Boy is home, I am just looking for reassurance, the first couple weeks are tough!

Hey guys, I bought my snake two weeks ago but just brought him home yesterday because I was getting everything dialed in for him. I am going to explain my setup and questions as good as possible but try and bare with me. By the way this is a great site!

OK, I have a PVC cage with sliding front glass doors as you will see in the pictures below. The cage is about 3’w (maybe a little smaller) by about 18" deep and about 18"tall.

1. Hot side (not even sure if the snake thinks this is the hot side which I will get to) has a large UTH all the way to the left of the cage. The thermostat probe is taped to the bottom of the cage underneath his hide under the substrate. I have a digital thermometer based on the cool side back wall with it’s probe taped right next to the thermostat probe under the hide. I am getting a reading of 95 on the floor of the cage onder the substrate but only about 84 on top of the substrate (under his hide). I was told by Kara that the snake will burrow down under the substrate to get on that heat so my fingers are crossed, how could I second guess Kara being a first time BP owner? :D This is my biggest concern, I am hoping that as long as the bottom of the cage is reading 95 or so he will eventually use it.

2. Cool side. I was having problems bringing my ambient temps up to 80-83 using just the UTH on the hot side so I installed a Radiant Heat Panel (pro-products) on the cool side which you can see in the picture below. That brought the ambient temps right up to about 82. I have the RHP probe taped directly in the middle of the back wall of the enclosure which you can also see in the picture.

3. Temp readings. I have a digital thermometer velcroed on the side of each hide. The ambient temps on the hot side are 80.6. The ambient temps on the cool side is 83. The temp reading from within the hot side hide sits around 93 or so. Again, this probe is placed directly on the inside bottom under the hide above the UTH.


4. I know I am a little anxious here seeing I havent even had the snake home for a full 24 hours yet but I just want to know if things are normal or not, or atleast get an idea of what to look for. Last night when i brought the snake home I put him in his cage and he did what I expected him to do. He explored the enclosure sniffing around a bit. He went in the cool side hide, then the hot side hide, then back to the cool side hide which is where he’s been pretty much ever since. He did come out as soon as the lights went out last night and just sat half in his cool side hide and half on top which is under the heat panel. I am just wondering if it’s normal for him to stay on the cool side or might something be up with the hot side?

Any advice or just some good ball bython behavior feedback would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks again with any help.

Here is the tank.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...il152007-1.jpg

BP's spend the majority if their time in the hides, especially when in a new home. Larger cages make smaller BP's very insecure so expect him to hide alot. Otherwise you are good to go, ambient temps could be a little higher.

WOW! I never thought of hanging the thermometers (I have the same ones) right on the hides! That's a great idea :rockon:


as for whether or not he will burrow down to the heat..yes he will if he wants to. mine clears a little pit in the cypress under his hide all the time to get a nice comfy area.

staying on the cool side: perfectly normal as long as your temps are all good and it sounds like they are.
Here is my theory: I got a snake from NERD also, and their racks are basically a constant temp, tending toward the low end of the scale. When I brought mine home, I had a temperature gradient like yours and found that my snake for well over a month and a half stayed on the cool side all day long. he would only move to the warm side when temps dropped to abnormal lows, like after I had been messing around with the door open, or if I put a big bowl of cool water in the tank. It took him many weeks to discover that he enjoyed the hotter temps - I believe it had something to do with being raised thus far without them. Once he started 'basking' for real he kept doing it religiously. I think your snake is behaving quite normally. The fact that he explored but then settled into a hide and stayed there sounds very good actually! A happy ball python is a sleeping ball python.

Glad you got him home! looking forward to pictures after the 'hands off' week is over :carrot:

That's awesome guys.

I am sure you all remember the first few days, every ten seconds I am jumping up to check his temps and what not. He actually looks to be looking for a meal. I have been opening his cage to mist every now and then and each time I do so his head pokes out of his hide with his tongue going a mile a minute. Regardless I am going to wait until Saturday to give him his first feeding.

Even when you get your temps right I still find myself second guessing everything. :rolleyes:

Thanks again!

I still check mine constantly...not because I'm worried but because I'm in love :)

I check temps all the time, once I get my rack itll be easier, Also as far as the hot side goes, it take a long time for the substrate to heat up (esp. mulch) and depending how thick the bottom of the enclosure is.

