Switching to Tub, Need Clarification on a Few Points

Hi All! Though I rarely post, I must say that the people on this forum are the best, most valuable BP resource I have found! That said, there are SO many messages, that in two days of searching, I have not been able to find answers to a few details I want to make sure I get right. So ....

Situation: I am in the process of switching my 2yo BP from the large (expensive, fancy, blah, blah) herp enclosure I have from my previous snake (boa) to a tub. (Yes, I'm a convert!) I have only one BP - no racks and no other reptiles.

What I have so far:
• 16 QT Iris "Buckle-Up Box"
http://www.craftsetc.com/store/item....0&ItemId=47814
• Stick-on Felt Pads to raise tub off of surface it's sitting on
• Soldering tool
• T-Rex Aspen Bed substrate

Question #1: My previous Acu Rite Indoor/Outdoor with Humidity thermometer is not working (nothing reading on the LCD screen) and a battery change does not make any difference. Because I couldn't find the instructions, I've been trying to get another, but I haven't been able to find one yet (Wal-mart is out of them, etc). By any chance has anyone had this problem and know the magic fix? Or being cheap, does it just need to be replaced? This is the kind I have:
http://www.weatherconnection.com/mfg...29964&mfgno=21

Question #2: I live in Utah - low humidity, especially with indoor air/heating. I know I need to solder holes into the tub for ventilation and that the number of holes depends on humidity. What is the minimum number of holes for good ventilation? How big do I make the holes? (I've seen several pix, but haven't been sure what size I was looking at - hard to tell without something to measure!) Also, where should I put the holes? Top? Sides? Front? All in the same area?

Question #3: I know from reading posts that I will be ordering some Flexwatt tape and a thermostat (perhaps a Helix) from Reptile Basics and having Rich put it all together. The problem is, I'm not sure how much I need and for where. (Note that the transition to a tub is happening in part to keep the heat up to the correct temps AND steady - the temp goes too low, too often!) It sounds like some on the sides and/or the back, plus some on the bottom is good. But how much? On one, two or three sides? Should it be the height of the tub or 3/4 of the height or even less? How does this effect my ventilation holes? (See question #2.)

As for the bottom, how MUCH of the bottom do I put tape on? On just one half to make the warm side? Or on both, but controlled with different thermostats? And I've seen mention of towels being useful to regulate temperatures ... would this ever be necessary with Flexwatt and a thermostat?

Question #4: I've seen lots of posts about sticking down the temperature probes ... some saying don't stick them down so you can move them to different locations, others say to tape them down so the snake won't get tangled in them. And there seems to be a lot of concern about tape ... what kind/brand of tape should one use, if one does tape down probes?

Question #5: And when I do tape down/place the probes, where do I put them? Attached to the aspen-covered floor? If so, where? In the hides? If you put them in the hides, do you need two thermostats, one for each hide? (Sounds expensive!) Also, I've seen posts recommending that the thermostate probes be placed both outside and inside ... which is it?

Question #6: My boa needed a large, heavy water dish big enough to soak in. As near as I can tell, that's not necessary for a BP, which is good because the tub is small (as recommended). So ... I've seen several different pix ... what is the best water dish for a BP?

Question #7: Not related to the other questions ... in my searching, I saw a post showing a BP in its hide and then with the hide off, so you could see how tight they like their hides to be. But now I can't find that thread. Can anyone point me in the right direction?

I hope I provided enough information. Thanks in advance for your replies!!

Peggy :)

Hello!! I will try to answer the questions that I can, as I don;t have the answers to all of them.

Question 1:
I had an accurite that failed on me one time and wouldn't measure temps or humidity... kinda like yours but not a blank screen, just read "HIGH" on everything. (I think I got it wet when I was misting my tank...not real sure though.) Anyway, I couldn't get mine to work right so I ended up just replacing it. You may just need to go and get another one. I would just keep checking at your local walmart, they should be getting some in soon (I used to be a manager for one at one time.... the one thing they hated was empty spots on the shelves!!!)

Question 2 &3:
Will have to be answered by someone more experienced than I with tubs and flexwatt. Right now I have tanks and UTHs.

