55 Gallon Tank How to Heat Test

I want to see if anyone can figure out this problem and come up with a solution. There is a 55 gallon glass vivarium. It cannot be heated with over light or heating because all means of such have been used and because of the depth of the tank even a spot light or a 200 watt ceramic bulb will heat the substrate and as we all know it is the substrate that needs to be heated not the air. Also under the tank heating has been used and do to the amount of bedding that needs to be used a heat pad will not provide enough heat. Extra bedding cannot be removed because it is used to create humidity and the level of that are also extremely low because of the depth and sheer size of this. This person cannot afford to buy another tank so this is the one was have to work with. What would you do to solve this problem? Think of it as a math problem for a herper.

First off you didn't mention if the top of the tank is covered and how. Even a CHE will heat a 55gal provided all the heat isn't escaping out the top. You can also insulate the side and back walls (Reflectix or actuall insulation will work).

An UTH will heat the substrate up (and it doesn't need to be that deep - just enough to absorb urates and stuff) - use other methods to increase the humidity (larger water bowl - and again is the tank is covered properly the humidity will build and stay)

I used to have a 55 gal for my JCP and I only used a CHE and a UTH to heat it and it was spot on...but the top was almost completed covered and the sides were insulated.

Hope this helps

covered with a screen and wrapped in Saran Wrap with the exception of some small holes over the hide box. Also the UTH heater is only getting the substrate to the mid 70's and the substrate in this situation needs to stay at the level where it is. Like I said this is sort of like a math problem and I want to see who can come up with the best ideas working with the parameters that I set and thank you Jackel for pointing out that I left out the topper I know that makes a big difference. The Relectix insulation is a great idea.

I would put the snake in a rubbermaid container, clean the 55gal tank up really good, take it to my nearest pet store and trade it for a 20gal long. Set the 20gal up with all the accessories you already have and you should be good to go. Most people think the bigger the tank the better, this is not true. You want your BP to have tons of room to crawl around, the BP doesn't want that. He wants to feel cramped and secure, the less open space the better. Remember in the wild they spend 90% of their time crammed in a hole in the ground they can barely fit in. Hit some websites and look at the husbandry recommended for BP's.

funny. I was hoping that some one would be trying to think of some thing innovative here. Secondly there are two balls in this tank just to throw some thing else into the mix. They are life partners.

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Originally Posted by FL0OD

Secondly there are two balls in this tank just to throw some thing else into the mix. They are life partners.

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*head desk*:colbert:

Having two BP's in the same enclosure is BAD for many many many reasons. Also BP's are not penguins and do NOT have life partners.

hahaha. these have bred three years in a row and produced at least 6-10 eggs each year I think they are fine.

Whatever do how you want, but probably 10-15 more posts will chime in to say the same thing to you. Give it a few hours.

thats fine. people read books or some one tells them some thing and they are experts. i recently posted a question to some top breeders on what kind of substrate was best for incubating eggs, just as a question, and not even one of them gave me the same answer. you have to do what works for you and your animals. these two, and I have four, were placed together one year during a breeding season. after she laid her eggs about three months later we put him back in and he stayed. she produced eggs again that next year. since then he is in with her all the time up until a month or so before she lays her eggs. thats what works for them. this is totally off topic now. i was hoping that some one could come up with an idea for this tank situation not get into a conversation about breeding and who does what. lets move back to that.

Wasn't a breeding issue, its a husbandry issue. Since I've already expressed my views I will try and help your problem.

Why don't you get either a few pieces of flexwatt or you can buy those expensive Zoomeds pads. I would personally go for all UTHeating, because 55g are 18 or 24" high? You really don't need to bother heating all that dead air if the snake lives on the substrate.

If I were doing it I would have 2 separate heating pads (either strip of flexwatt or heat pad) on 1 Thermostat, both running cool side temps of 80-84 degrees. Put on a the cold side and one in the middle.

Add a third heating pad and have it on a separate T-stat and have it on one side around 90-95 degrees.

That would give you your heat gradient and won't destroy your humidity.

Then I would also consider separating your snakes, since they get no benefit to living with other snakes, and only get the negatives of living with other snakes.:gj:

Sounds like a great idea. See thats all I am asking for. Exceptional input from some one that knows his stuff. Thank you sir.