Question, the mat itself heats to 95? or is that the bottom of the floor inside the enclosure?

If its 95 degrees inside on the floor then just remove most of the mulch in his hide.

Subzero,

The probe is on the bottom of the enclosure under his hot hide. I was just curious, it's been about 24 hours and he hasnt left the cool side which is right around 83. He seems relaxed though, he's in the hide just sitting with the tip of his nose poking out. Thanks for the help guys.

Something to note... I don't think new owners realize how often BPs are in their hides. My BP is in his hide 90% of his life. He only come out for a couple reasons.

1. When I handle him.
2. When he is hungry he will roam his cage at night. This usually is the night before feeding or after a no-feed shed, at night. Also sometimes when he only gets a smaller meal he will roam.

My BP will usually peek out of his hide when I am rustling around in my bedroom (where his house is). Sometimes when he's hungry he'll stick about 6" out in the S position and stare me down.

All the rest of the time head-hidden in the hide!

Well when I woke up this morning he was heading from his cool side hide to his hot side hide for the first time since Saturday. He went in the hot side hide for maybe two minutes and then turned around and went back to his cool hide.

My only worry is that he is finding his cool side RHP warmer than his hot side UTH which is reading 93 on the inside bottom of the cage. Time will tell I guess but he seems to be addapting well and seems pretty relaxed.

Thanks for the info/advice guys.

I think it's too early to tell since he's still settling in, but observations like this may lead you to make slight temp adjustments over time.


you could put a third hide in there somewhere in between and see if he likes that too :)

well guys, I just freaked out.

As stated above I was using an RHP to het the ambient temps to 80-83 which worked fine. The heat panel is located over the cool side hide. When I took a temp reading inside the cool side hide with my temp gun it was like 98 in there :eek: This was suppose to be the cool side!

So I immediately removed the snake and decided to try and use the RHP as the only heat source in the tank. I am at a point now where I am not sure where to place the thermostat probe for the RHP. I had it inside the hide but when the snake crawled in there it went from 84 to like 80 in about a minute. Seeing the snake is cooler I know this would give inaccurate temp readings and I don't want to cook the snake. I feel like I am at square one again after spending the past week and a half getting things setup for the boy.

Any advice on this?

I can only say what I do...which may be applicable :)

I have flexiwatt underneath, and a CHE ....BOTH on the hot side.
The thermostat I use controls both at once, running off a single temp probe which I put under the substrate on the hot side. This way my hot side never exceeds the set max temp, and the combination seems to heat the air nicely to provide the proper gradient to the cool side.

I played around quite a bit with temps and this seems to work well. I use a temp 'gun' thermometer to check spot temps inside hides and whatnot.

for clarity, my CHE is hanging from the ceiling on the hot side.

you could try moving your heat panel and controller to the hot side and you will probably have better luck with temps.
Those heat panels and CHE's are much more effective at heating the air than the Flexiwatt...they tend to overpower it completely. :)

Fish,

Thanks for the feedback. The way it's set up right now is with the RHP probe directly on top of his hide with the thermometer probe right next to it. I am getting a reading of 92 on the top of the hide where the probes are but only about 83 in the hide. The RHP is right over the hide. The ambient temp on the cool side is about 77 at the moment. I am not using the UTH at the moment but I am thinking I may have to. I think the cool side temps should warm up a little more with time. I am just really bummed that I am screwing with his cage with him here. I just couldnt beleive it when I got a 101 reading in his cool side hide. I am thinking having the RHP probe on top of his hide is not the best location, just trying to think where.

Thanks again,
Jason

I have Cleo's crib set up with a large bowl of water on the left side w/heating lamp overhead, tree and branches in the middle where thermostat is (keep at 80) and on the right side i have a underneath heating pad and his log hiding spot...at the moment we just put soil/mulch type of bedding in his crib this week - he seem like a really happy and beautiful snake.
I have had Cleo since he was a baby
now...Cleo (a ball python and) is about 3+ ft.

