At what point do I force Feed?????

Hello All,

Well I have a clutch of 5 babies from a Spider Male to normal female. After about 2 weeks I attempted to feed them. One of them hit a pinky rat without hesitation and has continued to eat but the rest refuse to eat. I have tried pinky rats, pinky mice, and little small hopper mice. They were hatched on November 4th (completly out of egg) The have lost very little weight but I am now concerned and would welcome any experianced help. They are all in the exact same tub with underbelly heat and are not and have never been agressive. I thank you for any help you can give.

Well I had 7 hatch on 9/7/07 Im feeding right now as I type this. I have 1 male that hasent started yet. Ive tried feeding everything nothing has worked ive tried force feeding didnt work. He is alot smaller than the rest, but still not to bad. Some of the others have only eaten 2 or 3 times. I had a hard time getting all of them to eat but one. Here is a great link helped me out alot. http://www.8ballpythons.com/journal/...ingseating.htm

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Originally Posted by firehop

Hello All,

Well I have a clutch of 5 babies from a Spider Male to normal female. After about 2 weeks I attempted to feed them. One of them hit a pinky rat without hesitation and has continued to eat but the rest refuse to eat. I have tried pinky rats, pinky mice, and little small hopper mice. They were hatched on November 4th (completly out of egg) The have lost very little weight but I am now concerned and would welcome any experianced help. They are all in the exact same tub with underbelly heat and are not and have never been agressive. I thank you for any help you can give.

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I would suggest you give them another 4 or 5 days and give them a try.Sometimes they are stubborn and hunger will win eventually ;).Relax its still to early to worry to much ;)

i've tried frozen/thawed rat pinks, frozen thawed mouse fuzzys, live rat pinks and live mouse fuzzy. my pastel hasnt eaten for 3 weeks now and is gettin very skinny he drinks and does everything normal just not eating and losing alot of weight im thinking about trying a mouse slurry but not sure on how i would try to feed that and also i dont wanna force a mouse down my snakes throat and me wind up getting bit.

anymore info on this subject would be greatly apprecaited

:(I'm having DSL troubles this evening and can only get on a very few sites (thank goodness this is one of them). I think it's an AT&T problem - as all circuits are busy.

In any case - go to http://www.8ballpythons.com and check out his articles and look for starting hatchlings article and use that as a guide. If I could get to it, I'd post the link - but I can't.

Whoops, should have read that ama posted the link already (I can't even edit tonight either - weird!)

I checked out 8balls post and I feel alot better. Thanks everybody for your help and I will relax and take my time with feeding.

yea hasnt helped me any i got the bp like the second day out of the egg the guy told me to wait till it shed and then wait another week to feed well the first time i fed him he ate and that was 4 weeks and i tried pinkies again and nothin so now i have a hopper a lil smaller then his girth but he seems to be scared of anything that moves and isnt interested in anything thats not moving i think he might wind up being a shy feeder i tried putting him and the food in a bag, in a box, in the bathtub, on my bed, in his cage, and in the box i bought the mouse home in my temps are 92 on hot side 80 on cool 60% humidity

Hi,

Have you tried stepping the size back down to a fuzzy?

Are you giving him a week or five days between all these different attempts or just trying them all closer together?

I ask because you mention 7 types of feeding tricks yet he only refused 3 weeks or so ago?


dr del

So someone sold a 2 day old snake, knowing you had no experience starting hatchlings? Shameful!

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Originally Posted by Monty

yea hasnt helped me any i got the bp like the second day out of the egg the guy told me to wait till it shed and then wait another week to feed well the first time i fed him he ate and that was 4 weeks and i tried pinkies again and nothin so now i have a hopper a lil smaller then his girth but he seems to be scared of anything that moves and isnt interested in anything thats not moving i think he might wind up being a shy feeder i tried putting him and the food in a bag, in a box, in the bathtub, on my bed, in his cage, and in the box i bought the mouse home in my temps are 92 on hot side 80 on cool 60% humidity

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Who sold you a bp only two days out of the egg and no first meal?? that was just a poor set-up to start out owning a Bp.