Question 4:
I don't have my temp probe taped down, I just normally bury it under the substrate on the hot side in the hide so it rests right above the uth (which is on the outside of the tank underneath). I am constantly checking temps etc. in my tanks and have learned to tell when my snakes have moved their temp probes (the temp readings are then lower than normal). So then I move them back. I have read a post one time on here where someone suggested using painters tape to tape down probes inside the enclosure, its less sticky. But I am not sure if this type of tape could be harmful to a snake if it came into contact with it...... maybe someone reading this could answer about the painters tape and its use??? Is that type of tape harmful too?

Question 5:
With my digital thermometer (an accurite), I place the unit itself in the cool side and run the probe over to the hot side and place it touching the glass over the uth underneath the substrate inside the hot side hide. (did that make sense?)
My thermostat probe is taped to the uth outside of the tank. This way it is taking a better reading of the temp of the uth and my BP cannot move that probe.
And you would need to run each heat source (flexwatt or uths) through a thermostat, although I believe that most thermostats can handle more then one heat source (as long as the watts(is it watts??) of the heat sources combined are not greater than the watt power of the thermostat). But again I am not using flexwatt, so someone with more experience on that would have to answer this better.

Question 6:
The best water dish is something too heavy for your BP to be able to easily tip over, and with enough surface area to affect your humidity in your enclosure the correct way. In my tanks, I have slightly larger water bowls that are placed on the hot side to help boost my humidity up(I am currently using a gladware type bowl...so far have not had my girl tip it over, but I also surround it with substrate to help with that also). In a tub, which holds humidity in much better than a tank, you probably won't need so much surface area and would be fine with a small bowl (like a small animal ceramic food bowl).

Question 7:
I remember the thread that you are talking about, but cannot find it either. Sorry!!

Hope that some of this helps you!! And I am sure that others will see your thread and answer the questions for you that I cannot answer!

Quote:

---

Question #7: Not related to the other questions ... in my searching, I saw a post showing a BP in its hide and then with the hide off, so you could see how tight they like their hides to be. But now I can't find that thread. Can anyone point me in the right direction?

---

Would these be the pictures? This is Pretzel when she was a baby in her 15 quart tub:

http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e9...ub/BabyTub.jpg

http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e9...b/BabyTub2.jpg

http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e9...b/PretzelA.jpg

And just because I love her so much, this is Pretzel now!
http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e9...PretJune17.jpg

http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e9...PretJune19.jpg

I remember a thread which had a large snake around 800g and it showed the size of the hide. He also picked up the hide while the snake was in it and he was all coiled up. He showed the size of the hide using a dollar bill. I couldn't find the thread either.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Chaosangel

Question #7: Not related to the other questions ... in my searching, I saw a post showing a BP in its hide and then with the hide off, so you could see how tight they like their hides to be. But now I can't find that thread. Can anyone point me in the right direction?

I hope I provided enough information. Thanks in advance for your replies!!
Peggy :)

---

Quote:

---

I remember a thread which had a large snake around 800g and it showed the size of the hide. He also picked up the hide while the snake was in it and he was all coiled up. He showed the size of the hide using a dollar bill. I couldn't find the thread either.

---

Here is my post on the hide sizes
http://www.ball-pythons.net/forums/s...ad.php?t=45693

Thats the thread I was thinking of. Thanks Freakie.

FROM ORIGINAL POSTER

Re: Question #7 ... Freakie Frog, those were the pix I was looking for. While Rabernet's are good, that other one is just - Wow!

Re: Questions #3, 4, & 5 ... I get the impression from reading online that tank's and tubs, while similar, work out somewhat differently as far as thermostat and thermometer probe placement and size are concerned. Is this correct? (Previously have been using UTH with a ceramic bulb heater - entire enclosure is not staying warm enough easily and the heater dries out the humidity. :p)

Re: Question #6 ... I'm not sure, but I don't think Aspen is a sturdy enough substrate to keep a lighter weight dish in place. And in that little tub, there's not tons of room for two hides AND a wide water dish. I chose that size tub because my BP is 380 oz. (stll young) ... but she's been over a year in a HUGE enclosure ... maybe I need a larger tub?

