Trial

I was thinking of breeding mice when I had more snakes (more than 3, currently have 2). I have never kept a mouse before and I was thinking maybe it would be a good idea to get a mouse (or two. Do they need cagemates?) and keep it as a pet and see how things go before I jump into breeding them. Sound like a plan? I was thinking about getting the mouse after I move into the townhome this summer. My grandmother refuses to allow me to have rodents in the house unless they are dead (frozen feeders).

Could anyone provide a complete supplies list for two mice?

Mice are social and so one mouse would not be as happy as two. You will need an escape proof cage, bedding (aspen seems to be the favorite, I use pine for my rats and it works too) a good food mix (store mixes tend to suck, I make my own),A water bottle, something for them to chew (their teeth always grow so buy them something suitable for pet rodents to chew, they make all kinds of things) SOmeplace to hide (I use paper towel tubes) and treats as desired.


I have to say that mice stink.....very badly. I used to have to clean mice cages at my old job and everything was a sticky, grimey, stinky mess....DAILY!

If you can afford the space and extra couple bucks, rats are far better to breed both for their less stink like qualities, and they seem to breed better compared to mice in appropriate conditons.

I would recommend you get 2...as they like companions. I would get 2 females that way when/if you decide to breed them they are old enough (and healthy) and all you have to do is get a male.


Keeping them is easy.
10Gal with screen lid(and locks) or a 32QT rubbermaid - burn holes in its lid
Just note mice stink so the bigger container the longer you can go before you have to change them. My daughter has 2 females in a 32QT and we can go about 7 days before you can smell them.

You will need bedding too...my personal preference is Aspen as it is what I use for my snakes...but you can play around with stuff to see what works for you

A non-chewable water bottle
Food Dish
A hide or house (seems to make them more comfortable)
Food - get a high quality rat/mouse food lab blocks (Mazuri is the best)

These are the basics...enjoy.

The only problem with breeding rats is that at the moment, I have a 63gram corn snake and a very small king. The corn is on mouse hoppers and the king is on mouse pinkies. Would the corn or king be able to eat rats? I know they would not be able to eat full grown rats unless they were very small and thats months and months down the road.

I wouldn't mind rats. I think they are wonderful and I want two for pets.

I like rats personalities better, too bad I am allergic :(


I breed african soft furred rats which are larger than mice and smaller than rats. I do remember rats breeding at a pet store and I think rat pinks ( day olds) would be ok for both snakes. But don't quote me because I have no experience with kings or corns. I have a ball....

Keep us posted on what you decide. I keep my rats in a sterilite bin (forget the size) and I drilled holes in the top for ventilation. I dont know about burning holes, that seems too uncontrolled and the holes might end up too big.

The soldering iron I have makes small holes. Not even a mouse pinky could get through those holes. I'll wait for more opinions over mouse and rats. ASF sound like a good idea. Do they smell better than mice?

in my opinion a sterilite with holes in it is just not enough ventillation for mice. you could cut a section out of the top and use mesh wire to cover it--this will provide much more ventillation. either way the mice will chew any holes you put in the lid if they can reach them and will chew their way out of the tub so i'd advise something tall enough that they can't get to the lid.

i have 2 female mice that are basically just pets and i keep them in a wire cage for maximum ventillation/non-chewage. i also use a product called stall dry from my local feed store--this cuts down on the ammonia smell by far. i use it in all my rats bins as well. before i started using it the mice were ridiculously stinky but it really does help with that.

I will probably go for the open air cages, the ones with bars. It provides the most ventilation.

I was going to try a barred cage but I was afraid the babies would get out. I did have a crittertrail at first but that was a pain to clean with all the tubing and hard to reach areas..plus it wasn't big enough. I think the ventilation could be better in my tub and will be adding more holes.

The first tub I tried was a disaster, 6 rats chewed their way out and 5 were killed by my prison guard, the cat....one was caught and retrieved by my ferret.

Anyways, I learned from that fiasco and bought a taller tub, put in more holes, but smaller holes, and I think I am going to put even more holes now.

ASF rats are pretty cool. They come from africa (so do balls!) and drink little water...they have a far less retch inducing smell but anything will smell if it doesn't get cleaned! Their temperment suck though...which I am glad for so I don't get attached...."you want to bite me??? Well say hello to the snake! muahahahahaa"

Ok, I am better now :sunny: I also like their size, a full grown retired rat is a nice dinner for an adult ball python. So they never outgrow my snake (unlike regular rats which have sweet personalities and get too big for my snake...who wants to feed that?)

hope I was of some use...

Well whatever I choose to breed, they have to have somewhat good temperments, as I told my fiance that when we breed, we can choose to keep some of the babies as pets. Rats would be nice, and I plan on getting some as pets, but as far as breeding rats, I'd have to wait a long time before either of my snakes could put away anything more than a pinky. Spencer isn't even up to mouse fuzzies yet.

