How do you feed your BPs?

This has come up a couple of times, and I just wanted to get a feel for how all the herp-folk feed their snakes. I have always heard that feeding them in their enclosures is a bad idea. A lot of the members with WAY more experience than I've got feed theirs in the enclosure, and I've kind of heard both ways on the live vs. F/T issue. So, all you pros and non-pros alike, weigh in, por favor! :D

500+ ball pythons every week, all live, all in the enclosure ... never a problem. ;)

-adam

Personally I think it puts less stress on the snake if you just feed it in its enclosure instead of bothering it right before and after feeding, especially if the snake is shy or a finicky eater. But thats just my opinion. Also when you have 50+ snakes you dont really have time to feed them all out of the enclosure. :D

Or 500+ snakes as it may be. :P

I only go for f/t if 1. the snake will eat it... Because I have too much of a soft spot for the cute little fuzzy mice/rats and I personly feel too responsible for their deaths (I know that's such an excuse) if I witness their death and I'm always worried about the snake being bitten... I've been bitten by both mice and rats and it's always drawn blood and hurt like hell, don't want that for my snake... If the snake won't eat... I try live.

My own snake is getting tried out on F/T... Hopefully all goes well.

I feed in my enclosures. Most of them are on F/T, it's more convenient for me. I have a three that are finicky, one that will only take live (a hatchling I'd like to get on F/T), two adults that will only take live or fresh killed.

I think it comes down to what works for the keeper and his/her snake(s).

I feed in a seperate enclosure. Live crawler mice. Once she can take down stuff much bigger. Ill be feeding per killed.

I don't wanna be whacking mice or rats. What ill do is gas em with co2 before I give em to her. That way there's no trying to heat it up to the right temps.

I have to agree with BPGirl. I feed all of mine in the enclosure and always live. As BPGirl mentioned you do not disturb the snake before and after feeding. Less stress on the snake.
I also must mention you should never leave live food in with the snake alone!
Sorry I cant stress that enough.

Hi,


Well you need extra options in your poll.:P

I feed everyone F/T but one of them refuses to eat in her enclosure but will happily take your arm off if you feed in another tank/tub ( she doesn't care long as it isnt home :confused: ).


dr del

I feed all of mine live, in their enclosures.

Live and in their tubs. No problem-no sweat. Everyone's happy :carrot:

Dr. Del-

Perhaps one of the admin could add a couple of other options- that's all I could think of!

Hi,


I added two more options for you.

Are they ok or would you like anything else added/changed?


dr del

I feed everyone in there encloser, F/T. Adam, I wounder, if you had all of your balls on f/t...where would you thaw them out? LOL

I feed Nagini in a separate enclosure - a kritter keeper we call 'The Cafe', and I feed her live hoppers. I do this only because her enclosure has a lot of branches and fake leaves and the one time I tried feeding in there, the hopper (on tongs by the tail) kept grabbing everything it could and that scared the snake. Once she's out in her cafe, she knows it's time for food. After she's done swallowing (and I'm done cleaning her tank) I carefully remove her hide and slide her very slowly back into her home straight from the box.
I'm still debating on whether I'll prekill or keep em live once she's on bigger mice.

I feed in their tubs, live as well.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by stangs13

I feed everyone in there encloser, F/T. Adam, I wounder, if you had all of your balls on f/t...where would you thaw them out? LOL

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in the "thawing room" of course. ;)

-adam

I think that pretty much covers all the bases, Dr. Del!! :)

Can anyone else think of any methods we didn't cover?

All 21 eat live, 20 of them eat in their home enclosures, only the 1 milksnake eats in a seperate tub as her home is a bit too "busy".

All of mine are fed live in their enclosures. We tried feeding our balls in a separate tub when we only had a few because we had heard that was better for them. We switched for 2 reasons: I was always concerned that moving them right after they ate was way too stressful and after you reach a certain # of balls it becomes a nightmare to move them to a separate tub to feed.


I've never had a problem since I switched.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

500+ ball pythons every week, all live, all in the enclosure ... never a problem. ;)

-adam

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Not as many balls, only 200+, but we do it the same, and never had a problem.

