Feeding Live...

I've been feeding my snake live with very little problems. However sometimes when he strikes he doesn't get the head so the mouse is free to move. One time I had to hold the mouse's head so he wouldn't bite. But sometimes the way he curls up I'm not able to get to the head of the mouse if needed (I'm not sticking my hand in there and unwrapping him from the mouse, thats just asking for a bite :P). Is there anything I can really do to help with this?

well we just let nature do its own thing... we had one last night we feed a small rat to our 1300 gram female and soon as we dropped the rat in the feeding tub she took it, she started eating the head before it was even dead but evetually she coiled it to kill it, it was weired.....i thought she was gonna eat it alive..

I don't interfere with strikes that are off - they work it out just fine on their own. I had one last week that grabbed the back leg and did just fine working it out with no injuries. I've done over 2000 live feedings and never had an injury.

Most any healthy ball python will instinctively know how to handle it's prey. As long as the prey is an appropriate size and the snake is hungry and healthy, it normally is over in a second or two.

I just let mine handle it. If the prey is the correct size...chances are the snake is going to have the upper hand. I have always fed live to my corns, balls, and boa. I have never had a problem. If they don't strike and coil when I put the prey in there (within a couple mins) I take it back out. I have no shy eaters so I know if they don't get them almost immediately...they don't want it. I would not stick my hand in there once they have struck the prey though.

I've fed live to my corns a few times and they always got bit. The place I got my ball from was feeding live, he has bites on his neck and was covered in blood. I will only feed F/t or freshly killed for now on.

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Originally Posted by waldo

I've fed live to my corns a few times and they always got bit. The place I got my ball from was feeding live, he has bites on his neck and was covered in blood. I will only feed F/t or freshly killed for now on.

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The place you got him from obviously wasn't feeding live responsibly. Sounds like they left live prey that he wasn't interested in for far too long!

Feed what you're most comfortable with and your snake will eat reliably for you! :)

Like the others said if the prey is the right size the bp will work it out.
But ALWAYS stay and supervise just to make sure. Never leave a live prey item in w/ your bp unattended. I keep a pencil handy to use just in case there is a problem. Never had one up to this point and I have been feeding live for almost 4 yrs now.

I feed live. The first time I did it he got the mouse's whole head in his mouth and I thought that's the way it worked. But, over time I've found that the snake doesn't go for the head at all. It only happens if the rodent is coming straight at the snake for the strike. The majority of the feeds he gets them somewhere along the side and then re-aligns them for swallowing. So far, it doesn't seem to matter much because he squeezes them so hard they are unable to do much.

I will only feed my young 1 year olds small mice alive. I learned this from my raising my older 11 year old female. I learned larger prey items have the tendacy to protect there selves and bite. So now my older female and borneo get pre killed rats. Once my het pairs grow up it'll be prekilled for them as well.

Today I realized that now im gonna feed all my snakes in seperate containers due to a factor which caused me to have a TITTY attack. I seen a peice of mulch in my girls mouth today and was made me sweet balls taking that thing out. I would defenity feed her and my borneo in the tub for now on, and my to hets in stertile containers

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Originally Posted by bearhart

I feed live. The first time I did it he got the mouse's whole head in his mouth and I thought that's the way it worked. But, over time I've found that the snake doesn't go for the head at all. It only happens if the rodent is coming straight at the snake for the strike. The majority of the feeds he gets them somewhere along the side and then re-aligns them for swallowing. So far, it doesn't seem to matter much because he squeezes them so hard they are unable to do much.

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Is it normal for them to not go for the head? I assumed that was the best to go for since thats the main defense of their prey. And this past feeding he did get bit, not bad but I'm still gonna keep an eye on it. And I don't leave the mouse unsupervised, if he doesn't show interest within a few minutes I put the mouse back in the cage.

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Originally Posted by bearhart

So far, it doesn't seem to matter much because he squeezes them so hard they are unable to do much.

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Maybe it's just my bp, but she always seems to aim for the mouses rear, and definitaley eats from the rear. The way she coils around the mouse usually leaves the front half able to flail around, and I just recently found what appears to be a small bite mark that a mouse made WHILE being constricted. I watch the feedings closely and there is no way the mouse bit her before she got the mouse.

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Originally Posted by Nikki0326

Is it normal for them to not go for the head? I assumed that was the best to go for since thats the main defense of their prey. And this past feeding he did get bit, not bad but I'm still gonna keep an eye on it. And I don't leave the mouse unsupervised, if he doesn't show interest within a few minutes I put the mouse back in the cage.

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They in reality don't aim for any certain part of the body, they just strike at the heat signature their heat pits pick up.

I haven't had to deal with it but I have heard (and seen) people that keep a pencil or something long on hand to allow the mouse to bite on if it's head is free. A friend of mine was feeding and the ball struck and coiled around the butt end of the mouse. The mouse started biting the snakes coils, and he just stuck the pencil in the mouses mouth so it started biting that instead of his snake.