As far as cages. I could keep the adults in barred cages and when the momma is preggers, move her into a glass tank, or will moving her cause too much stress?

Kings and corns can handle prey up to 1.5X the diameter of the largest part of the snake. They should be okay w/ 1-2 day old rat pinks, especially by the time you start breeding the rats. Even if this is a little on the large size by then, it woun't be long before they are normal, then too small for the corn and king, and you can start feeding older pinks and fuzzies. I'd go w/ rats.

i think keeping the in wire cages and then moving the mom would work. i always move my rats to a separate tub when they are close to giving birth and they do fine.

I could feed rat pinkies. Is there a picture anywhere that could show the size comparison of a mouse hopper and rat pinky?

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Originally Posted by Jay_Bunny

I could feed rat pinkies. Is there a picture anywhere that could show the size comparison of a mouse hopper and rat pinky?

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Mice hoppers - Length (Inches): 1.50 - 2.00* Weight (Grams): 8.00 - 12.00
Rat pinkies - Length (Inches): 1.50 - 2.00* Weight (Grams): 3.00 - 8.00
Rat fuzzies - Length (Inches): 2.00 - 2.50* Weight (Grams): 9.00 - 19.00

These are the sizes and weights listed on a rodent supplier's website. They also use a larger breed of rat, so normal rats might be a little smaller than this.

rodent pro has good photos on their site: http://www.rodentpro.com

I think Zim could eat a rat pinky no problem. They look smaller than a mouse hopper.

So, I guess I'll be getting some rats this summer. Are males ok by themselves? Or should I get two males and two females?

Just a few thoughts here. Rat pinks are significantly larger than mice pinks and they grow extremely quickly in size. Personally I'd suggest you purchase some f/t rat pinks from PetCo or somewhere like that and try your snakes on them before you consider breeding rats. You've got two snakes that can only take a very specific size of rat pink so you will need to be euthanizing litters at a pre-determined weight. With rat pinks a few days can make a huge difference in size and they will quickly outgrow your colubrid's ability to eat them. Before you breed rats you'll also need to know if your snakes will even switch over to them. Not all snakes, even colubrids will automatically go from mice to rats. I have a milksnake here that won't look twice at a rat pink but will happily take down her two hopper mice a week. She's big enough for a rat pink but simply refuses them outright.

I will definatly try the rat pinky before actually breeding. I don't plan on breeding till I get a third snake. I might even wait to get a fourth snake before breeding. I do want to have the rats for a while though and get to know them as pets. I plan on getting the females this summer (along with a third snake and a second leo.) and in the fall, a pair of female cresties.

Sounds great. I love folks that plan ahead! You can get a nice pair of lovely, healthy just weaned females and raise them up to a nice chunky 4 months old that way. It's best if your breeders are hand tamed, even if you don't want them sort of pets. I know from handling our mature rats that you really want nice tempered ones that are used to you when you are moving adults around or pulling young for feeding off purposes. Once you are ready to breed you can plan on finding a nice young male for that purpose as the males are ready to breed from 6 weeks of age onwards so can be a bit younger than your females. It really is best if you can have two males for company (never in with the females though together) or just have your male keep company with one of his own feeder sons. Rats hate being caged alone.

If you need any advice on how to pick a healthy rat or any health/genetic concerns in a rat colony there's tons of threads in the Feeder forum or just ask. There's a lot of rat breeding experience on BPNet to help you have a very successful time of it. There's a sticky here on how to do a rat colony with little space in your house. Hope that might be helpful to you.

Thanks a lot. I will probably get the rats from the Petco up the street. They sell both males and females.

I will look up the threads about the rat colonies. I will have little space when I move. There is one question I had. Is it ok to keep the rats in the same room as reptiles?

Yep lots of us keep our rodent colonies in the same room as the snakes and it seems to be fine. Just don't forget to never smell like a rat when you go to water the snakes (boy have I forgotten a time or two LOL). PetCo is a good source for healthy young, properly sexed rodents. Just don't tell them you are buying them as future breeder/feeders as some PetCo's object to that. Too bad you don't live close to me. I've tons of young, healthy rats around here. (If anyone does live in Toledo and needs start up rats for a colony just let me know, you're welcome to come pick some out. :) )

In that thread the white shelving units I use for my colony are just great. They take up very little space, are very sturdy, easy to clean, snap together without any tools and cost under $20.00. I've had one over 2 years now and the thing is like new still.