Fish,

Do you have a good picture of your setup? How did you suspend your probe from the roof of the enclosure seeing you have a PVC cage like myself? Well, I have been running just the RHP over his hot hide. I have the probe hanging down from the top, it's about 2.5-3" above the substrate right under the RHP by the hot hide (Kara's recomendation). I have the thermostat set at 95 and as of right now the outside of the hide is 89 and the inside of the hide is 88. The good thing is the cool side ambient temps are at 81 on the outside of the hide. Id the temps inside the hot hide don't atleast raise to 92 I am going to run my UTH with the RHP.

I think I should have this ironed out soon. It sure would be nice to be able to get everything right using just the RHP just for simplicity's sake. A picture of your setup would be great.

Thanks for all the input everyone, it's much appreciated.

~Jason

you misunderstand....my probe is down on the floor under the cypress mulch. it's on the warm side of the cage but not under a hide.

Gotcha!

What are you using for a thermostat? That would be ideal to run both the RHP and UTH off the same probe. I may look into possibly getting a Herpstat II in the next couple weeks. Until then I am just going to run the UTH to get a little extra heat underneath the hide. It was about 88 under the hide with just the RHP going so I am sure I can get a little extra with the UTH. The cool side was 81 outside the hide. So that should be OK.

What a learning experience :eek: I have only been researching everything about 3 weeks! I am already thinking about getting a pastel and I havent even had this guy for a week!

I have a Herpstat :)

I know what you mean...my mind is full of boas but I made myself promise I would wait at least a year between snake purchases to make sure I didn't go overboard :oops:

I'm an overboard sort of person normally :rolleye2:

IF you switch to a single temp controller like a Herpstat, you will have only one probe to work with. So, since your RHP is the primary heater in your setup, you will probably want to keep the probe exposed rather than putting it underneath the substrate. That way it gets the full measure of the RHP.

Hey Fish,

Everything is looking pretty good in his enclosure right now. I took a temp reading on the substrate outside of his hot side hide and it was 91-92 and the temp inside was 93. The temp inside his cool hide is 82. So things look pretty good right now and i'm starting to relax a bit. He is still staying in the cool side hide but I am willing to bet he travels over to the hot side hide at night.

I am defineatly looking into getting the Herpstat II in the next couple weeks. Thanks for all your help. I can't help but noticing how nice another enclosure would look ontop of this one ;)

NERD is just waay to close to my house and I defineatly caught the "bug" so to speak. After his first feeding I will be much more at ease with everything.

that's wonderful!
sounds like it's time to sit back and enjoy :carrot:

what day will you be feeding? I really didn't expect to enjoy feeding, but was surprised at how satisfying it was :sunny: ... you think you have the 'bug' now...wait until you get an agressive feeding response...then you will be truly itching for a room full of snakey lovin! LOL!

what town do you live in? I swear we should have a BP.net day at NERD sometime so all us 'locals' can mingle

At the very least I would think that a feeding snake is a realxed/healthy snake which is where my personal enjoyment would come from.

It's funny you mentioned that about NERD. The first time I went up there for a setup and tour Kara had mentioned that she was going to have a cookout or something to that effect. I think that would be a blast for everyone to get together. I haven't been here that long but I can already tell this will be somehwhat as a second home as I get more engulfed in snake keeping. It's funny to, when I was a kid my father would drive me up to these awesome fields in NH and I would catch some pretty damn impressive black racers and rats. Now I was about ten years old at the time and PJ's pets would give me $50 sometimes $60 for a large snake. I just loved catching any and all critters and to get paid for it was great. I saved up that money and bought a really nice 50 gallon with a nice stand and all the goodies to keep my caught critters in. All we could get here around Boston were greens, browns and garters and I knew all the hot spots. My mother would never let me get a boa or BP for whatever reason so this is just like living an old dream. And that my friend is how I got to this point looking into morphs and what not ;) It's scary to because unlike being a kid I now work for a living and can go buy more stuff should I feel like it, after the wifes approval of course.

Anyway, sorry for the biography and talk to you soon.

They will definately hide most of the time. They do explore at night it seems.. if they are constantly roving around during the daylight, I would be worried. It could mean the temps are off, or the hides are not secure enough.
Nice cage, by the way.. nifty!

Thanks Ginevive,

He seems to be OK with things and the temps are in a good range. I love the cage. It just happened to be there for sale when I went up there. Kara said that they made a few of them so I feel priveledged :D Now my only problem will be to find another one to go on top of it.