I Hate Mice!

I just went to check on Mama, our albino breeder mouse and on a previous check of her and her litter I had noted she had killed and eaten 4 babies, leaving five (we had fed one pinky off). Well I checked her just now and the other five are now gone.

:confused::mad::confused::mad::confused::mad:
:taz::taz::taz::taz:

Both the male and female have constant access to food and water so I don't understand why she would do this. Rah! And one of my male breeders just died and my other pair of breeders isn't producing squat. And on top of that, two females I'm raising up to be breeders won't be ready till mid April. So as of right now I have one pair that eats their young, one thats not producing, one that just lost the male, and two females who are too young.

So arg! I hate mice. I can't wait to get my rats going. Are they any better than this?

And do you think I should feed off Mama and Spotty, the pair that killed and consumed their young?

*comfort*

I completely understand the frustration and suck that is mice breeding. I think the last time I had a Momma snarf down her entire litter, yeah, I fed her off...but mostly just for revenge. :rolleyes:

Personally, I kept plugging away at it and I have now a successfully colony (i.e., too many mice, but that's what freezers are for).

I've been trying to get a colony going since November but I've only gotten 3 litters since then and one just got eaten. I only have two females old enough to breed. I think my older female is too old to have babies anymore. I found her mate dead and she is looking a bit shabby lately even though she's getting the same amount of food and water as everyone else.

*sigh*

Maybe I need to build myself a mouse rack (as soon as I finish my rat rack) and go out and get new females and new males.

Isn't that the way things go? You buy pets for your kid and they breed like crazy because the guy at the petstore didnt know how to sex them.

Now when you want some, the darn things either wont do it, or freak out and eat the litter! Gah! I feel for you, I dont breed mice, but if I did I would be disappointed just as much and seek revenge...

I can't wait till I can get a rat colony up and going. I've got two females that are of breeding age/size and they are currently in with a male but thats still another month before we see any babies there and thats if they got busy around now.

Well now I have two less feeders to buy tomorrow. :D

I think it took me about a year to get the colony going well...they just are not very pleasant animals, although I do quite like my current buck and 2 good mommas...=)

I think my older female would have been my best breeder if I had gotten her at a younger age. We adopted her rather than bought her so she could have been a pet for over a year before we got her.

I must say though, I love my rats. They have their own personalities and are such funny little things. Monk and Nibble come running over when I put my hand in the cage. They climb all over my hands and arms and just love the interaction. :) I'm thinking about just abandoning the idea of breeding mice and sticking with rats since the only snake in the house right now that eats mice is our baby corn. And then the only other animal that eats mice is our ferret but she'll eat anything and should have no issue switching to rats.

from what I have read mice feed on their young because they are usually lacking protein. The mothers will also feed on the young if the babies are unhealthy, or lack of water etc. There are a number of things. I use to breed mice and they really suck. I now strictly breed rats which are much easier and the odor is minimal compared to mice. I also have 7 trios of dwarf hamsters when i need smaller stuff. The hamsters have virtually no odor and start breeding again as soon as they give birth. They are very prolific, however the down side is they are very cute.

I don't like hamsters. I had a female when I was little and the little sucker bit me and that was the end of the beginning of me keeping hamsters. :D

I can't wait till my rats start producing. There is a PetClub down the street (not the best but...) and they said they could get in a few more dumbo females for me if I was interested, so I'm hoping to get a dumbo female. :)

Mice are HORRIBLE mothers. I've tried many times with breeding mice and its the same thing everytime with mom eating all of the babies. I now won't own a mouse eating snake because I refure to pay $3+ for a stinking little mouse from the petstore.

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Originally Posted by Jay_Bunny

Well I checked her just now and the other five are now gone.

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What are you feeding them, and how are they housed (size of tub, substrate, other items, and m/f ratios)?

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Originally Posted by Jay_Bunny

And one of my male breeders just died and my other pair of breeders isn't producing squat.