ok i've had him a lil more then 6 weeks and he ate the first time after shed then 5 weeks now and no feeding and within those 5 weeks i tried live pinkies first he ate one of them. my second week i a pinkie again no go. 3rd week i bought a 3 pack of frozen hopper mice. and a 3 pack of pink rats. i tried the hoppers the 3rd week the forth week i tried the pink rats. and today woulda been 5 days from the last time so i went out and bought a live hopper to see if that would get him but he no go he just tucks his head in and covers up and doesnt look interested then when i go to take the hopper out he becomes interested. then when igot to put it back in nothing i tried prescenting i tried all the methods suggested though out this forum. im seriously worried about it. if you have any other suggestions or comments please help me.

Hi,

Well the standard advice is to stop handling and double check nothing has changed in his environment like temps etc then leave him for a week and try and do everything exactly the way you did it the first time.

Have you asked the people you got him from what their feeding regime was to see if they have any good advice as well?



dr del

i tried to call but very poor customer service they said for there larger babies they feed live rat pinks and to the smaller live hoppers. and my temps havent changed at all and only thing i ever move around in his tank is the water bowl when i go to change it out. other then that i only handle him about 5 mins a day. but ill stop that till he gets at least 4 good meals in him


also the first time i fed him went exactly like this.

4 pinkie mice in his tank right next to him he moved away ate one and went into his hide. i took the other 3 out and from then on he hasnt eaten a bite. i really would like him to survive and be as healthy as i can get him. i feel bad cuz of how sickly he has been looking though he still tonge flicks and is very active

This is my first year with babies that wouldnt eat. Ive never had any babies that didnt start eating within 2 weeks. I just checked my babies. The last one that has not eaten. Ate for me tonight. He is almost 3 months old the 7th of this month will be 3 months old. I went by the how to in that link I posted and worked great. Took a bit but did work. This male was hatched at 70g and is down to 45g so he lost a bit of weight. Stick with it if you get worried take it to the vet see what they say.

Personally I've never been successful in feeding pinkies to ball pythons. To small and too little movement. My best luck has always been with a hopper mouse that's active and jumping around a lot. If the snake seems scared or timid, give him an open hidebox that he can feel secure sitting inside while watching the mouse. Leave the mouse in the cage overnight. Ball pythons are attracted by three things. Smell, heat, and movement. In my opinion a live active hopper mouse is the best for fulfilling those three criteria. I really wouldn't go with a smaller mouse because they just don't move enough.

yea i caught up with dr del in the forum chat room last nite and was talking to him i tried a hopper last nite not going for it hes scared of the movement but uses dead food as a pillow. also last nite i did kill the hopper and tried to brain it since it was feeding day for him anway i figured thats what i would do to leave it in the cage over nite maybe attract him to it but alas he used it as a pillow.

so i got a vet appointment for him at 4 this after noon and going to the only vet i trust with my snakes because i worked there for a short time and hes had 45 years reptile experiacne 25 birds and 50 small animals

but i am against injections on such a small bp

If he's not attracted to live prey, he's not going to be attracted to dead prey. Give him a hide box where he can watch the mouse while feeling secure. Then leave them alone overnight.

What is the vet planning on doing? Force feeding?

I have a small handful of hatchlings every year that are slow starters.

For those, I have a trick that has yet to fail. Leave a mouse crawler in their tub overnight. A crawler is not a threat to the snake and sometimes all the hatchling needs is a little time to think about it and be secluded without someone constantly checking on them...

I hope this helps.

Justin

tried that thanks justin i got him 2 days out of the egg and he ate the first week but hasnt eaten in 5 now

UPDATE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

i went to the vet today with the pastel and he said everything internally and externally are fine no parasites hes just under nourished my vet told me to wait a week try a live hopper and if he doesnt eat that week wait another and assist feed

You might want to read this.

http://www.ralphdavisreptiles.com/ma..._robyn_pro.asp

Two days out of the egg, no feeding history and they sold this snake to someone with zip experience with hatchlings. Why am I not surprised that they've given you poor customer service when you tried to get back with them over your concerns.

