Paradox

I've been seeing a lot of ads on Kingsnakes with paradox's, mostly paradox albinos. What brings out the paradox in a snake? Or is it totally random?

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Originally Posted by Nagini88

I've been seeing a lot of ads on Kingsnakes with paradox's, mostly paradox albinos. What brings out the paradox in a snake? Or is it totally random?

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if im not mistaken the genetics still are unknown so I guess random?

One out there possibility is called chimeraism. Basically two separate fertilized eggs fuse together to make one offspring, sort of the opposite of identical twins. Parts of the animal are from one of the eggs and other parts from the other egg. No telling which is responsible for the reproductive tract.

Chimeraism has recently been recognized to happen with humans after investigating apparently impossible paternity/maternity tests but it's unclear how common it is. If it happened with normal ball pythons or even in clutches that could only produce the same mutation you wouldn't notice it. It's only when a clutch could produce more than one type that you have the chance for say a mutant and a normal to fuse. I've not yet heard of one of these paradox albinos coming from a clutch that couldn't have produced both normals and albinos to disprove the theory but that's not saying much as few albino X albino breedings are done and most do involve hets.

Even if chimeraism is responsible for some of the paradox animals there could be other causes seen too.

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Originally Posted by RandyRemington

One out there possibility is called chimeraism. Basically two separate fertilized eggs fuse together to make one offspring, sort of the opposite of identical twins. Parts of the animal are from one of the eggs and other parts from the other egg. No telling which is responsible for the reproductive tract.

Chimeraism has recently been recognized to happen with humans after investigating apparently impossible paternity/maternity tests but it's unclear how common it is. If it happened with normal ball pythons or even in clutches that could only produce the same mutation you wouldn't notice it. It's only when a clutch could produce more than one type that you have the chance for say a mutant and a normal to fuse. I've not yet heard of one of these paradox albinos coming from a clutch that couldn't have produced both normals and albinos to disprove the theory but that's not saying much as few albino X albino breedings are done and most do involve hets.

Even if chimeraism is responsible for some of the paradox animals there could be other causes seen too.

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What kind of impossible maternity/paternity tests in humans? Children with more than one biological father?

kind of like taking a baby's blood right after delivery and have it not having it match the parents right?

This thread went way into left field :confused:

so the mom and dad might not be the dad or mom....................wow i'm so confused! :confused: :confused:

I've heard of at least two cases where tests showed that the mother who delivered the babies wasn't the mom. In one case it looks like one of her ovaries belonged to a twin and the other was her own so two of her children tested to be a donor didn't show up as being hers.

The hard part is knowing how often this happens as there isn't a lot of testing and even then it would only be caught under very specific conditions. With men it's probably always written off as another father but with the mothers it was a little harder to explain away. In the other case they sent a court representative to take a sample at the birth of a new child to confirm that it was possible she didn't steal her older children.

But, back to ball pythons. Some of the paradox animals may be morphs combined with normal looking siblings and might breed as the normal looking het or possible het.

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Originally Posted by juddb

This thread went way into left field :confused:

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Yeah.. I wanted to try and figure out what genes it held so I could see what would happen if I bred a paradox x jigsaw because I saw a Paradox Mojave (WTF Morphs) and it looks NUTS. And I'm getting a Jigsaw soon sooo... Not sure if anyone else here spends way too much time on the Genetic Wizard on WOBP..But I do :oops:

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Originally Posted by Dev_DeCoste

Yeah.. I wanted to try and figure out what genes it held so I could see what would happen if I bred a paradox x jigsaw because I saw a Paradox Mojave (WTF Morphs) and it looks NUTS. And I'm getting a Jigsaw soon sooo... Not sure if anyone else here spends way too much time on the Genetic Wizard on WOBP..But I do :oops:

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This thread is over 6 years old. :D

And still no answers! lol I was just Googling paradox bp and this thread came up

lol, the thread is from 2007 :)


anyway, in BPs it appears to be random, at least in most cases its random.

however, a recessive morph that will cause EXTREME paradoxes has since been discovered. its called atomic. it seems as if that gene will cover the entire body of the snake with tons of paradoxes that sort of blend into each other.

http://www.worldofballpythons.com/mo...mic-queen-bee/ this atomic queen bee looks totally insane. sort of like different patterns layered on top of each other.

I've still not heard much on breeding results to figure out paradox ball pythons.

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Originally Posted by RandyRemington

I've still not heard much on breeding results to figure out paradox ball pythons.

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isnt that exactly what the atomic morph is? i see it as a proven genetic recessive that will cover the whole BP with extreme paradoxes. of course that will be more clear once people manage to produce double-recessive atomic albinos or atomic axanthics.

i heared that in some other species, there also are recessives that will cause lots of paradoxes. what i have never heared about is a gene that only causes one or two paradoxes, it seems to be all or nothing. so maybe the atomic gene is the best we can hope for.

as for the random paradoxes that occur in albinos or axanthics sometimes, maybe its just that a cell in the early development mutates in a way that reverts it back to normal, leading to an area of normal coloration. if that is true, no way to prove it out. if the sexual organs are affected you would just get normals, and if they are not affected you would just get more axanthics / albinos. and here breeders really seem out of luck.

So you're basically saying it is impossible to breed more? It's just kind of a luck thing?

Or you would need 2 het Atomic snakes and then just hope for the best with the offspring?

Paradox is random. Like a glitch in the phenotypic coding.

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