Craigslist

Hi,

I'm looking at a couple snakes for adoption on Craigslist, but I want to approach the situation with caution because I've had plenty of deals go bad on CL. The last thing I want is to get a shady seller and involve a live animal in it all.

What sort of questions should I ask? I've got some standard stuff covered, such as CB/CH, care history, health history, and so on, but I really don't want to miss anything. I have a BP who is healthy and thriving, but I'm still starting out in keeping herps.

Who here as gone through the process and what words of advice do you have?

Thanks,
Sophia

your not allowed to sell animals on craigslist, so any ball python found on there is gonna be a rescue. alot of time its someone going to college and can't bring his snake. or maybe just moving somewhere and can't take it. alot of times they just don't want to take care of it anymore. in that case it has probably been mistreated and in some bad husbandry for awhile. unless the person took down records it's unlikely you will have a good history of the snake.

i have also noticed that you rarely find just a snake for sale. most of the time people want to sell the whole set up they have going. most of the time the stuff they have isn't worth jack to a snake, so it really just ups the price of the snake, since you can't "sell" the animal they sell the stuff to it make up.

one last piece of advise from me... buy from a reputable breeder, not from craigslist. with a breeder you get a healthy snake from someone that cared about the animal.

I've "adopted" a total of 4 snakes from Craigslist so far. My pastel male and a very pretty juvenile reduced pattern female from a breeder who was getting out of the biz, an adult female from a family who didn't have time for her any more, and an adult male who was a true rescue in that he escaped his cage and was harassed by the family's cats. All 4 of them were healthy and eating when I got them, and all 4 are healthy today. It's not ALL bad on CL, but you do have to be picky.

The male that I rescued was being let go by the family because he was nervous/agitated and would strike at anything near him that had body heat. I got him home and was able to handle him no problem, he never hissed or struck at me once. 6 weeks later, after making sure he fed properly and didn't have any lingering "attitude" issues, I adopted him out to a forever home, where he has been happy and healthy ever since. I paid $40 for him to get him out of that house, and let him go to his new home for free.

I would say be cautious and don't pay an "adoption" fee that seems unreasonable or for equipment you don't need or want. Be prepared for vet costs if this snake is not healthy and also fully quarantine it from your other snake...that means a seperate room, seperate husbandry tools, sanitizing between them, etc.

Personally I sell My baby normals on craigslist. As long as it is listed as a rehoming fee there is no problem. I have met some really nice people off of there.

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Originally Posted by melinda.s

Personally I sell My baby normals on craigslist. As long as it is listed as a rehoming fee there is no problem. I have met some really nice people off of there.

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Ummm that would be called lying. Craigslist is not set up for breeders to sell on, there are other venues for that. Bending the rules doesn't make it right.

People who sell their animals via a ridicoulus rehoming fee annoy me greatly.

my normal was a freebie on Craigslist. The guy I got hiom from is a morph breeder and when this male normal hatched he kept it for a bit and then posted it up to give away. I know you arent "supposed" to sell on craigslist but I mean come on now if you get a pet off there and pay for it you aren't "adopting" it youre buying it. Now if said breeder is selling her normals at below normal breeding rates or pet store rates than thats fine IMO.

There's a big difference between using CL to rehome animals who -need- homes, and to sell product. If you have to resort to CL to sell your stock, there is something wrong. I monitor the pets section here locally, and flag anything that's obviously a breeder.

As far as buying from there, you have to be pretty cautious. Last night I e-mailed a guy who put an ad up there, and he's wanting $70 each for an '06 normal female and an '06 male he was told was "het for pastel". I don't think I"ll be jumping on that....

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Originally Posted by FreQ

I know you arent "supposed" to sell on craigslist but I mean come on now if you get a pet off there and pay for it you aren't "adopting" it youre buying it. Now if said breeder is selling her normals at below normal breeding rates or pet store rates than thats fine IMO.

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Agreed.
Exchanging cash for an item is a sale.
Call it an "adoption" to make it sound flowery since we're involving a living animal and nobody wants to sound insensitive, but it is still technically a sale.

The lines are so incredibly blurry it's like watching a glowstick spin around in circles. Who is to decide what's a sale and what's an "adoption"?
Yes, $500 for that "puggle" is a high number, but I guarantee someone will "adopt" it for $500. So ... if someone advertised it as an adoption and someone else exchanged money for the animal knowing they were adopting it .... doesn't that make the transaction an adoption???

I get frustrated with the word "adoption" in general. If you aren't a rescue agency, you're selling me the animal because you don't want it anymore, for whatever reason - just like a rug, a microwave, a tea kettle - whatever.
Call it a re-homing fee and I'm happy :)
Sorry for the rambling - my thought were all over the place on that one :rolleyes:

Yep they are selling and don't want to spend the money or time to post a proper ad somewhere so they misuse CL. If you are breeding with the intent to sell the offspring, you are NOT an adopter/rescuer and you are NOT charging a "rehoming fee", you are selling an animal, plain and simple. If you want to be considered an honest breeder/seller, don't you think you need to start at least with these basics? :)

First of all I am a honest person, And a small rehoming fee is not being dishonest, a person can go to a local pet store spend 90 dollars on a normal get no help and no nothing about where the snake came from. I sell them for 45 and they get all the info and help afterwards. I like to make sure that my babies are going somewhere that they are being taken care of. I meet people in my area and no one has had a problem with the 45 fee. Call it what you want, but the advertising is free and I choose to sell it or not. I so far have not had to ship any snakes ans I have stayed in touch with all the people.