Like I said, I've never had to do it, so I'm not too sure about it, but it seems to help. ^_^

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Originally Posted by crisstyle21

I will only feed my young 1 year olds small mice alive. I learned this from my raising my older 11 year old female. I learned larger prey items have the tendacy to protect there selves and bite. So now my older female and borneo get pre killed rats. Once my het pairs grow up it'll be prekilled for them as well.

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You must be feeding a much larger rat than necessary. 4-5 week old rats are just as clueless as the mice are about what's about to happen.

i'd be worried that the mouse would bite off the eraser and the snake would eat is w/ the mouse then what are ya gonna do.... just let nature take its place.....

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Originally Posted by crisstyle21

I will only feed my young 1 year olds small mice alive. I learned this from my raising my older 11 year old female. I learned larger prey items have the tendacy to protect there selves and bite. So now my older female and borneo get pre killed rats. Once my het pairs grow up it'll be prekilled for them as well.

Today I realized that now im gonna feed all my snakes in seperate containers due to a factor which caused me to have a TITTY attack. I seen a peice of mulch in my girls mouth today and was made me sweet balls taking that thing out. I would defenity feed her and my borneo in the tub for now on, and my to hets in stertile containers

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thats what we do we have a feeding tub, but small mice is not enough i would think.. we have all ours on live small rats and they have yet to hurt any of ours.... even our 7 month old budda is on small rats..

remember rats are and have more nutrition then mice...

They may be more nutritious, but for who? My grandmother? Since we don't know the nutritional requirements of Ball Pythons, that speculation is a moot point.

All of mine eat mice and I have '06's who are 700+ grams, and that's on only 2 mice per week. I also have one female(who is currently gravid) who was 780g last May. On only 2-3 mice per week, she gained over 1500g and is currently 2200g empty.

It doesn't matter what the snake eats, just so the prey is the correct size and the snake eats consistently. Two 20-25 mice is the same exact thing as one 40-50g rat(which is ALL any Ball Python ever needs per week). Yes, they CAN take larger prey, but it's not in the best interest of the animal. True, my adult females could easily take a large rat(150-200g), but that doesn't mean a thing to me. They gain weight very easily on 2-3 mice per week, usually 100g/month depending on the snake.

To KIBPLOVER, I thought alot of your snakes were fasting right now? And if they are, and are babies, you need to figure out why(too large of prey, too large of tub, temps inconsistent, etc). And have you sealed that rack yet? If not, it's going to just fall apart as MDF is not that sturdy unless you seal it prior to exposing it to constant moisture.

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Originally Posted by SatanicIntention

They may be more nutritious, but for who? My grandmother? Since we don't know the nutritional requirements of Ball Pythons, that speculation is a moot point.

All of mine eat mice and I have '06's who are 700+ grams, and that's on only 2 mice per week. I also have one female(who is currently gravid) who was 780g last May. On only 2-3 mice per week, she gained over 1500g and is currently 2200g empty.

It doesn't matter what the snake eats, just so the prey is the correct size and the snake eats consistently. Two 20-25 mice is the same exact thing as one 40-50g rat(which is ALL any Ball Python ever needs per week). Yes, they CAN take larger prey, but it's not in the best interest of the animal. True, my adult females could easily take a large rat(150-200g), but that doesn't mean a thing to me. They gain weight very easily on 2-3 mice per week, usually 100g/month depending on the snake.

To KIBPLOVER, I thought alot of your snakes were fasting right now? And if they are, and are babies, you need to figure out why(too large of prey, too large of tub, temps inconsistent, etc). And have you sealed that rack yet? If not, it's going to just fall apart as MDF is not that sturdy unless you seal it prior to exposing it to constant moisture.

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:rockon:

I read some research on the matter, (can't remember where at the moment, I'll look for it and get back to yall) that actually states two mice is better for a snake than a rat. Sure, the rat may be more nutritous, but 2 mice has everything a bp needs and then some. The reason two mice is better for a snake is due to the size and ease of digestion. Skin and hair are VERY taxing on the digestive system to digest and usually the last parts digested along with the bones. So then if the skin/hair is the last thing to be digested, then how does the rest of the animal get digested first? Easy, the acids seep in through the bodies orifaces, aka the mouse and rectum and digest the prey from the inside out. Two mice provide twice the openings for acids to reach their targets and aids/speeds digestion hence causing less stress to the snake because it is widely known that digestion is a whole body experience for a snake. Digestive tract has to expand, organs secrete far more bodily juices to digest the prey, the heart enlarges, breathing becomes labored. etc etc.