All in their enclosures live... except for my female BCC. I haft to pre-kill her lg. rats to be consumed over night.... she's a LTC, and that's just the arrangement we found that worked when she was freshly imported.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Laooda

All in their enclosures live... except for my female BCC. I haft to pre-kill her lg. rats to be consumed over night.... she's a LTC, and that's just the arrangement we found that worked when she was freshly imported.

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See now that says it all right there. You do in the end what works best for that particular snake so that you end up with a snake that eats consistently. It's not always about what we want for a feeding method (or even type of prey) but what the snake will accept with a nice aggressive feeding response. Good for you Laura for adjusting to this snake's specific needs! :)

I also feed live in their enclosure, I used to prekill (CO2 tank)but with 30 + snakes thats alot of pre killing and then alot of them wouldn't eat prekilled so some were killed unnecessarily. I also used to feed larger items but found more consistent feeding response with smaller as opposed to larger meals and live as opposed to prekilled. Now when I come in the room with live rats on feeding day my good eaters start coming out of their hides and hit the rats before they even hit the bottom of the tub! That makes popa proud :D !

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

in the "thawing room" of course. ;)

-adam

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Man, you haev a room for everything....lol.:P

I feed live outside of the enclosure. Then I dont have to worry about the snakes eating the bedding, or not comming out of their hides. Plus, because when I used to feed inside of their cages, they would be in a strike position every time I opend it- which is at least once a day. But sense I started feeing them out of the cages, they are always completely relaxed untill in I put them in the boxes, then they just get into position and wait for me to drop it in :)
Oh yea- plus I dont have to worry about cleaning up whatever came out of the mouse.. Cause they can be messy after being sqeezed so hard- as Im sure alot of you know.. Cause they mighty think Im another mouse!!

i feed them f/t in their tubs and sometimes live(if my family isnt home) when i get the chance also in their tubs.

all my snakes but 5 eat f/t in a seperate container...the other 5 eat live in a seperate container.


regards,
Hanabi

All of mine, except the Hog Island boa, eat in their enclosures. I have found the boa to be rather inaccurate at times with her strikes and when she misses, she doesn't eat. It's just easier to take her out and feed in a separate tub.

As for the others, almost everyone eats F/T. I have a few that only eat live (including my biggest female ball) so that's what they get. The only reasons I prefer the F/T is for convenience and cost. I don't have the space to raise rodents or I would feed everyone live or pre-killed.

i feed my 11 snakes FT in there tubs. I am kind of surprised that there are a larger amount of people that feed live. I always thought most fed FT or pre killed. I guess what ever works best is the way too go for that individual.

I feed all 9 of mine live in their tubs or tanks. Once in a while I'll feed f/t to the 3 that will take f/t.

How about in their enclosures and what ever i can get them. They usually perfer live, however recently my only local supplier stopped selling live dues to mite infestations...

Haha, so they get the frozen kind.

Poor snakeys, I think they r pissed off

Sean-

i feed my royal with F/T in his tub , never had an aggression problem yet i feed my carpet the same way too :)

I feed all of mine live in their enclosures.

I feed some live and others F/T but all of them are fed in their tubs.

i feed live in the enclosure, i figure they have been doing it for millions of years why mess with a good thing?

I buy them live and knock them silly (most of the time they are still "kinda alive", as in twitching) and feed them off. I would do F/T, but I think grabbing a rat and slamming it to the ground to kill it and then feeding it off is still slightly less gross than leaving it to thaw out on a counter in a plastic bag and then putting it in hot water, bloody or not :O

Hi,

I would urge you to look into finding a more humane way of dispatching the feeders.


dr del

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kom@tose

I buy them live and knock them silly ...

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I used to do that for my kingsnake, but then a tail came off in my hand and I had a tailless, bloody, twitchy mouse running around. Now I do F/T.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by dr del

Hi,

I would urge you to look into finding a more humane way of dispatching the feeders.


dr del

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Isn't that the way people kill rats? I've heard it called "the deceleration method", but I choose not to sugarcoat it, in the grand scheme of things the rat is going to have a bad day no matter what, and I'd imagine hitting the ground once is quicker and less painful than being suffocated by a large constrictor. I understand this is a forum of animal lovers, a title I would classify myself under, but come on, its a rat that I bought for the purpose of killing and feeding it to something else.

If you have another suggestion though I'd be open to hearing it, but we can't pretend that F/T rats wouldn't rather be alive, no matter what way the pros use to kill them.