I advertise rescues on CL. I take in strays, vaccinate, speuter, treat any illnesses, rid them of parasites, and post them on CL (and a bunch of other places). I tend to ask $50-$80 for an adoption fee, depending on how much I've put into them. The amount is always less than what it's cost me in medical bills, yet I've still been accused of "selling for profit" there.

Selling animals you have intentionally produced is selling. That is not the intent of CL, and if I see those ads, I flag them down. It's a BS excuse to get free advertising, cut corners, and abuse the system.

I have to agree with melinda on this one -
Why advertise your normal males on kingsnake or sell to a local pet store, when you can use local classifieds as an opportunity to reach out to the local community and educate them?
I have rehomed a few snakes on CL - and every time I have done so, I steered someone away from buying from a petstore, which is an important goal of mine. With each rehoming, I have taught the new owner about proper care, the difference between CB and imported pet store junk, and have been reassured that the new owner is absolutely ready for the responibility rather than some impulse buy at a petshop. I always give my number and email, so that whenever there is a question or a problem, they can ALWAYS call me.
I think my intensions are extremely positive, and Im sorry If I happen to breed my snakes as well. I dont NEED to sell on CL, but I do feel an obligation as an ENTHUSIAST to make people aware of the truth and what their options are.
It's all in the passion of the animal for me.
Im sure for others, it's not.
The rehoming fee for the few of them has been $30 - I will NOT give them away to some dimwit who wants a trophy. There WILL be a price, because snakes do come with a hidden price and it is one way of filtering out those dimwits.
just my opinion - :D

I appreciate that you provide info to your customers, but it still explicitly says on CL "No animal sales or breeding". So you are in direct violation of their terms.

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Originally Posted by sophia

Hi,

I'm looking at a couple snakes for adoption on Craigslist, but I want to approach the situation with caution because I've had plenty of deals go bad on CL. The last thing I want is to get a shady seller and involve a live animal in it all.

What sort of questions should I ask? I've got some standard stuff covered, such as CB/CH, care history, health history, and so on, but I really don't want to miss anything. I have a BP who is healthy and thriving, but I'm still starting out in keeping herps.

Who here as gone through the process and what words of advice do you have?

Thanks,
Sophia

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Ask if you can see the animals first, that way you can try to do a visual examination of any possible health problems like belly rot or mites first.

Ask what they have been fed in the past and what their feeding routine is, do they always eat etc.

Ask to see what type of enclosure they have been kept in, the heating methods etc.

Don't worry about asking too many questions - if the seller gets snippy at you because you're 'poking around' too much then they aren't worth buying from... I decided not to buy from two seperate sources because of precisely this and a questionable reputation of the one even though the asking price was by far the cheapest. If they don't want to answer questions about the animals health, and are annoyed that you are concerned with this, I typically believe that it says something about the care the animal has received and the overall concern for their health.

And as already stated, make sure to quarentine them after you've brought them home.

OUt of curiousity, do you speed, even ever so slightly? Ever gove through a yellow light?

90% of americans disobey the speed limits and traffic laws , and because of selfish reasons, too. We want to go where we want to go as fast as we want to do it.

Now when I breed a pastel to a normal, my intensions are to hatch out some pastels and females, not so much normal males. Those normal males are not meant for the breeding world, nor the breeding market. They are meant for quality homes. They are in my home, and I would like to rehome them to a qualified family. I simply can not refuse these little educational gems to my local public because craigslist wrote a rule against breeding- they are trying to stop people with bad intentions, and I am not one of those people. I am not selling puggles for market price. I rehoming ball pythons, below market price, with a world of knowledge attached to them. :D

I have steered away from the topic. My bad.

That pot-kettle argument is a diversion, nothing more.

Pay to take out a classifed in your newspaper. That's what it's for. Don't knowingly violate the CL rules, and then defend it because you're better than those other bad breeders. You are a breeder, period.

The point is though that you willingly decided to breed, knowing you were going to have normal males to deal with. That's just a part of breeding, we can't control the odds or the ratios. So knowing this, why not have a plan in place that doesn't include breaking rules on a website? What's the difference between doing that at CL and doing that here at BPNet? There's rules here too about advertising and so forth. Should the breeders here be trying to get around those rules anymore than at any other site?

Yup, what she said.
It's not "Oh, I have these worthless males, I need to get rid of them as cheaply as possible". The act of bringing a life into the world is a great responsibility.

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Originally Posted by slartibartfast

Yup, what she said.
It's not "Oh, I have these worthless males, I need to get rid of them as cheaply as possible". The act of bringing a life into the world is a great responsibility.

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I dont mean to be rude, but did you just read anything I said? I respect your opinion about the rules and whatnot - good debate. I guess the rebel in me doesnt mind "breaking a rule" to do something good.
But i did just clearly state that these are not worthless to me - they are educational GEMS to me. I take great pride in making a difference in my community with these "worthless animals". I take a LOT of time to teach as many people as I can with these animals.
I am really hurt about what you just said!

I'm sorry if you are hurt by that, but why do you feel the need to break the CL rules, when you could quite legally advertise them in the "Pets for Sale" section of the newspaper?

I guess this is one of those topics that we can all agree to disagree on. I hope everyone has a good holiday weekend.
:D

This debate is beginning to blend breaking the rules with my intentions and feelings for these animals, and it should not.
Like I said, if you want to debate posting "illegally" in craigslist, fine. But please, do NOT make it into a debate that I don't care about my animals because I am breaking a websites rules!!It is truly such the opposite!

I go onto craigslist because the site offers a much better quality space then a newspaper ad - I can add pictures, and more importantly, a LOT more information. I am from the internet age, and when I think of a newspaper, I think of 3 line advertisement. My rehoming is worth more than 3 lines- and if I had to pay, I would. It has nothing to do with money, not even a little bit. We also arent talking 100's of snakes here, either. I have "sold" more snakes to friends than I have on craigslist, and have responded to more "wanted" adds on cragislist than I have posted on the site. I have also taken in sick snakes, rehabilitated them, and then rehomed them on craigslist.

Um... Not to sound momish... But fighting about craigslist practices wasn't really the question asked, and the question asked hasn't really been answered...

So how about we start up another thread all about craigslist practices, and then have this one left for questions that Sophie should ask the adopter about the two snakes she wants to bring home.

:)

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Originally Posted by GirDance

Um... Not to sound momish... But fighting about craigslist practices wasn't really the question asked, and the question asked hasn't really been answered...

So how about we start up another thread all about craigslist practices, and then have this one left for questions that Sophie should ask the adopter about the two snakes she wants to bring home.

:)

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totally agreed.

Good point and we have gone way off topic haven't we. Ginger, I hope you realize I'm not questioning your devotion to your snakes or your valuing one particular snake over another here dear. I'm just a real stickler for rules sometimes, perhaps more than need be sometimes. :)

When getting any animal , I always want to see where they are coming from, how they are set up. Hold them listen to them, to make sure they are not wheezing, look at the eyes and it's general disposition. If all looks good then go for it. If anything feels or looks questionable then I would shy away from it. But then again I am the type that will still take them just to see them set up properly and taken care of the right way. That is just me thou.

Thanks for the on-topic replies, although the off-topic ones are interesting too!

The snake is a 1-year-old albino Kenyan Sand Boa whose owner is getting rid of him because he doesn't have access to live pinkies and the snake will not eat F/T. I'm trying to get information on how the snake is cared for currently, etc, before going up to see it. No one in my area currently has adult or sub-adult KSBs for sale, which is why I'm considering going for it after saying I wouldn't go through CL.

Here's a picture of the little guy. The owner wants $75. I haven't approached that subject with him yet... He also doesn't know what the purple marking is towards the animal's tail. Hm...

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1418/...572ec11d70.jpg

Awww, he's cute! I can see why you want him.

You'll be okay with getting a regular supply of his preferred food? That is an interesting mark. I wonder if it's some sort of patterning or an old injury that scarred oddly. I've no experience with this sort of snake so I'm not at all qualified to say but it surely is a funny mark isn't it. I can see why you'd want the snake though, it's very pretty.

If he was BP, he'd look like a ringer. Do KSBs come in ringers?

I'm less familiar with KSB morphs. It doesn't seem like there are nearly as many KSB morphs as there are BPs. I've never heard of a KSB ringer. Most of the albinos seem to have that same type of pattern.

I'm glad you guys think he's cute, too, because I love him!

My stubborn BP will only eat live, so picking up two meals instead of one won't be a problem. I've tried F/T with her before, starting from when she was hatched in '95, but she won't even take a stunned rat, the little punk.

can i use craigslist here in england or is there an english equivalant?

Hi,


Forgive me if this has been covered but could you ask for a close up good picture of that "discoulored" area?

If the owner cannot get the food it prefers when was the last time he managed to get it to eat? When was the photo taken?

It does look a nice animal though - but I would ask what his policy would be if you were unhappy with it when it arrived just to see what they say.


dr del

If he's eaten "recently" could it be waste??? In Crystal, Flurry and CeCe our LTR, snow corn and albino Nelson's (respectively), that sort of marking is prevelant as food is being readied to be poo'd out. :D

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Originally Posted by martyb

can i use craigslist here in england or is there an english equivalant?

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sure, thers a craigslist for most major cities around the world


heres the listing for the UK

http://geo.craigslist.org/iso/gb