This is not to say that feedig rats is bad, however contrary to popular belief 2-3 mice are just as good, if not better than an equivalent sized rat.:salute:

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Originally Posted by crisstyle21

I will only feed my young 1 year olds small mice alive. I learned this from my raising my older 11 year old female. I learned larger prey items have the tendacy to protect there selves and bite. So now my older female and borneo get pre killed rats. Once my het pairs grow up it'll be prekilled for them as well.

Today I realized that now im gonna feed all my snakes in seperate containers due to a factor which caused me to have a TITTY attack. I seen a peice of mulch in my girls mouth today and was made me sweet balls taking that thing out. I would defenity feed her and my borneo in the tub for now on, and my to hets in stertile containers

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Here's a link to a few posts about what I do (live, seperate tub) as well as an account of a successful feed today :)

http://www.ball-pythons.net/forums/s...830#post554830

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Originally Posted by Gooseman

Maybe it's just my bp, but she always seems to aim for the mouses rear, and definitaley eats from the rear. The way she coils around the mouse usually leaves the front half able to flail around, and I just recently found what appears to be a small bite mark that a mouse made WHILE being constricted. I watch the feedings closely and there is no way the mouse bit her before she got the mouse.

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Yea, I'm concerned about the safety issue with live feed. I've really been concentrating on the issue of how to make things go down well and make sure the snake has the upper hand. I think one thing that a seperate tub does for the situation is remove alot of variables.

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Originally Posted by bearhart

Yea, I'm concerned about the safety issue with live feed. I've really been concentrating on the issue of how to make things go down well and make sure the snake has the upper hand. I think one thing that a seperate tub does for the situation is remove alot of variables.

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For the most part there's a reason snakes have scales, and no they're not just drop dead sexy. They're body armor. Most incidents you hear about from live feed are from irrespnsible owners, however there can be bites you cannot always stop. Despite the bite, I am going to remain feeding live b/c in the great scheme of things there is little danger to the snake if properly observed. A small bite is a small bite. Hurts for the time being, but a lesson to do it better next time around. And she seems to have taken the advice with the last two mice I've given her.

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Originally Posted by bearhart

Yea, I'm concerned about the safety issue with live feed. I've really been concentrating on the issue of how to make things go down well and make sure the snake has the upper hand. I think one thing that a seperate tub does for the situation is remove alot of variables.

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As well as removing the safety and protection of hunting from their hides in their own enclosures. :rolleyes:

Feed in a separate enclosure if it makes you feel better, but it's just not necessary. I don't interfere with my snakes or try to give them the upper hand - they are perfectly capable of dispatching live prey with no interference from me.

If you have routines, pre-scent the room, don't leave prey in for any longer than 30 minutes, and let them do their thing, you'll find that they are quite efficient hunters.

I feed live, untill I find a good source of f/t food. But yes Chester is a great live feeder, he always gets the head, rarely the neck and never anything past there. Its over for the mouse or small rat (whatever I may be feeding to my beauty at that time) in 10-15 seconds. Not long at all. Maybe even less than this.

Edit: Yes I feed him in his tub. I used to feed f/t outside outside his enclosure, but Chester either soon became lazy or wasnt interested untill inside his tank (this was when he was in his 20gal long tank) plus my room was a bit cold outside the tank. But I have been feeding live since January 07. For me, its more convenient (except now my room smells like mice and its sometimes a bit messier.. :( ) and for Chester. Chester usually eats 3-4 adult mice a week, or a small rat 3-5 weeks of age per week or every 7-9 days. The most he has ever eaten (because I had to get rid of my male mice and some) was 4 hopper male mice, and 1 adult white male mous and a fat mean hamster...

Did I read somewhere that feeding them hamsters and gerbils can cause them to refuse other foods? Is that true?

it can and hamsters and gerbils get expensive....

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Originally Posted by rabernet

As well as removing the safety and protection of hunting from their hides in their own enclosures. :rolleyes:

Feed in a separate enclosure if it makes you feel better, but it's just not necessary. I don't interfere with my snakes or try to give them the upper hand - they are perfectly capable of dispatching live prey with no interference from me.

If you have routines, pre-scent the room, don't leave prey in for any longer than 30 minutes, and let them do their thing, you'll find that they are quite efficient hunters.

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Originally Posted by Gooseman

For the most part there's a reason snakes have scales, and no they're not just drop dead sexy. They're body armor. Most incidents you hear about from live feed are from irrespnsible owners, however there can be bites you cannot always stop. Despite the bite, I am going to remain feeding live b/c in the great scheme of things there is little danger to the snake if properly observed. A small bite is a small bite. Hurts for the time being, but a lesson to do it better next time around. And she seems to have taken the advice with the last two mice I've given her.

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Drop dead sexy - LOL. Well I definately feel better about not using a seperate enclosure after talking to you guys. But, I'm reluctant to change things up since I haven't had any troubles in that area.

It seems like alot of these issues are partly controlled by both the owner's and the snake's preference. I'm a n00b so I'm not trying to say anybody's doing anything right or wrong - only what works for me.