About the tubs. Do the rats ever chew through them? Since I will be living with other people and in a townhome, escaped rats is a big No No. Also, I have cats, who chase anything that moves. I would love to use tubs since they are generally easier to clean.

i used rubbermaid tubs for a long time with my rats before i got my racks. i cut out a section of the lid and secured wire mesh over it with zip ties. at first they didn't mess with it but then some of them started chewing the zip ties. i switched to metal ties and they started chewing the lid around the mesh. a few of them were so bad about it that they would chew until they had made a hole that extended out past the mesh so they could get out (they overlapped by several inches). i think you can put cayenne pepper or some other chew deterrent on any areas prone to chewing but i just switched to racks so i never tried it.

I noticed in the picture in the rat colony with little space thread, the hardwire cloth was on top of the lid. Would it make any difference if the wire was under the lid? That way it would be harder for them to chew the plastic edge left when making the hole.

Some folks actually line the edges of the cut out lid with thin metal (I'm not that handy though lol). I don't have a lot of issues with chewing out of the tubs. If they aren't overcrowded and fed sufficiently with lots to chew on they don't seem all that prone to it. Just make sure the entrance hole for the water bottle spigot is only just big enough and no bigger. Any hole will get enlarged. Occasionally I get a very bad chewer and they end up being fed off since if one starts up with the heavy chewing it tends to spread to the other rats in that tub. Very spicey hot sauce smeared in an area they are chewing at sometimes stops them but some of them I swear like the taste of the darn stuff.

As an alternative, even though they are heavier to clean, you can pick up used glass tanks for next to nothing at yard sales and some pet shops/fish stores sell off their older tanks. Then you'd never have any chewing issues. I use a combination of both tubs and tanks for our colony.

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Originally Posted by Jay_Bunny

The only problem with breeding rats is that at the moment, I have a 63gram corn snake and a very small king. The corn is on mouse hoppers and the king is on mouse pinkies. Would the corn or king be able to eat rats? I know they would not be able to eat full grown rats unless they were very small and thats months and months down the road.

I wouldn't mind rats. I think they are wonderful and I want two for pets.

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A rat pinky is quite a bit bigger than a mouse pinky. Mouse hopper size is about 3-4 day rat pinky size.....

Ooops, someone else already gave you comparisons.



I MUCH RATHER enjoy breeding the rats vs. mice. Rats don't stink NEARLY as bad, have more personality as pets and tend to be less fussy breeding/rearing. I lost 3 litters of mice b/c they ate 'em...and I've only had 2 single baby fatalities out of 10 LITTERS w/the rats. (And one was a stillborn, the other died that night). One litter of the 10 was 5, one was 7 babies, and the remaining 8 litters were 13 babies. :D MUCH easier to raise rats, but with small corns and/or baby kings, you don't need bigger prey right yet.

The king will remain on mice until he is old enough to take rat pinkies. I don't plan on breeding until I can use a majority of the litter and store away the rest.

I have someone at work who has a 3 year old rat that she wants to give me. She says she wants him to live out his days with someone who can provide him with a friend and lots of attention. I told her I'd be more than happy to. I won't ever breed him, given his age, but I think he'd make a nice pet. So I guess my first pair of rats will be males. Are they any different from females, temperment and smell wise?

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Originally Posted by frankykeno

Occasionally I get a very bad chewer and they end up being fed off since if one starts up with the heavy chewing it tends to spread to the other rats in that tub.

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that was exactly my problem--it was one of the girls in particular that chewed like crazy, but she is one of my favs so i just dealt with it. a few of the others picked up her habit and it got outta control! i could literally sit and watch her babies learning her habit too--as soon as they could reach the top of the tub while standing on their igloo they would look over to mom who was happily gnawing away and a few seconds later they'd be trying to reach an edge to taste. gah!

Yep Em rats learn from each other especially their momma's.

Wow a 3 year old rat, that's a real oldster! As far as differences in male and female rats, the males do tend to be quite lazy as they mature. I personally feel they make slightly better pets as they are more "lap rats" than the always busy females. Really though it's all about individual temperment and good care with rats. If they are healthy, well fed, handled gently and used to you being the Great God/Goddess of the Food Bowl, they generally consider you a good thing (rats are very VERY food driven). Some folks are a bit put off by an adult male rat's butt pillows though LOL.

Hahaha. Well my co-worker used to have two males. They were littermates and not to long ago, the brother died and now this old rat is all by himself. I might be getting all of his supplies along with him.

Awww poor old fellow. He's probably not going to last a lot longer but enjoy him for what time he has left. We took a very old male rat in a couple of years back. He was an old breeder male and simply huge! Nobody wanted him any longer and he was really a big old sweetheart. He was so old the pet store didn't want to put a young, hyper male in with him for company but they felt bad that he was all alone. They couldn't really sell him for a pet due to his advanced age. We took him home, gave him lots of treats and attention (we did cage him alone but gave him lots of time with us just sitting quietly). He quietly passed away in his sleep about a month or so later but we are still glad we gave the big old fellow a caring place for his last bit of life.

Thats basically what I will be doing. I can't wait till I move out and am able to get a couple of rats.