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Are you keeping them in pairs to breed? This works well for rats, but not so much for mice. On average (using cement mixing tubs) we keep tubs somewhere in the 2/15-20 m/f ratios. This kind of harem setup works well, as the mothers cross-nurse, which helps keep the baby eating to a minimum.

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Originally Posted by Jay_Bunny

And then the only other animal that eats mice is our ferret but she'll eat anything and should have no issue switching to rats.

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Wait...ferrets eat mice and rats?

They eat Mazuri Rodent Block and Becky's mix. I do not house that many breeder mice because I do not require that many feeders at one time. I go through somewhere around 25 feeders a week so keeping that many breeders would have me overrun in no time.

I did this specific pair in a 1.2 group but either the male or female killed the other female. The litter was not too terribly large. 10 in all and we fed one off. Another female I had in a 1.1 had a litter of 12 (fed one off) and she raised them all up to weaning age, no problem. This was this female's second litter. Her first litter was 5 and she had been house alone with no male (I bought her as a feeder and she was pregnant when I bought her).

Tank size is a 10g. The other female I had (the one with 12 babies) was housed in a 5g and they were moved to a 20L when the babies hit hopper stage. They were then moved back into a 5g after the babies were seperated and fed off.

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Originally Posted by rabernet

Wait...ferrets eat mice and rats?

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LOL, thats what I said!

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Originally Posted by rabernet

Wait...ferrets eat mice and rats?

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Yes they do. Its actually quite a good diet for them. Ferrets are strictly carnivorous and many commercial ferret foods have plant material in them like corn and such so the best diet to feed them is either a raw meat and bones diet or a whole prey diet. I feed our little girl a combination of whole prey and raw meat. She gets mostly mice but about 2-3 times a week she also gets raw meat like chicken, turkey, beef, or fish. A full grown ferret can put away anywhere from 14-21 mice a week. Mine goes through about 10 a week right now since she's also eating raw meat.

Rats shouldn't be that much of a change to her. I was actually asking some people on line about ferrets and full grown rats. The full grown rats would be f/t of course but they said a full grown rat would be a good meal for 2-3 ferrets.

Ferrets also enjoy eating quail, chicks, rabbit, fish, other small rodents, ect as whole prey items. A ferret keeper I was talking to said she also tried frogs and lizards but the ferrets were not as interested in them as the birds and rodents.

Probably your female ate her babys because you take one.

When you picked out the pinkie did you use gloves?

I breed mices, a lot of mices, and they don't like strange scents, if you pick one of the pinkies with your bare hands and touch others the chances that the mother eat them is very high.

I have 1.5 in a sweater box, and then transfer the pregos to a shoe box. The boxes are cleaned every week and when working with the litters I always use Latex Gloves, I pick the mother first out and then the pinkies to a separate shoe box, add new shaving to the tub and then make a nest with my knuckels and put the pinkies in, then the mother.

I have 0 problems using that method.

Hopes that help!

Draco

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Originally Posted by Jay_Bunny

I did this specific pair in a 1.2 group but either the male or female killed the other female.

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I would probably just feed off the pair and start over. If either one is aggressive enough to kill off another adult, it's got unfavorable genes as far as I'm concerned.

I would also separate the females from the males before they lay( Erm... In the mammal way:D) I have heard more bad story's than good when keeping the male in with the female, sometimes it works out good, and in your case, badly. I'd defiantly feed these off and get another group, your best luck to find breeder sizes is to go find a good mom and pop pet store that has mice( pecto or petsmart mice did not seem to want to breed for me...)or look at your local craigslist. This worked out great for me and now i have alot of pregnant moms, and the ones that had baby's, still have their babys... who need to be weaned soon...:gj:

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Originally Posted by Jay_Bunny

Yes they do. Its actually quite a good diet for them. Ferrets are strictly carnivorous and many commercial ferret foods have plant material in them like corn and such so the best diet to feed them is either a raw meat and bones diet or a whole prey diet. I feed our little girl a combination of whole prey and raw meat. She gets mostly mice but about 2-3 times a week she also gets raw meat like chicken, turkey, beef, or fish. A full grown ferret can put away anywhere from 14-21 mice a week. Mine goes through about 10 a week right now since she's also eating raw meat.

