatal, and potential owners need to know that. But I'm not sure that getting that knowledge out there (as if it isn't already) will result in fewer irresponsible owners. Many of the irresponsible owners are the same ones who are attracted to snakes because of their big bad reputation. This kind of goes back to showing the public what they want to see (lots of dramatic snake bites) instead of the truth (yes, it happens, but it isn't what snakes and owning snakes are all about).

Connie suggested that if someone asked Brian he might change it. I will agree that at the very least he should be made aware of this thread just in case he isn't already, so I'm going to send him a PM, to avoid any possible "talking behind his back" type thing. Then changing it or not will be his choice. I just started talking about it here because the thread was already started. Also, I do think talking about what the herp community should be presenting to the public is a valid topic here, and it just happened to come up because of the snakebytes ad. Actually, to me, it is more HOW it is presented rather than WHAT. I have NO problem with the clip... just that it is a very major percentage of a very short video loop which is displayed on the home page of bp.net.

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Originally Posted by kc261

As far as Connie's post about "some of us are jaded about snake bites" and "those who are offended shouldn't own snakes"... wow. That seems a bit over the top considering Jenn and I have both said we aren't personally offended, just concerned about the impact it may have on who knows who might see it. (For the record, neither of those 2 quotes are word for word Connie's, but I believe I kept the meaning the same. If I didn't, Connie please clarify.)

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Well, I do have to comment that changing a few words does change the meaning of my entire post.

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Originally Posted by littleindiangirl
If someone is offended by snakes biting, than perhaps snakes are not for them in the first place.

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I think that you've changed my post to sound completely different by writing this:

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those who are offended shouldn't own snakes.

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Of course, if you don't see the difference, I can't force you to.

Plainly, if someone that comes to this site and sees the snake biting, and is horrified, disgusted, offended... then yes. Perhaps snakes aren't for them. No?

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Originally Posted by littleindiangirl

Plainly, if someone that comes to this site and sees the snake biting, and is horrified, disgusted, offended... then yes. Perhaps snakes aren't for them. No?

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Let me start off by saying I agree with that completely. That wasn't how I interpreted your post that I paraphrased earlier, and maybe I misinterpreted. It felt, when I read it the first time, that it was intentionally left ambiguous to possibly include Jenn and I. So I appreciate your clarification.

I thought saying "those who are offended shouldn't own snakes" was close enough in meaning to "If someone is offended by snakes biting, than perhaps snakes are not for them in the first place." Sort of like saying "those who are allergic to peanuts shouldn't eat peanut butter cookies" is close enough in meaning to "If someone is allergic to peanuts, than perhaps peanut butter cookies are not for them in the first place".

I think maybe what made it sound completely different was taking away all the context? I dunno. Anyway, I do appreciate your clarification of what you meant.

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Originally Posted by kc261

I think maybe what made it sound completely different was taking away all the context? I dunno. Anyway, I do appreciate your clarification of what you meant.

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"The written word is the lowest form of communication."

I don't know who said that first, but I think we've just seen a great example by yours truly; moi ;)

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Originally Posted by Jenn

I think it's great that we can all laugh at someone getting bit by a snake. But when some Legislature who knows nothing about snakes, needs to make an informed vote on whether to outlaw our hobby, and visits our site for information... Will they laugh too?

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I must say I had a good laugh over the idea that a politician or his lackey's would ever bother to actually research or ask the people involved in something about the laws they might draft that affect us. "Informed vote"??? Boy that did give me quite a laugh! :rofl:

Somehow I doubt most of our overly well paid legislators are going to be hanging out at BPNet. It might force them to actually speak to those they supposedly represent....imagine that! :O

Jenn,

Thank you for your concern. The admins review all ads before they are put up. We did not and do not find this particular ad to be concerning and we will not be asking Brian to change it. If he chooses to, that is entirely up to him, but we stand by the ad if he chooses to keep it as it is.

We do thank you for sharing your concerns!

thought i'd toss in my 2 cents worth... as i got change from the grocery store today LOL

when i first came here, to this site... i didn't own any snakes. honestly i was scared to death of them... i was coming to figure out what the best snake would be for my son. we were trying to decide between a corn snake and a ball python.

it was during the research portion that i fell in love with ball pythons... the way they look, they was they moved... i was hooked.

if i had seen that ad when i first came... we probably wouldn't have gotten a snake. i'm being honest here... so please don't judge me... i was really scared of snakes. i couldn't even hold our when we first got him (now i have 12)... the thought of the snake leaping out of it's enclosure and biting me would have sent me over the edge.

what did i find when i came here? i found caring, supportive people who were willing to assist me to make an informed choice. i am and will continue to be forever grateful for this!

in the end, my son decided he didn't want a snake anymore... and i bought myself one instead LOL ah how life creeps up at ya eh?

that's it... i think i used up a toonie with that post... *runs to the car to get more change*

thanks for listening...

I just got a chance to see this post. I think I can agree with both sides on this one. You have to remember that we are learning through this experience as we go. When my grahics guy sent me the ad I thought it was classic, but I have to agree that maybe I didn't think it through all the way??? Although we are a show that will include "snake bites" from time to time. We are about reality and in our world we all get bit a lot. It has nothing to do with being a professional, it has to do with us handling a ton of snakes. That being said I agree that this might not be the image that we as a community want to see when visiting a forum. I'll get a new ad up within the next couple of days. If anyone in the future sees anything wrong with something that we do please let me know. I might not always agree, but the whole goal of our show is to increase interest in our hobby. I wouldn't want to ever hurt that. Thanks for everyones well thought out comments, Brian(BHB)

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Originally Posted by BHB

That being said I agree that this might not be the image that we as a community want to see when visiting a forum. I'll get a new ad up within the next couple of days. Brian(BHB)

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Man, I really didn't see anything wrong with that ad, I liked it alot, and most people on this forum who have a good amount of snakes have been hit a time or two, its just part of the hobby. When you are working with a reptile whos vision is as it is, without proper precautions (and still sometimes is inevitable) you will get bit. I loved the ad, but I understand you taking it down, you aren't one who causes controversy, warranted or unwarranted. I respect your decision, but don't see the problem. :confused: