RT Boa or Burmese Python that is the question

Help me decide, I like both of them but have room only for one giant. I like the apperance of both snakes . Main factor in my buying decision is the handling and personality of both species. Not so much the size and feeding habbits, as long as it doesn't feed on me !!! So far I have 2 Ball Pythons in my collection and a Garter. Please help me make a decision based on your experiences with these 2 types.

well. depending on the RTB, the burm will be bigger. myself personally like the bos for the fact of the different morphs out there, and live birth = more babies!

I would not recommend a burm to a person who has only kept small snakes. Even males can hit 100lbs.. not something to take lightly.

Red tails are nice big snakes, but not giants. A nice colombian red tail is a much better choice in my opinion.. most are very docile and beautiful. There are quite a few morphs available as well.

Agreed, RTB's are not giants as defined in snakes. Giants are burms, retics, afrocks, condas... snakes that grow in excess of fifteen feet and weigh over a 100 lbs.

There is no question in my mind... go with the boa! :) They are an excellent entrance into the world of larger snakes without dropping you into the deep end. They are also very fun snakes to care for, usually very calm, always curious and outgoing...

But hey, I'm biased!

no its true. the boas are so much more out going than balls. they are curious, and wont hesitate to investigate (awesome rap line!)

do you know of any boa breeders in MA? Petco over here sell Redtails for $169 which I think is a lot but I'm no expert .
I don't wanna order a snake online without getting a feel of its personality first. I think Craigs list is out of the question either because my last snake I got from there came with extras ( little black extras )

I've kept both and personally I like Burms better. If you want a big snake, boas hardly qualify, but burms can get quite large. The burms I've know just seem to have nicer personalities then the boas I've known. I guess it all comes down to, 'what do YOU like best?' In any case I would suggest getting a small one as your first. That way you can grow into them and make your mistakes while they're still small enough that those mistakes won't have as serious of consequences.

I came accross a boa that I really liked 3ft 8months old at a pet store, seems to be as docile as my BP . So it seems to be a docile snake no aggression at all although I kind of tried to provoke it to strike but it didin't . Its behavior is like my ball probably more curious . So I think I'm gonna buy it today . And I'll post piuctures if all goes well.

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Originally Posted by drugaria

I kind of tried to provoke it to strike but it didin't .

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How'd you do that?

I tried to piss it off while it was still in it's own enclosure .

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Originally Posted by drugaria

I tried to piss it off while it was still in it's own enclosure .

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How nice and you think you are ready to handle a big snake like a mature female boa or a burm? :rolleyes:

Yes I think I'm redy and believe me I am. :ignore:
So tell me how do you choose a snake? You close your eyse you reach in a bag full of snakes and you pick one whatever it is ? Is that how you guys do it ? Well I wanna know exactly what I'm buying and if not I wanna have at least some idea . Try before you Buy!!!!

You have to respect all snakes. They aren't domestic like a cat or dog, and can learn to tolerate us. Some more than others. I really don't see the need to find out the personality of a snake, because I won't be hangin out with it playin x-box and what not. Any snake that is handled and exposed regularly can learn to tolerate me and not bite my head off, but I wouldnt expect every snake I buy to be as docile as a puppy. It comes with the territory, expect their animal nature to come out.

Well that is true but when you are making a longterm commitment you need to find what is right for you in the first place . Lets not forget that snakes are not temporary at least not for me.

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Originally Posted by drugaria

Yes I think I'm redy and believe me I am. :ignore:
So tell me how do you choose a snake? You close your eyse you reach in a bag full of snakes and you pick one whatever it is ? Is that how you guys do it ? Well I wanna know exactly what I'm buying and if not I wanna have at least some idea . Try before you Buy!!!!

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Well I don't choose a snake by purposefully reaching into it's enclosure and trying to "piss it off". What does that do but possibly get you bit and upset an animal needlessly. I have snakes that are a bit snappy in their enclosure but totally fine out of it. I have other snakes that are fine with me in their enclosure but might well react if something outside while I'm handling them startles them. You cannot judge any living thing's overall temperment by bugging it enough to react at you...whether that's a snake, a dog, a horse, whatever. You "piss me off" I'd likely snap at you too.