Thanks!

Peggy :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Chaosangel

FROM ORIGINAL POSTER

I chose that size tub because my BP is 380 oz. (stll young) ... but she's been over a year in a HUGE enclosure ... maybe I need a larger tub?

---

Holy cow! 380 oz is like 20+ pounds! That's a huge snake! ;)

JonV

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nevohraalnavnoj

Holy cow! 380 oz is like 20+ pounds! That's a huge snake! ;)

JonV

---

lol grams I think they meant grams. LOL

If your afraid of tape (like I am) than you can hot glue the thermometer probe to the bottom of the tub or the inside of the hide. Just give it a twist when you want to clean the tub and they usually come off with little effort. The hot glue is completely safe and will not even come close to melting if your temps are in the normal ranges.

Get an inexpensive tip-proof dog dish--cut a hole in the side, and voila--you have a water bowl that doubles as a hide. :D
I used a soldering iron to burn a u-shaped entry that has no rough edges in a few of them for my snakes. The trick is finding one with plenty of space underneath the water receptacle. You can get them in a huge variety of sizes. I use a box for a hide on the hot side, and the water bowl for a hide on the cool side.

FROM ORIGINAL POSTER

<< lol grams I think they meant grams. LOL>>

Ooops! Yeah, that's what happens when I'm trying to reply quickly before I dash out the door ... last weight was 381 grams. :)

<<Get an inexpensive tip-proof dog dish--cut a hole in the side, and voila--you have a water bowl that doubles as a hide.>>

Okay, I hate to be pathetic, but I'm having a hard time visualizing that. By any chance can you direct me to a pic? (Yes, I know, the dreaded, "do you have a pic" question. <lol>)

Also, I'm thinking that maybe I should have titled this thread differently ... I'm not looking for questions, I'm looking for answers. Is it possible to edit a thread name? (If a moderator has to do it and is reading this, maybe it could be changed to "Switching to Tub, Need Clarification on a Few Points" or something.)

Thanks all!

Peggy :)

For the dog dish idea, I am picturing one of those that has some hollow space inside. Then when you cut through one edge it will still retain water, but now the snake has access to the hollow space to hide.

Evaporation is a cooling process though, so I imagine temps would be pretty cold in there.

JonV

Changed the title for you.

He means a bowl like this, only in plastic, where you can solder an entrance to the hollow portion with a solder wand.

http://www.petsalley.com/stainlesswoof.asp

<<Changed the title for you.>>

Thanks! Doesn't seem to have helped on the unanswered questions though. I especially need questions #2 and #3 answered ... I haven't ordered any flexwatt tape yet because despite a number of posts on the subject, I only know generally what I need, not exactly. Do you think I should post those questions separately?

<< He means a bowl like this, only in plastic, where you can solder an entrance to the hollow portion with a solder wand. >>

Hey, that's pretty cool! I may have to do that! :)

Thanks!

Peggy :)

I have heard alot of good things on this forum about Rich at Reptile Basics, and I think that most would say that if you contact him directly and explain to him the type of setup that you are working on fixing up, then he could tell you exactly what you will need and what size. You won't need flexwatt all along the sides of the tub, just underneath, but if your temps have been getting way too cold, then you may need one peice for the hot side and another smaller/thinner peice for the cool side. And both would have to be run through a thermostat, although I think that you could run them off the same thermostat and wouldn't need a separate one for each.

As far as the ventilation holes, I think the number that you would need for your tub would have to be figured out by trial and error. It depends upon your temp and humidity in your house and that will affect the temp and humidity in your tub. So I would start with a smaller number of holes (and these I would put on different sides of the tub, not just all in one spot) let your temps/humidity level out for awhile and if needed, add some more holes. As far as the size of the holes, I am not sure what size a basic soldering iron is from walmart/hardware stores, but I did read that someone used a heated up screwdriver to make their holes in their tub. So I am guessing that the size of the holes should be about the width of a basic screwdriver.

