horse people..? re: lunge-lining

I have a question about lunging (on a line.) I took Emma out for awhile today and she did pretty good, as she has not been lunged in over a year, and never on a line! I did it in a roundpen before but never on line in a pasture with the other mare as a distraction..
Well, Emma paid attention pretty well, but I am trying to figure out how to get her to stop. She is not big on verbal commands; she reads body language well though, but if I stop spinning, she will generally stop when I give a pull on the rope sideways; any hints? I had her going about 15 feet away from me, in a circle. Finally used that lunge line for something besides a blockade rope in the barn aisle, or a long dog leash!
And how do you avoid getting soooo dizzy!? I was about to fall on the ground, lol!
I did not overdo it; I trotted her for a few minutes but she was breathing a bit heavy so I slowed her and stopped.
Any other tips would be appreciated! I will get a video soon.

About getting dizzy, instead of turning constantly, walk a small circle while facing her or even slightly ahead of her, and if you want to stand in one spot, turn halfway, pause, turn halfway pause, rather than constant turning. Looking only at the horse helps, don't be tempting to look beyond at the horizon going by... and by and by...
The stopping is deendant on how you have her hooked up. Using a chain under her jaw, you can pull and it puts pressure there. Just snapped onto a halter, body language and verbal are about the best you can hope for. Stepping "behind" and giving a sharp pull while giving the verbal also can help. Shaking a lunge whip in front for the determined lunging horse to distract them from the repetive motion and make them pay attention to you, and/or the surroundings sometimes works. They can get "bewitched" by the round and round too, and the shaking of the object in front of them usually breaks that trance(if your animal is prone to it).

I visited my wife at work today about mid day and she was lunging one of the many horses she has in for training. I don't know squat about horses but I can back up what wolfy said. In watching my wife work she walks in a small to medium circle herself to avoid "sitting and spinning". I've not seen the full process but she uses voice commands and has a whip in one hand :P ...not that I've ever seen her use it. The little monster as she called it that I saw her working had come a long way I guess. Started out a real freak and had to be on chains to start but none of that is needed anymore. Again I have no about horses myself but my wife went to college for equine management or something like that and has been training them for years...she knows her ...horse poo LOL

Wow; sounds like Emma a bit Tek :) She was never worked when we got her; last year, she had her colt at her side so working her was futile and would have been too hard on her; but this year is her year to put her nose to the grindstone. :)
I definately want to avoid the mindless trancelike lunging; thanks for the tips Wolfy. I was using the loose, coiled end of the line as a whip because honestly, Emma is deeply terrified of whips for some reason (hoses too; she was probably clobbered by one..) So until I can work on that; I wrapped it neatly so it was not something we could trip on.. she responded well to my body language and I only needed an occasional flick of the LL end and things went better than I thought; I plan on getting another line so Mark can work one of the mares while I work the other; Cuesta is a deadbeat at times so it will be fun to get her going!
I am using a white "Weaver" brand line.. I had actually just clipped it to her big halter ring but I think I will try the chain-nosing thing.. I seem to have remember someone having a foam-like one before; like an inner rope covered in a tubular foam; I wonder if those exist anymore (this was the 1980s lol.)

If you face and focus (actually look) on the flank of the horse, this will promote movement. Horses move away from pressure/obstacles..... Same goes for asking them to stop or slow down. If you take a large step towards her nose..basically suggesting that your are getting in front of her...(even though you are not close) and hold your hand up and say "whoa" or "ho" or what ever your stop word is, while gently pulling her head towards you... she might instinctively stop for you. :)

I just haft to add, *not trying to contradict Wolfy*... but I would never use a chain on a mare in an open pasture... if like you say she shys from lunge whips etc... then there is a good chance that she has also had a chain used on her improperly as well.... Under the chin = head up... sometimes waaayyyy up. If she bolts from the shock of a unexpected chain tug, then you could loose her in an open field dragging a line that could get tangled etc... not good. (not to mention I've seen several fingers get broken that way)...
Again... no Wolfy bashing, just my opinion... :)

I use a line with about 1 ft of chain at the horses end. I run it through the loop of the halter on the side I'm standing, then pass it under the chin and hook it to the loop on the far side. Gives you much more control of an untrained horse. When attempting to stop an untrained horse I say whoa while tugging the head repeatedly towards me . Turning the horses head slows them down, With a little work she will get your drift. For safetys sake never step in front of a moving horse. Also I may never use it , but I always keep a whip in hand. If a horse comes in too close you can ussually wave it and they will move out and away from you. No whip in hand can be a bit dangerous with an untrained animal. You don't have to use it on them the wave will ussually make them turn away. As far as circling myself, I just stay in one spot and take lrge pivot steps. Also when you reverse the direction, change out the direction of the halter chain.

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Originally Posted by Laooda

I just haft to add, *not trying to contradict Wolfy*... but I would never use a chain on a mare in an open pasture... if like you say she shys from lunge whips etc... then there is a good chance that she has also had a chain used on her improperly as well.... Under the chin = head up... sometimes waaayyyy up. If she bolts from the shock of a unexpected chain tug, then you could loose her in an open field dragging a line that could get tangled etc... not good. (not to mention I've seen several fingers get broken that way)...
Again... no Wolfy bashing, just my opinion... :)

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As far as fingers broken, Please DO NOT wrap the lead around hands or any body part while working her. Allow it to slide thru your hands, then grab and tug.
May have to tug several times while you get her back under control. I have seen a person dragged at high speed when they wrapped it around their body. WHY, I DON'T KNOW!:eek:

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Originally Posted by Blu Mongoose

As far as fingers broken, Please DO NOT wrap the lead around hands or any body part while working her. Allow it to slide thru your hands, then grab and tug.
May have to tug several times while you get her back under control. I have seen a person dragged at high speed when they wrapped it around their body. WHY, I DON'T KNOW!:eek:

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OMG.. scary thought!
Soon we plan on creating a roundpen-like enclosure for holding and working purposes, inside our pasture; it is about three acres. I really like free-lunging more; we worked on that when Em was at the trainer's last year, since he has a roundpen..
I do not know if she has had a chain on her ever (looped thru halter).. her past is shadier than mine! ;) But should I try it as a default, or, since she is responding by using the one ring, just go for that?