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Originally Posted by Monty

tried that thanks justin i got him 2 days out of the egg and he ate the first week but hasnt eaten in 5 now

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If he started eating on his own the first time and has now stopped I'd be more inclined to say that he not eating because of stress out. Especially when the vet trip is tacked on.

thanks frankykeno for the website i tried 8balls method it didnt work

yea all he gave me was his genetics info. and im surprised i even got that.

no experiacne in hatchlings well now i know what i did wrong in the beginning now ill be ready for when i breed and know what to do but i am deff still asking questions cuz it deffinatly isnt cool to just let someone go like that with out any info and since it was at a reptile show and i tried to talk to him and all he was worried about was selling.

well i tried to feed him last nite didnt work so this after noon i took him to the vet and now im gonna let him settle back in for a week before i try anything

We Need an update?

Richard

I dont know if you mean update on mine or the other one but Mine still havnt eaten and we are getting close to forcing. They have lost around 10% body mass but are still real active and I am holding out hope they will eat this week.

my pastel ate!!!!!!!!!!


firehop i wish you luck and if yours have eaten everyone one this site gives great advice listen to them and learn.

thanks everyone

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Originally Posted by firehop

I dont know if you mean update on mine or the other one but Mine still havnt eaten and we are getting close to forcing. They have lost around 10% body mass but are still real active and I am holding out hope they will eat this week.

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Rick,
At this stage with your hatchlings, I would try assist feeding (NOT force feeding). By this I mean, take a P/K or F/T mouse hopper, and stick the head of the prey into the mouth of the baby ball python. Allow the nose of the nose to just touch the back of the mouth, and keep the snake's 2 jaws in contact with the mouse. Then GENTLY tug the mouse in an outward direction (as if taking it out of the snakes mouth). This will cause the backward curved teeth of the snake to "latch" the mouse, making it less easy for the snake to release the meal. Set the snake back in to it's enclosure, and leave it alone for an hour. Go back and check on the snake, and my bet is the mouse will be gone. This has had great success for me over the last few years. I think some snakes just need to get the food in their mouth, and their feeding response kicks in.

Note: I had a pinstripe female that I had to do this too this year. After assist feeding her three times, she still would not eat n her own. However, the next 2 assist feedings, she would bite down and wrap around the prey as soon as I got her mouth open. After 5 assist feedings, she tears up the rat pups like she never had a problem.

Good luck with your stubborn feeders,

Tim,

As always your a huge help. I will give this a try this weekend. I will keep you all updated. As always this place rocks.

Rick,
If you need to, give me a call. You can find my number on the website.

Tim and all, they all ate last night with a lot of help. most of them acted like I was feeding them spinach and thrashed until it came off their teeth. After the third try they all took it. I hope they help me out and eat now but that would be entirely too easy. Thanks for the help and with a potential 12-18 clutches coming I look to be busy this spring. thanks again and I will keep you all updated.

Rick,
I'm glad to hear that you are getting your experince up to speed with problem feeders. With 12-18 clutches coming, you are correct. You will be a busy man. Congrats on the successful feedings, and I hope they do well for you.

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Originally Posted by firehop

Tim and all, they all ate last night with a lot of help. most of them acted like I was feeding them spinach and thrashed until it came off their teeth. After the third try they all took it. I hope they help me out and eat now but that would be entirely too easy. Thanks for the help and with a potential 12-18 clutches coming I look to be busy this spring. thanks again and I will keep you all updated.

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Thats great Rick :gj:

Good news from both Rick and Monty! We had an albino female hatchling refuse to eat for 11 weeks this year. I was very worrried that she wouldn't make it. But she did eat, and has been eating ever since. She was no smaller than the others when hatched and no weaker. Go figure . . . .

Hey all,
Just an update for all of you that helped. All but one are eating on their own. The one thats not eating I assist fed again and it was much easier than last time (almost as if he looked at me and said "ok lets get this over with you big hairy human thing"). They all are very active and there have been no other issues. Again thanks to all of you that helped and I have gained a wealth of experiance with this group.

This is a great thread with alot of information.
Thanks all !!!!!

Congrats Rick. It's an easy process once you get a few feding under your belt. I bet next year, you won't have any qualms, and you'll look like a pro assisting snakes.