I hope that maybe this was a little bit of help to you. I would definately try to contact Rich about the flexwatt though. He has helped others on here get what they needed, I am sure that he would do the same for you.

Hi,

I know what you mean about wanting specifics! I regret that I am also wanting to make the tub switch (so I can't be of much help!) but still in the research phase. I will do my best with #4 and #5, though. :)

I used medical tape to attach my probes to the inside edge of both hides (I have two acu-rites that are temps only and a Fluker's thermo/hygrometer combo in the middle for humidity). He is constantly rearranging things and it's never been a problem to get off. :) Really, I don't even reattach the probes anymore- they're just fine being tucked under the hides.

I would definitely put the thermostat probe on the outside of the enclosure- I think most people have it between the UTH and the bottom, but with a tub I'm not sure... most ppl have racks when they go to tubs. I like the idea that the BP can't move the t-stat probe around and accidentally hurt him/herself, though.

Hope this helped a bit. :)

Bowls similar to these (which amusingly already have holes for snake entry built into them): http://www.dkimages.com/discover/pre...2/45076299.JPG

The best ones have ample space underneath for the snake, of course--those are also usually the cheaper bowls. You can get some very large plastic dog bowls, with enough space under them for even a 2-year-old bp. I doubt they make any quite large enough for an adult. The winning point is that a bowl large enough to serve as a hide is also large enough for a snake to soak if it wants to. (My pastel apparently likes to take a dip before he defecates). When I refill the bowls, I use warm water, which they appear to love. Since the water in the bowl is warmed to the same general temperature as the rest of the enclosure, it's not too cold under the bowl--at least, my snakes thermoregulate by moving from the box hide over the heat pad to the cooler area under the bowl and back again once or twice a day. You can also place the water bowl over the heat source, if humidity is an issue--that will warm the water in the bowl, and raise the humidity in the cage, as well as providing a warm hide and warm soaking/drinking water.

The holes made by a soldering iron are about 4 mm across. That's if you punch all the way through. If you just touch the iron to the bin briefly, you can make a smaller hole--preferable if you're housing really tiny snakes or lizard hatchlings.

<< I have heard alot of good things on this forum about Rich at Reptile Basics, and I think that most would say that if you contact him directly and explain to him the type of setup that you are working on fixing up, then he could tell you exactly what you will need and what size.>>

Now that sounds like an excellent idea! I didn't realize he could help that way! Thanks!

<<You won't need flexwatt all along the sides of the tub, just underneath, but if your temps have been getting way too cold, then you may need one peice for the hot side and another smaller/thinner peice for the cool side.>>

Well, winter is coming on and we tend to keep our house around 68˚ or so. I was thinking flexwatt on the warm side or perhaps across the back might help maintain. I know BPs are burrowing snakes, so maybe I'm just overly worried.

<<you may need one peice for the hot side and another smaller/thinner peice for the cool side. And both would have to be run through a thermostat, although I think that you could run them off the same thermostat and wouldn't need a separate one for each.>>

I was looking for thermostats that had two probes coming out, but didn't find one (though that doesn't mean they don't exist!). So, with one thermostat, how do you regulate two different temps?

<<So I would start with a smaller number of holes ... let your temps/humidity level out for awhile and if needed, add some more holes.>>

That was my plan, only I don't know how many holes is a "smaller" number. 2? 4? 10? How few holes can you have in a tub and still have adequate ventilation?

<<(and these I would put on different sides of the tub, not just all in one spot)>>

So put the ventilation holes in the sides ... higher up, I'd assume. Across from each other? Or a side-side and a back-side? Or more than two sides? (Sorry for all the questions on this, but once the thing has holes in it, you can't move them around like you can substrates and hides!)

<<I would definitely put the thermostat probe on the outside of the enclosure- I think most people have it between the UTH and the bottom, but with a tub I'm not sure... I like the idea that the BP can't move the t-stat probe around and accidentally hurt him/herself, though.>>

Okay ... so here's a question. From doing research, I sort of got the idea that folks here considered Flexwatt and UTH units as different animals (though perhaps of the same breed). Am I wrong? Instead of just looking at Flexwatt posts, should I be reading the UTH posts, too?

<<most ppl have racks when they go to tubs.>>

Yeah, I noticed ... it's really hard to find posts detailing the set up of a single BP tub!

<< Bowls similar to these (which amusingly already have holes for snake entry built into them): http://www.dkimages.com/discover/pr...72/45076299.JPG
The best ones have ample space underneath for the snake, of course--those are also usually the cheaper bowls.>>

Hey, what store sells those dog bowls with the snake holes already installed? <g>

As for finding ample space, I have experience figuring out how much space for a snake to curl into a ball inside ... but how to you figure out how big when they have a section to wrap around? Or is there room under the bowl for a snake to curl up?

Thanks!

Peggy :)

Here's a few pictures of some of our single tubs. We do live in an area that gets fairly high humidity so we do use a lot of holes so our tubs don't sweat. Also the snakes that live in these tubs all are in our ball python room which never drops between 78-80 degrees so they don't need anything more than undertub heating on the warm side to bump it up that 10 or 11 degrees more. We put holes in the lids and sides of all the bigger tubs, in the lids only of the baby tubs.

Do note with most any tub/lid combo you have to add extra security (we use clamps and big black binder clips). Any lid that can give 1/8" or more will allow a snake to escape. I don't use those water dishes for hides so I can't help there. We use plastic bowls in various sizes from the dollar store and big rubber dog dishes from the farm supply store as hides.

Baby tub.....
http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e2...ordanFeb07.jpg

Very young BP tucked up happily in her hide (smaller than a cereal bowl size)...
http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e2...chlingHide.jpg

Same tub with it's 4 clips in place....
http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e2...yTubclosed.jpg

Sub-Adult Female BP in her bigger tub (to show her coiled up compared to her hide circumference).....
http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e2...teTubAug07.jpg

Bigger female in the same sized tub.....
http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e2...nnaghinTub.jpg

Shhhh...I'm sleeping in here....
http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e2...irseinHide.jpg

The Herpstat II is a thermostat that has 2 probes and will control a seperate heating device for each of them. (Alternatively, one outlet can control lighting or cooling instead). You can get them from Spyder Robotics.

As for the dog dishes, it's best just to go to PetCo and take a look at them, so you can evaluate how much space they have underneath and pick out the most suitable ones. My snakes tend to accordian up on the far side of the dish from the entrance.

<<Here's a few pictures of some of our single tubs.>>

I notice the baby pic does not have two hides. That is the size tub I bought, but I am pretty sure I'm not going to be able to fit two hides and a water bowl in it ... or even two hides, with one being a water bowl. How did I reach that conclusion? Well...

I took my snake with me shopping today ... went to two pet stores and some places like Target and Shop Ko, looking at dog dishes. The ones that she fit were too wide for the 16 quart Iris. I did pick one up and put it in her current set-up for her to check out. She seems to like it - at least she went in it and stayed there, unlike the flower pot bottom hides we tried. (She likes the half-log (in there for roughness for shedding) better than the flower pot bottoms.) And, for those of you wanting pix, I took some. But I can't figure out how to import them into my message! (When I click the "Insert Image" icon, it asks, "Please enter the URL of your image:" ... unhelpful when it's on my hard drive and there is now "browse" option!)

So ... is a 30 quart tub too large for a 380 gram snake? She's not really a baby anymore, she's about 1 3/4 years old. (Note, we had a power outtage last month - temps dropped to the 70s in her enclosure and she ended up with RI. She dropped about 40 grams while she was sick. :() I was looking at this tub:
http://www.allorganized.com/istar.asp?a=6&id=762016364476!IRIS

<<The Herpstat II is a thermostat that has 2 probes and will control a seperate heating device for each of them.>>

Is the Herpstat II an on/off or a proportional?

BTW, thanks for all the help from everyone who has posted!!

Peggy :)

The baby tubs do only get the one hide due to space issues but since the babies all live quietly in a corner of our master bedroom until they grow big enough to move into a rack in the ball python room, there's little to no traffic near them. Since it's so quiet and private they seem quite comfortable moving around the cool side.

One of the 07's is tricky enough that she simply moves her hide with her all over the tub and believe it or not, she somehow manages to place her hide over top of her water dish. I really need to get a pic of her perched around the edge of her water dish (not in it) with the hide over top of her and her dish. Quite the smart snake, she's got a lovely hide spot and a handy drink all in one LOL. How she manages this without opposable thumbs...I'll never figure out! Darra's a smart little snake it seems. :)

How is an almost 2 year old Ball only 380g? My two year old is 1500g and will breed this year.

You can easily fit 2 hides and a water bowl in a 15qt tub. Or you can get a small water bowl(like the stainless steel, blue-rubber bottomed, 3" diameter ones from WalMart) and a 6" pot saucer. A 400g Ball should easily fit in a 6" pot saucer for quite awhile. For all of my juvies/sub-adults that are in 15qt tubs, they get one 6-8" pot saucer and a water bowl. They all do just fine.

And I'm not griping, but please don't take your snake shopping with you. That's just an accident and possibly illness waiting to happen.

When I needed to get my flexwatt, I asked the dude at reptile basics, just like someone suggested. He was a HUGE help. We decided I would get 1 piece of 12" flexwatt which covers exactly half of the tub's bottom.

Here are some pics of mine, since mine is a little different from most that I see. I'm of the philosophy that even though she's in a tub, which sits on the floor and no one looks at but me, that it doesn't have to be boring. :rockon:

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c1...padalae021.jpg
http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c1...s/FILES002.jpg

The temps in that pic were wrong because it was when I'd first gotten the therm. set up and it was adjusting.

I have several sets of hides - one set is two boston market gravy cups with holes in them (her fave) the other set is clay pot bottoms with holes chipped (then filed down), and the last set is two black plastic containers of some sort. I change them out when I feel like it, and rearrange things occasionally. Sometimes I'll organize her branches so that she has something to hang from, which she enjoys. Actually, she's hanging off the side of the computer chair right now. Hooks her little tail into a hole in the mesh and lets her pudgy belly hang off. She's been like that for a while now. -lol- My little computer buddy.

Oh, and the holes are about 3 inches apart, one row of them going all around the top edge of the tub. There are also a total of 9 holes in the lid, three rows of three. But I'm in Florida. It's already hot and humid so I don't have to do much. -lol-

You can see her water bowl is just a custard dish thing from Walmart. They come in sets of two for like 6 bucks so I switch them out every few days and wash them with the people dishes.

Herpstats are one of the better thermostats out there--not quite as pricey as Helix, but reliable and with all the bells and whistles.
The Herpstat II is a proportional thermostat, but if you want you can set it to analog as an option. You can program it for automatic night time temperature drop, and it will set off an alarm if the temperature varies by an amount you select. Pretty nice device. It's got a built-in clock, so you don't have to attach it to a timer to use the night drop feature. I got mine to deal with the 2 racks I ordered from Animal Plastics. Buying one Herpstat II was less expensive than buying 2 regular Herpstats, and I like all the added features.

<<The baby tubs do only get the one hide due to space issues>>

It certainly makes more sense ... the flat floor space on the small tub is only 13.5" x 8.5"!

<<A 400g Ball should easily fit in a 6" pot saucer for quite awhile. For all of my juvies/sub-adults that are in 15qt tubs, they get one 6-8" pot saucer and a water bowl.>>

Yes, this is where I was running into trouble ... trying to figure out how to fit TWO hides and a water bowl all into one small tub! But in fact, two 6" bowls/hides takes up most of the floor space ... perhaps you have more floor space because you've found a 15 quart tub that is long and wide, but not very tall? (Because I have been to 7 or 8 stores now in search of such a beast and not had any luck.) Or do your hides and bowls take up all the floor space?

<<How is an almost 2 year old Ball only 380g? My two year old is 1500g and will breed this year. >>

Well, to be honest, I don't know the exact date my girl was born. The breeder I bought her from said "around Christmas," but she was rather small then ... I suspected at the time that perhaps he was confusing her batch with another. Regardless, except for the aforementioned problem with the heat plumeting and resulting illness, she eats weekly, except when she is shedding. On the other hand, I am not using a digital scale to weigh her ... it's an old-fashioned scale that measures ounces and then I convert it. So it is possible that I've given you all the wrong weight.

<<And I'm not griping, but please don't take your snake shopping with you. That's just an accident and possibly illness waiting to happen.>>

Be that as it may, shopping with the small tub and the snake made me realize that any two hides she would fit in would take up the majority of the floor space - if they didn't just plain not fit. Thus my return wondering about using a larger tub with more floor space. (And to make everyone breath easier, taking my snake shopping is not anything I have done before, nor do I plan to do it in the future.)

<< Here are some pics of mine, since mine is a little different from most that I see.>>

Mindibun, it looks to me like you have a larger tub with a snake that (I think) is smaller than my girl. That is more like what I was asking about ... perhaps it is okay that it is larger because she has plenty of "plants" to hide among, as well as the hides.

<<When I needed to get my flexwatt, I asked the dude at reptile basics, just like someone suggested. He was a HUGE help. We decided I would get 1 piece of 12" flexwatt which covers exactly half of the tub's bottom.>>

I am leaning towards cover both sides and regulating both ... I suspect it is MUCH colder here in the Rocky Mountains than in Florida. (And it doesn't help that my husband goes crazy if the temps get over 74˚ ... and who prefers them around 70˚!) But I'll be talking to Rich at Reptile Basics ... he sounds like the man I need to speak with when it comes to Flexwatt and setting up the tub! :)

<<The Herpstat II i...You can program it for automatic night time temperature drop,>>

Not something you need for a BP though. Are there any BP-related uses you can use that for (other than breeding-related)?

<<Herpstats are one of the better thermostats out there--not quite as pricey as Helix, but reliable and with all the bells and whistles.>>

As near as I can tell, none of the Helix thermostats can regulate two different temperatures/flexwatt pieces. Anyone know if that is correct? <sigh> It would be handy if Reptile Basics carrid the Herpstat II or a Helix thermostat that could measure two pieces. :p

Thanks everyone!

Peggy :)

P.S. I still don't know how to post pix...

Not that I know of, night drop for BPs is just for breeding (which is what I'm going to be doing in a month).
The Herpstats are here: http://spyderrobotics.com/index.html

They even have a quad unit (Herpstat Pro), it can control 4 seperate heating/cooling devices with a seperate probe for each of them.

They are pricey, but once you start looking at proportional thermostats, you'll see that they're among the most reasonable. I have used an analog thermostat before, but I really don't like them...I think it's much better for the animals to have a steady temperature rather than one that goes up and down constantly.

Well, I ordered a Herpstat II from Spyder Robotics ... I figured it was better to control both sides, so I spent the money now, rather than buying one thermostat and eventually getting another one.

Now if I could just get ahold of Rich at Reptile Basics ...


Peggy :)

You dont have to keep your snake in a wee little tub if you dont want to... I start my babies off in a 66qt tubs and theyre doing just fine...they have 2 hides, big water bowl, and something to climb on... all 3 eat every week like pigs and are as happy as can be. More importantly worry about your temps and humidity... as long as those are on and you got some nice snug hides you should be fine... I picked up the herp pro about a month ago and its pretty sweet, youll like it. I got some pics of my baby set ups if you wanna check em out.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JoshJP7

You dont have to keep your snake in a wee little tub if you dont want to... I start my babies off in a 66qt tubs and theyre doing just fine...they have 2 hides, big water bowl, and something to climb on... all 3 eat every week like pigs and are as happy as can be. More importantly worry about your temps and humidity... as long as those are on and you got some nice snug hides you should be fine... I picked up the herp pro about a month ago and its pretty sweet, youll like it. I got some pics of my baby set ups if you wanna check em out.

---

Are you serious. Even adult ball pythons can't live in a 66 qt tub, maybe a 40 qt tub for an adult. 15 qt is for babies. not 66qt! You could ask anyone here! 66qt tub is not good at all! WAY TOO BIG!