If she responds well to just one in the ring that's great. I myself don't like free lunging. I feel you gain more control and teach a little restraint on their part when they know you are in control. Sometimes when they are free running and not reined in a certain area I have seen them spook and try to scale a round pen wall. One such incident the horses chest was deeply gashed. If your horse is already familiar with the pen it is likely not as much of a risk.Good luck with her training. It builds a great bond with your animals to work with them on a regular basis.

Personally, I wouldn't lunge with a chain until Emma is *quite* accustomed to working on the lunge as it is. If you can, get a decent lunge caveson & work with that. A good one will have a sturdy noseband (i.e. don't just settle for the equivalent of a halter w/rings on the noseband) that will add more support & reinforcement while the two of you are making progress on the lunge. You can add a surcingle & side reins later on if you want to take things further.

If you are able to work in a more confined space, the easier it will be for you to establish voice commands while using a wall as a boundary/reinforcement in doing so.

Chains definitely have their place & time...I've just never been a fan of using them instead of instilling "the basics," whether on a lead, lunge, etc. Establish & enforce the basics first, then bring out the heavy metal if absolutely necessary.

Just my $.02

K~

Thanks. The roundpen-wall thing is scary; I am thinking of just skipping the pen and doing things out in the field.
I want to get out there and lunge her some tomorrow, and Mark can work Cuesta.. she tends to be a slight deadbeat and needs encouragement to move, but we'l see how that goes; any advice for that? :)

Everyone has their own way of doing things. I just don't like working close to rail walls or fences till I can trust what a horse is doing. Scared horses do really crazy crap.
I haven't had a horse fora couple years now, but love working with them so much I work my friend Judys'. I took a day of vacation yesterday soley to work her horses and play with the new filly.
Have a blast with Emma.:)

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Originally Posted by Ginevive

Thanks. The roundpen-wall thing is scary; I am thinking of just skipping the pen and doing things out in the field.
I want to get out there and lunge her some tomorrow, and Mark can work Cuesta.. she tends to be a slight deadbeat and needs encouragement to move, but we'l see how that goes; any advice for that? :)

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I usually tap them on the rump very lightly to get them going. If that gets no response I pop it behind them which startles them a little to go. Don't try that with a horse that is jumpy or scared of the whip. A rescue that came in will go till she drops if she sees a whip. I can just imagine what someone did to her. I just wave my hand in the air and making clicking sounds when I want her to go.

Gin Round pens serve a very good purpose. I'm not talking about panels set up in a circle, or a 6-7 foot railing, a real round pen. Tall, sturdy, safe. The round part serves as a tool as well. Horses can/will stop in a corner with their butt towards you, this can be bad if your having a conflict, round=no ez/comfortable stop or "hide". Where the animal and you are focused completely on each other. As Blue Mongoose mentioned, everyone has a method, and there are as many good ways to train a horse as there are to cycle a fish tank... having a luge whip with you is a good thing in case one get confused and comes towards you, and also to use as an extension of your "arm". Basic ground work, voice commands, pressure and release, and body language. Have you considered going to a clinic with one or both of them? Here trainers hold "clinics" where you pay to watch them train. More if you want to bring your animal as one of the subjects. Never attended a bad one... and always learned a ton! Siminars are great too!

No problem with contradictions. I suggested the chain if she was having issues with her stopping without one. I always advocate using the least amount of effort to get the result you want.
I prefer to have the horse inside a pen if you worry about them going out of control. Better confined and not able to build up tons of speed rather than in an open field, but again, that's me. I've lunged both in pens and out in fields. I used chains, no chains, looped chains and full rein rigs with a surgingle.
Never ever loop up the lunge line. If you must gather the excess, you fold it, so there are no loops that can cinch tight around your hand. Never wrap a lunge line, a lead rope, or any other line that is attached to a horse around any part of your body. Even if your old placid mare hasn't ever moved faster than a walk, it only takes once to be badly injured.
Horses might be wonderful animals, but they are still "animals" and subject to panicing, to spooking, to swinging that half ton of flesh into you and squashing you like a bug without meaning to.
It sounds like you are off to a great start! Just don't make excuses for her behavior. It doesn't matter too much what happened to her early in life, just work her as if there is no issues, and try to give her the calm placid energy from yourself. Always expect her to do the oddest thing at the most inopportune time, and you'll do well!
Wolfy

Oh, I would never wrap the line around my right hand.. I have been dragged (very painfully) by a dog on a leash; I would be horrified to think what could happen being dragged by a horse.. death or serious injury, I am thinking..!
I am so happy; I had been having catching issues w/ bringing them in at night.. they would either come to the gate and then run off, or not come up altogether. I have been just going out to the pasture and either just petting them or even better, giving them some treats; now it is getting so that if I call them, they'll come right away! Last night, Mark was surprised when they galloped pell-mell right to the gate when he went out to bring-in.. glad this is getting better.