I'm gonna be the bad guy and tell you to can the 55gal bc unless you have a snake room where temps/humidity are always up your never gonna hit the spots you need... I tried for about 2 months to get my 60gal to work and couldnt do it with every trick in the book... Tried plexiglass over the top, larger water bowl, reptile humidifier, 150W CHE, 2 UTH's... anything you can think of... I dont wanna rain on your parade its just too much empty space to heat up. I even moved my CHE into the tank and it got my temps where it needed to be... but killed my humidity. You can try all the things brimstone suggested but my bet is on you not hitting your marks. Best bet is to either build a custom cage big enough for both snakes if you insist on keeping them together or buying a plastic cage.

Good advice. I'm not certain what Fl0Od is really looking for...

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Originally Posted by JoshJP7

I'm gonna be the bad guy and tell you to can the 55gal bc unless you have a snake room where temps/humidity are always up your never gonna hit the spots you need... I tried for about 2 months to get my 60gal to work and couldnt do it with every trick in the book... Tried plexiglass over the top, larger water bowl, reptile humidifier, 150W CHE, 2 UTH's... anything you can think of... I dont wanna rain on your parade its just too much empty space to heat up. I even moved my CHE into the tank and it got my temps where it needed to be... but killed my humidity. You can try all the things brimstone suggested but my bet is on you not hitting your marks. Best bet is to either build a custom cage big enough for both snakes if you insist on keeping them together or buying a plastic cage.

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Originally Posted by JoshJP7

I'm gonna be the bad guy and tell you to can the 55gal bc unless you have a snake room where temps/humidity are always up your never gonna hit the spots you need... I tried for about 2 months to get my 60gal to work and couldnt do it with every trick in the book... Tried plexiglass over the top, larger water bowl, reptile humidifier, 150W CHE, 2 UTH's... anything you can think of... I dont wanna rain on your parade its just too much empty space to heat up. I even moved my CHE into the tank and it got my temps where it needed to be... but killed my humidity. You can try all the things brimstone suggested but my bet is on you not hitting your marks. Best bet is to either build a custom cage big enough for both snakes if you insist on keeping them together or buying a plastic cage.

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Yeah my method doesn't make for a very consistent heating because of the space. But with a 55gal I did the best I could. LOL.

I was just figuring with so many people on here that some one could think of some thing that no one else had thought of. I am taking every ones suggestions into account. There are just a lot of things that I have already tried so I was looking for new ideas.

Hi,

Is leaving one side open for viewing important to you?

If not then completely covering all the sides/bottom and probably most of the top with reflectix or cork sheeting might help keep the temps more stable but it's always going to be tricky to heat that volume I think.:(

I used to use a 5 foot by 2 x 2 wooden vivarium with a 700watt ceramic heater (on a thermostat of course) and used a large humid hide in addition to the regular ones to try and help with shedding.

It cost an absolute fortune to run and , to be honest, I don't think I will ever try and use it for anything again as the best you can manage is a compromise and bodge/ make do situation.

Just my 2c.


dr del

I have a big tank that I used to use for my showcase tank - it was heated underneath by a couple of heat pads but I also ran heat rope under the substrate to help heat the tank. You might also consider insulating the tank as well (back and sides) to keep the heat in. Cover the top I think has already been suggested. You can also attach those heat pads onto the side of the tank to help with ambient temps if you need to. Flexwawatt can also be used instead of heat pads. Be sure you put your heating devices on a thermostat.

Good luck.

That's because no one in their right mind, who knows how to keep Ball Pythons, will use a 55 gallon tank. They are heavy, awful to clean, very difficult to keep correctly heated and humidified.

I would recommend you contact some big breeders out there and ask every single one who keeps their Ball Pythons together. If you eventually want a stressed out, egg bound, nutrient-depleted female, keep on doing what you're doing... There have been documented events of stress-induced cannibalism in Ball Pythons housed together, even if they had been together for years prior. WHY would you want to risk the health and well-being of your animals?

That being said, 55 gallon tanks are horrible for keeping ground dwelling reptiles. They don't have enough floor space, and you waste alot of electricity trying to heat the air to a normal range.