How do I pick a snake. First off I pick one from a good source so I know the chances of a healthy snake are better. I don't pick from sources that give me a free case of mites with every snake purchased. I pick for good genetics, good health, a good looking snake that comes with a feeding record, etc. I rarely buy from pet stores unless I'm willing to take the risks involved with that and the extra quarantine I must do with any pet store snake.

It's a lot more involved than, "You close your eyse you reach in a bag full of snakes and you pick one whatever it is ?"

Well Yes of course, I only used that as a quote.
Unfortunately my choices are very limited since I do not know any local breeders around here and I wouldn't buy a snake online without interacting with it first, and lets not forget how stressful the shipping proces can be to an animal stuck in a box and being tossed around on conveyer belts in the shipping process.
As far as feeding record they said they have one. As you can see there isn't much choice here .

Why would you intentionally try to irritate any animal? Would you like it if someone came up to you and started poking you with a stick or flicking your ear? NO.

If you're buying a dog, do you go up to it and kick it around to see if it will bite you?

Actually I have a number of snakes shipped in that are very happy and healthy in my collection. Reputable breeders tend to be top shippers (they are certified by the shipper) and the snakes come in generally in beautiful shape. Just got 5 in recently - shipped in cool weather all the way from Texas to Ohio, beautifully, safely and professionally packed. Every one of them is perfect, all have settled in and are eating. :)

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Originally Posted by ladywhipple02

Why would you intentionally try to irritate any animal? Would you like it if someone came up to you and started poking you with a stick or flicking your ear? NO.

If you're buying a dog, do you go up to it and kick it around to see if it will bite you?

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Yes I would. Don't you people really see the purpose of this experiment?
I certainly hope that everyone of you testdrives their new car and does some research before you purchase it .

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Originally Posted by drugaria

Yes I would. Don't you people really see the purpose of this experiment?
I certainly hope that everyone of you testdrives their new car and does some research before you purchase it .

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Well then to make that equation make sense you'd have to "testdrive" that car into a brick wall to see how it reacts to "stress" wouldn't you. Poking at animals to irritate them is NOT an "experiment". It's a childish behaviour that personally I would send my kids to their rooms for doing. Then sit them down for a long talk about respect and common sense.

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Originally Posted by frankykeno

Actually I have a number of snakes shipped in that are very happy and healthy in my collection. Reputable breeders tend to be top shippers (they are certified by the shipper) and the snakes come in generally in beautiful shape. Just got 5 in recently - shipped in cool weather all the way from Texas to Ohio, beautifully, safely and professionally packed. Every one of them is perfect, all have settled in and are eating. :)

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Still it's a chance to be taken, and I know for a fact that any animal gets stressed out in the shipping process, I've worked in the shipping industry and have seen packages being kicked around .

Yes shipping is stressful and it certainly a risk, but many times they aren't even in the air for a full 24 hours. There are some horror stories out there, but I can say that our snakes all arrived within 24 hours, warm, and very secure with no damage to the box. Fedex did a top notch job with our snakes, and got them to us very quickly.

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Originally Posted by drugaria

Yes I would. Don't you people really see the purpose of this experiment?
I certainly hope that everyone of you testdrives their new car and does some research before you purchase it .

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Does this answer make anyone else feel slightly ill???

NO, I do NOT see the purpose of this experiment. If I like a snake, I do not poke it and prod it to try to make it angry. I check and make sure it's healthy---which you clearly have no care for if you're purchasing a mite infested animal---and happy. It it bites or hisses a little, big deal! I'll work with it, no biggie.

I agree with Jo on the immaturity on this one. The fact that you MUST have this snake also speaks volumes. There are plenty of snakes that I have seen that I have wanted... and I have had to take a step back and think to myself, is this really the best thing for me or for the snake?

Perhaps it's time to take a step back and do some thinking? Instead of wanting to take advice, you seem to either ignore it or run right through it...

Still that doesn't change tha fact that I don't get to interact with the snake before buyin it .

Well, why not wait until a reptile show? Like NARBC? (Just an example) At the show you can meet hundreds of breeders, handle the animals yourself. It's a great way to get first hand experience with the animal, have any questions answered by the breeder, and just get to meet some more enthusiasts like yourself.

Trust us, we all know what its like to see a snake and just HAVE TO HAVE IT. I am there most of the time I'm awake, but practicing patience will often have great results. I'm not putting you down, but sometimes buying from an unknown source like a pet store is just not going to be good, esp when it comes with free mites. Unless they produced the animal themselves and have done so for some time, I wouldn't trust them anymore than any good boa breeder like Jeremy Stone. (Someone who has worked with boas for YEARS, and is arguably one of the biggest boa breeders around.)

In the end, it's your decision, we're just trying to help you make an informed one. ;)

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Originally Posted by drugaria

Well Yes of course, I only used that as a quote.
Unfortunately my choices are very limited since I do not know any local breeders around here and I wouldn't buy a snake online without interacting with it first, and lets not forget how stressful the shipping process can be to an animal stuck in a box and being tossed around on conveyor belts in the shipping process.
As far as feeding record they said they have one. As you can see there isn't much choice here .

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Why is interacting with it so important to you. If you can handle the animal and are ready to care for it think of it like a marriage for better or worse. Animals can be calmed with time and patient work. If your not willing or able to give that from the door walk away till you are.

Your choices are not limited they are narrowed by the manner you wish to get your animal. Which is no big deal but it also limits the number of and quality of animals at your reach. Which is totally your decision. But to knowing get an animal with mites and risk health of your other snakes and sacrifice the quality of the animals in you collection because of the possibility of stress from shipping or the fact that you might get a nippy baby is not the mark of a person that should be adding any new animals just yet. It sounds more like the kind of impulse by that cost loads in vet bills and ends all to often in keeper stress the inability to enjoy the animal they just MUST have.

As many have said boa's are no joke..They have way stronger feeding responses so a SFE is painful and can be dangerous. Prior to getting a boa think long term. Will you be able to house it in say 4-5 years when it is 4-6 feet long and eating a large rat every week or if its a female house a 9-11 foot snake with more strength than three men.

My suggestion: Take it or leave it. Get some time dealing with snakes first. I gather your new to snake keeping. Deal with some problems remember these animals are way long term. So when most people say "oh yea I want to add another snake. I think I'm ready cause I have been keeping a ball for 5 or six months" thats a drop in the bucket for the amount of time you will spend with it. To say "I think I'm ready to add another snake" means that person is not sure you can handle it.

An experienced keeper even of just one snake doesn't look at like "I think I'm ready" they simply say hey thats a hot animal I want to add that one and boom its done. I my self waited 2.5 almost three years before adding even one more ball to my collection of a whopping 1 when I first started keeping. I dealt with not feeding, escapes, temp problems, humidity problems, bad sheds, bedding scares and more and thats just with one snake.

As for trying to "piss it off" to test for temperament...Its a snake if you succeed in pissing it off it might bite you...brovo! you pissed off a snake and it bit you what does that prove? You poke and pester a snake long enough and it will poke back. I have animals that will bite you if you sat there and tried to piss them off, but I would hand these animals to a 4 year old with no worries. If your worried about getting bit...I'd suggest a different hobby..Because sooner or later you will get bit.

Remember marathon not sprint. Theres no rush at all on adding a new animal. There will be RTB and all sorts of boas to choose from for years to come. They are fantastic animals and offer years of companionship and enjoyment. But like any animal and snake in particular you have to take to good with the bad.

I couldn't agree more with you Freakie Frog. So far your comment has been the most meaningfull, and not biased for which I Thank You. Bottom line is that every keeper wants a good animals in their collections depending upon on their criteria for good is. And because of that I am going to select it . Boas are certainly a "No Joke Snake" and I truely believe the extra effort selecting it is worth. With different individuals different instingts are stronger than others .They can be somewhat modified over the course of their life depending upon their interaction with the environment but cannot be changed.
For that reason interacting with a snake first is so important to me.

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Originally Posted by frankykeno

Well then to make that equation make sense you'd have to "testdrive" that car into a brick wall to see how it reacts to "stress" wouldn't you. Poking at animals to irritate them is NOT an "experiment". It's a childish behaviour that personally I would send my kids to their rooms for doing. Then sit them down for a long talk about respect and common sense.

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Well that is just your interpretation of this.

Apparently I read something different in his post. :rolleyes:

Why would you even support a pet store than knowingly has mites? Mites suck blood, which make the snake anemic, which weakens the immune system, and the snake gets very sick. WHY? There are SO many good breeders out there with high quality animals, that it's really never a question for me to buy from them over a crappy pet store.

With a quality breeder, you KNOW that animal has been cared for properly, doesn't have internal OR external parasites, is well-started, eating and growing like it should.

With a pet store, you don't know any of those answers. That snake could be 8 months or it could be a stunted 3 year old.

I've had ALOT of snakes shipped to me, and all of them have come out of the box just fine, settled in quickly, and ate within the first week of having them. It's a minor setback in their world compared to the many vet visits, car rides, mite treatments, etc that you would have to put them through if you bought that pet store boa. Who knows what could be passed onto your Ball Python if you didn't properly quarantine..

I got my boa a year ago from Jo(Frankykeno) up in Michigan/Ohio. She rescued Sonja from this twit of a girl who didn't have a clue and was scared of the snake. Sonja was being kept in a 40 gallon tank with a big heat rock on one side and a huge tub of water on the other, no other heat sources. So, she was either freezing or was being burned. She actually came to Jo with a big burn from her chin to her vent on her belly. After a few months in Jo's care, Sonja was shipped down here by Casey Hulse and arrived just fine. She settled in and has been trucking along perfectly ever since.

She's now around 3-3.5 years old, 8ft long and weighs 25lbs+. She just ate a 2lb rabbit last night as a matter of fact.

I've handled Burmese Pythons of 8ft+ and I've held Sonja, and nothing really compares to the strength of a boa. I ALWAYS have another person available if I am taking her out of her enclosure. She's incredibly strong and doesn't just "sit there" like a limp noodle.

Why not try for a Carpet Python or something. They get to 7-8ft but are more slender. It's a good step up from a Ball.

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Originally Posted by Freakie_frog

Why is interacting with it so important to you...

As for trying to "piss it off" to test for temperament...Its a snake if you succeed in pissing it off it might bite you...brovo! you pissed off a snake and it bit you what does that prove? You poke and pester a snake long enough and it will poke back. I have animals that will bite you if you sat there and tried to piss them off, but I would hand these animals to a 4 year old with no worries. If your worried about getting bit...I'd suggest a different hobby..Because sooner or later you will get bit.

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I think you missed this portion of his statement. It seems to me that the only reason you wish to interact with the snake first is because you want to see if it will bite you... you want to "piss it off."

I'm in total agreement with Freakie Frog, as well. If you're worried about getting bit, this is not the hobby for you.

Yep Becky I literally watched that big girl tail hook furniture and happily drag it around with her and she was just passing the 6 foot mark back then. Big female boas are powerhouses with very long strike ranges and a punch behind that mouthful of teeth. I was always amazed that Sonja ended up with such a nice temperment considering the string of bad owners she had before we took her in, fixed her up and sent her off to you.

While I adore boas and we are in the process of adopting a big 8 foot female boa from Jamie, I don't think they are for everyone or to be taken on lightly. This is 8 feet of solid power, much more than I'd consider handling alone (I'm barely over 5 feet) and even though Tequila (the snake from Jamie) has a good even temperment...you just can't be dumb about the potential or disrespect that power.

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Originally Posted by drugaria

Well Yes of course, I only used that as a quote.
Unfortunately my choices are very limited since I do not know any local breeders around here and I wouldn't buy a snake online without interacting with it first, and lets not forget how stressful the shipping proces can be to an animal stuck in a box and being tossed around on conveyer belts in the shipping process.
As far as feeding record they said they have one. As you can see there isn't much choice here .

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The majority of my collection has been shipped to me. I don't find them to be overly stressed from the shipping experience when they've been properly packed.

The sellers send me enough pictures to decide if it's a snake that I want. I make the opening of the box and putting them away for acclimation as quiet and as un-eventful as possible.

Actually, you have lots of choices, you've just chosen to eliminate one of them.

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Originally Posted by drugaria

Yes I would. Don't you people really see the purpose of this experiment?
I certainly hope that everyone of you testdrives their new car and does some research before you purchase it .

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Please tell me that you are not serious about kicking a dog to see if it would bite you. I would HOPE it would bite you for kicking it. Geez Louise!!!!

No - you are not ready for any other animals at this time. You show so little compassion for them that you'd intentionally stress them out in the store, kick a dog, but you worry about stress from shipping? You've got to be kidding me!

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Originally Posted by drugaria

Still it's a chance to be taken, and I know for a fact that any animal gets stressed out in the shipping process, I've worked in the shipping industry and have seen packages being kicked around .

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And trying to invoke a strike or kicking a dog isn't stressful? You are contradicting yourself.

Yes, freakie and lynn have it right. Snakes aren't like dogs, and dont know that they should not bite the hand that feeds them. They can't be trained to not bite in the same sense as a dog, but they can learn to not see you as a threat through interaction.

Expecting any snake to not bite you when your messing with it is pretty rediciulous. If it sees you as a threat, it will either fight, or flee. This does not mean that one "test" of yours, with the snake deciding to flee, does not mean that the snake will always choose to flee rather than fight.

I think health and background are far more important than temperament when it comes to snakes.

I suggest you throw the whole personality-specific side away. Understand that they are working on some very simple instincts, and they always have the possibility to bite you, but also always have the possibility to be a calm and "sweet puppy pumpkinnoodleface".

You just wont really know their temperament for sure until you have that animal home with you, settled and eating.
[edit]
I just saw the kicking dog comment, I meant no comparison with my post.

Another factor anyone must take into consideration is there are SNAKES, not puppies, not kittens, not social pack or herd driven animals. If you expect for one second that a snake that doesn't bite you today will never bite you....well have fun with that.

Do they bite all the time, no...rarely if ever in my case (1 bite ever and it doesn't even count), but I'm ready every single time I crack a tub to deal with a bite or an attempt to bite. Doesn't mean I'm scared of the snakes or think they are "mean", it just means I know they are snakes....not puppies...not kittens.

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Originally Posted by drugaria

I tried to piss it off while it was still in it's own enclosure .

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:rolleye2:

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Originally Posted by drugaria

Yes I would. Don't you people really see the purpose of this experiment?
I certainly hope that everyone of you testdrives their new car and does some research before you purchase it .

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I don't see the purpose of such an experiment but I am glad you do, tell me how it goes for you when you experience that with a burm :rolleyes: ;)

You're not kidding about that Joanna. Petco had a nice looking DARK reduced pattern baby, with good weight on it, and was female that bit the snot out of me on Monday.

I didn't buy it - not because it bit me (you and I both know that those tend to be the best feeders), but because it was Christmas eve and I don't like to impulse buy. I walked away from her because I know I've got two coming (being shipped) in January and hopefully lots of babies this spring.

You people are missing the whole point and are miquoting everything I say in this thread.
FIRST OF ALL where in the world do you see that I harmed that snake or any my snakes. I'am tired of this nonsense people !!!!!!!!!!
All I did was a simple test for deffensive aggression by waving the palm of my hand in front of him.
SECOND OF ALL you guys have no idea on how I'am raising my snakes yet you waste no time in making impulsive judgements and get upset when a new member chalanges your point of view.
That is why like many others here I hate forums because at the end it is always the same old thing. I will admit that I've learned a lot of things from this forum. However most of the responses in this thread today have proven to be detrimental to the values of this forum and I honestly feel that I have wasted my time here with this question.