Rats shouldn't be that much of a change to her. I was actually asking some people on line about ferrets and full grown rats. The full grown rats would be f/t of course but they said a full grown rat would be a good meal for 2-3 ferrets.

Ferrets also enjoy eating quail, chicks, rabbit, fish, other small rodents, ect as whole prey items. A ferret keeper I was talking to said she also tried frogs and lizards but the ferrets were not as interested in them as the birds and rodents.

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Would eating raw meat make the Ferret more aggresive?

I never had any luck with mice. I had a lot of litters eaten too. I used to blame those "rotten" mice but I've come to figure out by talking to a lot of successful mouse feeder breeders that I tried to treat them like my rats and that just never seems to work.

They seem to not do as well in glass tanks or clear tubs and much better is dark bin type racks. They don't like to be bugged and a lot of busy movement around them which doesn't bother the rats at all. I think to be successful breeding mice you just have to understand how very different they are from rats and adjust your care of them.

I know people like Deb (GA) have great success with their mouse colonies.

We never had that problem when we bred mice. We did use fancy colored mice though, not sure if that makes a difference or not. Personally, we found all the albino mice to be kinda tweaked and they were the ones we had problems with when it came to getting along with their cage mates. Just my 2 cents ...

Robin

No, feeding raw meat and whole prey does not make your ferret more aggressive. Our ferret actually gets mostly whole prey items and occasionally if I have some young mice (hoppers or smaller) she gets those live and gets to 'hunt' for her prey. Very stimulating for her and she loves it.

I feel for you. I'm down to a pair of mice that are great breeders and great parents. Nothing bothers them. All other groups I've tried breeding either won't produce, kill off other females, or kill the babies. I decided to keep 2 females and 1 male from the good pair and I am hoping to raise them up and see if they take after their parents. Hopefully they do.

Good luck with whatever you decide with the mice and hope you get your rats soon. :)

I think you will go through a few males before you find one that will breed for you. What i did was pick out a male that was breeding with a female already so then i knew it was a stud. For some reason the rest did not feed like being the Alpha male over the females.

Jay_Bunny I do understand your frustration it took me a good 3 months before getting started real good with mice, I had to find the proper enclosure that work for me and experiment around with their diet and a few other things.

I could have give up but I didn’t and for the past year now it has been a smooth ride they are breeding well 13 to 17 babies per litters, and the females are good mothers (they even foster babies from other mothers :O), I really cannot complain.

Now my next challenge will be breeding ASF

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I know people like Deb (GA) have great success with their mouse colonies.

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I do and right now I am being taken over by mice ;)

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Originally Posted by Jay_Bunny

No, feeding raw meat and whole prey does not make your ferret more aggressive. Our ferret actually gets mostly whole prey items and occasionally if I have some young mice (hoppers or smaller) she gets those live and gets to 'hunt' for her prey. Very stimulating for her and she loves it.

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Thats the first I've heard of that. Very interesting!:gj:

I didn't know ferrets ate raw either until I joined an online forum (wow these things really do help you out. :D) and I switched her over to raw and whole prey. She takes rat pups no problem now so I think we are going to be breeding rats exclusively. Our ferret is helping us get rid of the breeder mice (all except 2 breeder mice and our deer mouse, the only 3 we are keeping).

So now I'm going to be really hauling butt trying to get the rat rack built so we can add more rats to the colony and get it up and going. We have two females right now that are of breeding age and size and they are currently in with a male. Then we have two females that will be breedable by the end of May. So I'm still on the hunt for more rats.

The Richmond show is coming up. I bet you could find some breeders there to get rats from. Either make arrangements with someone from bp.net who has rats and is going to meet them and a couple of their rats there. Or make a contact at the show and arrange to meet up with them later (assuming they don't have any live rats with them).