Do your snakes a favor, get 2 actual reptile cages, such as Vision, Animal Plastics, Boaphile, etc and separate them. Plastic is a much better insulator than glass is and will provide a more appropriate home for the snake(well insulated = easy to heat and humidify, and will remain stable, unlike glass). Glass will always try to be the same temp as the surrounding room temp. Think of it as your car on a very cold, wintery day, and you have the heat blasting. If you feel the window, it's still incredibly cold and remains that way regardless of the temp inside. What if that was your snake's tank and the snake spent alot of time pressed up against the glass? The snake could easily get a respiratory infection or regurgitate its food because of the extremely cold glass it is resting on.

Get either two tanks, two reptile-specific enclosures, or two plastic sweater boxes, and separate your snakes. You can save yourself and the snakes alot of stress... Just listen to the people on here who have over 40 years of experience, they know what they are talking about.

Oh dear god don't make them show "the picture" again.

I wouldn't be a bit surprised if some day you came home and one of your life partners was missing, and the other one was twice as big!!!! No, no not the picture again. Anything but the picture.

i wont be responding to this thread anymore so talk amoungst yourselves. some of you have been helpful and others of you have added your two cents where it is not wanted nor needed. did any of you that decided to flame me for how i keep my animals even read my first post. i have SUCCESSFULLY owned and housed two of my four animals like this for YEARS. I do not house all of my animals like this and have two pastels, male and female, that are in separate tanks, and two normals, male and female, that I have decided to keep together. I am well aware of the risks and if I felt that there was concern as mentioned by a couple of you I would remove these two. I have enough space to separate them if that is what I wanted to do. My animals are not babies and have produced eggs for the past three years for me. So my results fly in the face of your judgement. Reading a book about "How to Keep A Ball Python" does not mean that you know everything. Mentioned also was "ask any major breeder" and if you actually did you would know that major breeders change the way they house, light, and heat there cages often and not always do so by "the book". So are they wrong according to what you read or some one told you was "the way it should be done"? Did you know there are major breeders that do not light cycle there animals? Did you know there are major breeders that do not use hide boxes? I am sure that is in "the book" too. I will say again that this thread was started because I have ONE large tank that is difficult to heat and I was wondering if any of the nice intelligent people that frequented this forum could all put there heads together and help me possibly think of some thing I had not already thought of. Instead I get flamed by a couple of people I do not even know about how I should and should not keep and raise my animals when that has NOTHING to do with this thread. Thanks to everyone that just answered the question posted.

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Originally Posted by FL0OD

i wont be responding to this thread anymore so talk amoungst yourselves. some of you have been helpful and others of you have added your two cents where it is not wanted nor needed. did any of you that decided to flame me for how i keep my animals even read my first post. i have SUCCESSFULLY owned and housed two of my four animals like this for YEARS. I do not house all of my animals like this and have two pastels, male and female, that are in separate tanks, and two normals, male and female, that I have decided to keep together. I am well aware of the risks and if I felt that there was concern as mentioned by a couple of you I would remove these two. I have enough space to separate them if that is what I wanted to do. My animals are not babies and have produced eggs for the past three years for me. So my results fly in the face of your judgement. Reading a book about "How to Keep A Ball Python" does not mean that you know everything. Mentioned also was "ask any major breeder" and if you actually did you would know that major breeders change the way they house, light, and heat there cages often and not always do so by "the book". So are they wrong according to what you read or some one told you was "the way it should be done"? Did you know there are major breeders that do not light cycle there animals? Did you know there are major breeders that do not use hide boxes? I am sure that is in "the book" too. I will say again that this thread was started because I have ONE large tank that is difficult to heat and I was wondering if any of the nice intelligent people that frequented this forum could all put there heads together and help me possibly think of some thing I had not already thought of. Instead I get flamed by a couple of people I do not even know about how I should and should not keep and raise my animals when that has NOTHING to do with this thread. Thanks to everyone that just answered the question posted.

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WOW, if you have a temper like this then you need some meds. Please gawd take his snakes from him. Brian Barcyk "The best ball python breeders are ones that have a green thumb for it, not the scientists that read every thing out of the books":banana:

Toss the tank and buy an inexpensive Sterilite or Iris tub. Much easier.. why put your snake and yourself through agony?

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Originally Posted by Ginevive

Toss the tank and buy an inexpensive Sterilite or Iris tub. Much easier.. why put your snake and yourself through agony?

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Woah.. I re-read the thread. Multiple snakes together. Breeding while at the same time not even being able to provide steady temps.. and still having trouble doing that in the third year.. never mind. I rest my case and will now go off to help someone who will listen!
Great post Becky by the way, as usual.