A person cannot misquote you when they use the quote button. We responded to what you typed, simple as that. If you wish to be understood fully, explain fully by typing the words you want us to actually read. Last I heard we had a lot of great snake folks here but we're a tad short on the mindreaders. :)

I think you are missing the point. YOU are getting upset because we are challenging YOUR point of view. There are many people here from all different walks of life and all different parts of the country telling you the exact same thing... but you refuse to listen and stand by your convictions.

So, okay... in a way, I can respect that. Still... when many different people are saying the same thing, maybe it would do well to listen?

I'm going to take a step back. I'm getting frustrated and clearly you are as well. So, let's come to a compromise...

I don't expect you to turn completely around and say "Yes, you're all right and I'm wrong." That's not the way this works. We all learn from every encounter. We change ourselves based on the information and experiences we take away.

What I do expect is for you to at least CONSIDER that we might be at least somewhat correct. Mites are not a good thing... yes, they may be easy to treat, but they still indicate that something is wrong. If you still really want this snake, please consider moving the cage far away from the rest of your collection so they do not get mites as well. Also, please take the snake to a vet immediately to determine if this is it's only problem. Mites CAN spread disease and it would do you and the snake well to get him/her checked.

All of here on the forum LOVE animals. We wouldn't be here if we didn't. The fact that you were teasing this animal in anyway gets our backs up. It sounded as if you did more than wave your hand in front of it... but if that's all you did, I will back away. Pleaes do not tease these animals but poking them or prodding them. In all honesty, in this profession you ARE going to get bit. It happens in ANY profession that deals with animals. If you do not want to get bit, do not work with animals (or children for that matter ;) ).

Also, please consider taking a step back and consider purchasing another animal. I'm not sure why you have such a big problem with shipping, but most of here have purchased animals off line with very little problems. If all of us can do it safely, and we all care for our animals immensely... maybe it's not so wrong???


All of on this forum have, at one time or another, come to a disagreement with other members of this forum. It happens. It's a free country... GOD BLESS AMERICA. We have the right to say what we want, and we have the right to get angry when someone says something we don't like. However, we are also human... and we have the ability to learn from our experiences, and better our situations---and that of the people and animals we care for.

Please, before you get angry... take a step back, and consider the fact that you might be a little bit wrong, we might be a little bit right, and we are only trying to help.

Yes I will , Thank You
I'm really glad that somebody sees my point.
I'll make my decision for this animal on site and will do everything necessery to make sure it is indeed healthy (if/when) I purchase it and does not spread disease and parasites to my other animals. Be sure of that , including a trip to the vet.

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Originally Posted by drugaria

SECOND OF ALL you guys have no idea on how I'am raising my snakes yet you waste no time in making impulsive judgements and get upset when a new member chalanges your point of view.
That is why like many others here I hate forums because at the end it is always the same old thing. I will admit that I've learned a lot of things from this forum. However most of the responses in this thread today have proven to be detrimental to the values of this forum and I honestly feel that I have wasted my time here with this question.

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Not to drag up harsh feelings or anything, but this seems to be the mantra of any person that finds themselves being disagreed with on this site lately. Sounds like they're regurging the hate speech. And also, how have you challenged us and our points of view? Being cautious is not a point of view, it's good practice.

I didn't know so many people that are on this forum actually hate it.

And I also didn't know giving sound advice was detrimental, whether it was agreed with or not.

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Originally Posted by drugaria

You people are missing the whole point and are miquoting everything I say in this thread.
FIRST OF ALL where in the world do you see that I harmed that snake or any my snakes. I'am tired of this nonsense people !!!!!!!!!!
All I did was a simple test for deffensive aggression by waving the palm of my hand in front of him.
SECOND OF ALL you guys have no idea on how I'am raising my snakes yet you waste no time in making impulsive judgements and get upset when a new member chalanges your point of view.
That is why like many others here I hate forums because at the end it is always the same old thing. I will admit that I've learned a lot of things from this forum. However most of the responses in this thread today have proven to be detrimental to the values of this forum and I honestly feel that I have wasted my time here with this question.

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If you don't like it stop asking for our advice.

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Originally Posted by ladywhipple02

I think you are missing the point. YOU are getting upset because we are challenging YOUR point of view.

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That is exactly the problem.