Thanks for your opinion but I wasnt the one asking for advice... I have experience with balls and I know what they need. What are you gonna say when I tell you that I house my 4 1yr olds in 4ftx2ftx1.5 cages? Tell me its "way too big?"... Please enlighten me... why is it "way too big?"

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JoshJP7

Thanks for your opinion but I wasnt the one asking for advice... I have experience with balls and I know what they need. What are you gonna say when I tell you that I house my 4 1yr olds in 4ftx2ftx1.5 cages? Tell me its "way too big?"... Please enlighten me... why is it "way too big?"

---

Any one one this site would tell you a 66qt tub for a yearling is too big

Mitch, you'll find with further experience that yes most ball python owners do go with the smaller is better concept of housing. Some, like Josh, prefer a different method and are firm in that belief.

I'd ask you both to not de-rail this thread with it's specific housing questions with a long arguement about tub sizes. Both of you have expressed yourselves well but a full discussion specific only to tub sizes would perhaps be better suited to a seperate thread (though I think you'll both find numerous threads already that have covered this issue fully).

Your fright Franky sorry for the thred highjack... I understand that theres several methods to keeping a snake and no one answer is the "right" answer I just have a hard time when others do not see both sides of the fence...

Back to the original post that is already in progress :)

Yeah, my roomate has his pet hatchling in a 66 qt bin (it might even be bigger). Snake has a water bowl hide, a second hide, and climbing branch. He uses all of them, and we got him converted to f/t within a month, and he feeds like a trooper. Gaining weight, shedding well, etc.
I would say, if you're having problems with a hatchling feeding, a smaller bin sometimes helps them to feel more secure, but for a problem-free hatchling, a larger cage just means more room to exercise when they move around at night.
This is the snake's permanent cage, he simply got one of a size appropriate to house a large adult ball python.
Anyhow, this is not a continuation of hijacking, but agreement with the suggestion that a larger bin can be used to give more room for adequate hides and such.

On tub size, I am going with the 30 QT Iris tub. It looks to be about the same size as Mindibun's tub and I'm pretty sure my girl is larger than the one in the pic. I can provide hides galore ... and it will still be half the size of what she has been staying in. I'm sure now that she's eating again that she will catch back up to her former weight and beyond, so she should be a 500 gram snake in a few months. Hopefully, it is a good choice!

As for the flexwatt, I ended up going with two Ultratherm Undertank Heaters, one 6"x11" and one 11"x11". I talked with Rich about how high and low the temps were likely to get in my house and that I had a thermostat to control a warm and cool side piece of flexwatt. He said if the nighttime, winter temps could get in the upper 60s, that with just a single tub, I might end up having problems with the flexwatt. So ... hopefully it is a good choice. I was a little worried about not covering more of the floor space (22" x 18"), but he said it was important not to cover it all, just in case something goes wrong and the heat sources get way too hot.

Anybody have any opinions either way?

Thanks!

Peggy :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Chaosangel

On tub size, I am going with the 30 QT Iris tub. It looks to be about the same size as Mindibun's tub and I'm pretty sure my girl is larger than the one in the pic. I can provide hides galore ... and it will still be half the size of what she has been staying in. I'm sure now that she's eating again that she will catch back up to her former weight and beyond, so she should be a 500 gram snake in a few months. Hopefully, it is a good choice!

As for the flexwatt, I ended up going with two Ultratherm Undertank Heaters, one 6"x11" and one 11"x11". I talked with Rich about how high and low the temps were likely to get in my house and that I had a thermostat to control a warm and cool side piece of flexwatt. He said if the nighttime, winter temps could get in the upper 60s, that with just a single tub, I might end up having problems with the flexwatt. So ... hopefully it is a good choice. I was a little worried about not covering more of the floor space (22" x 18"), but he said it was important not to cover it all, just in case something goes wrong and the heat sources get way too hot.

Anybody have any opinions either way?

Thanks!

Peggy :)

---

Man rich is always helping folks out. Rich is the shiznit.