Hi,


Well if they are dead when you feed them a co2 chamber springs to mind - there are even a few threads/articles on how to build them right here on the site.

And yeah, I agree they would rather be alive and the reason I mention this is that over here using the deceleration method would get you put in jail and banned from keeping animals if caught where as the gas chamber method would get you evil looks but no legal problems.

Each country and enforcement agency has different policies but very few of them seem to know a thing about reptile keeping.:mad:


dr del

Oh I didn't notice you were from the UK. I'll look into it man.
:rockon:

I have 16 BP's that eat f/t. And 4 bp's that prefer live. Whatever they'll eat is what I feed them. I personally don't have time to raise my own mice. Forget that.

It's amazing how long this myth will survive. Rodents under constriction from a snake do not die by suffocation. Suffocation is a longer process of death for the rodent which would present it with more opportunity to fight back. Nature did not design snakes in such a way to allow for this type of kill which would create an unsafe environment for the snake.

Multiple studies on the constriction action and power of various snakes show that in fact the rodents are almost immediately immobilized and die due to an instantaneous shutting down of major blood vessels and pressure on their heart muscle. Basically they die about as quickly as we would of massive and complete heart failure. This creates one of the cleanest kills in the animal world, very humane for the prey animal, very safe for the predator.

I am of the opinion that there is no more humane or effecient way for a rodent to die than by the natural action of constriction by a snake. For this reason among others, I choose to feed live.

The only reason I don't throw live mice to my snakes: I have had a king bitten BADLY and a RTB bitten even worse... and gotten infected. Now I only give F/T. If a snake won't take it they don't eat this week.

Whatever the actual reason for them dying by constriction, I don't want any life or death struggles between large rats and snakes to occur in a fish tank in my room, so I cut that part out of the equation, and I don't like the idea of frozen rats thawing out in my house, so I kill them myself, outside, in a bucket. Some of my bigger BPs and my big Coastal all eat Jumbo's. Those things don't look like something I want running around, fully functional, in an enclosed area with any snake that I paid any amount of money for.

I'm not trying to look like Mike Vick out here, but sometimes some small rodents are just dealt a bad hand in life.

There's no reason your Ball pythons ever need jumbo rats. 45-50g rats is ALL they need once per week, no more. Big meals cause fasts and inconsistency in feeding. I'm sure your carpet would be EASY to switch over to f/t, and you wouldn't have to spend an arm and a leg for those huge meals. Feeding large rats to Ball pythons who may or may not want that meal, is a great way to get your snakes bitten and hurt. Not a wise practice.

FWIW, my boa, who is 25lbs and 7.5ft, is quite able to take down a live 2.5lb rabbit without any assistance from me. It is usually dead within 1 minute. These snakes are very capable of taking down their prey without our help. They've done it for millions of years and will continue to do so even after we are gone.

I agree with Becky on that prey size thing. Even our largest female ball python whose just passed the 3,200 gram mark would never be offered a large or jumbo rat. The absolute biggest she's ever been offered would be what I'd call either a large small or a small medium. That size is perfect for her as far as growth and will not trigger a fast or cause her body extra strain in digesting an overly large meal.

i have a feed box for my snake. A Heineken box that is starting to accumulate dried blood and hair from her previous meals. it's the only way i can feed her, she wont eat otherwise! I give her F/T but i think i'll give her some live every now and then.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by dr del

Hi,

I would urge you to look into finding a more humane way of dispatching the feeders.


dr del

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I kill my mice with a .45....



just kidding, as i mentioned earlier, i feed f/t.
I'd imagine that a quick knock to the back of the skull would me more "humane" (would the proper term be rodente?) as i doubt it would feel anything. but getting squeezed between coils is probably quite uncomfortable. Either ways, one's natural, the other one (theoretically) is painless. You decide

Quote:

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Originally Posted by anthrpicdecadnce

I kill my mice with a .45....



just kidding, as i mentioned earlier, i feed f/t.
I'd imagine that a quick knock to the back of the skull would me more "humane" (would the proper term be rodente?) as i doubt it would feel anything. but getting squeezed between coils is probably quite uncomfortable. Either ways, one's natural, the other one (theoretically) is painless. You decide

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If fed the proper size prey the constriction of a snake is actually very quick and humane in itself.