Caramel or Piebald

Im torn between the two... I dont know which one i should get for my next pet investment. What do you guys think?

I voted pied cause they are my current fav.

hmmm...that's a toss up! :confused:

I say pied :cool:

I'd go with the pied myself

Yea its so tough, There both great Morphs. Im so torn between the two

i voted for the pied because they look more appealing to me.

As much as pieds are stunning to look at there's always been a place in my heart for a really nice caramel. They were one of the first morphs I fell in love with and the Caramel Glow that Kara posted long ago...that sealed the deal for me. I want to produce my own Glow someday so if I had the cash on hand...it would be caramel all the way with me! :)

Pied all the way.

Dang... it looks like Piebald are all the rage

You can't go wrong with a nice Bell Line Caramel...They are one of my favorite Balls...

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j2.../Adampics1.jpg

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Originally Posted by Lewdogg3

Im torn between the two... I dont know which one i should get for my next pet investment. What do you guys think?

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I know at some point I will have both, but when it comes to which one first personnaly I would say Piebald

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Originally Posted by coldbloodaddict

You can't go wrong with a nice Bell Line Caramel...They are one of my favorite Balls...

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NERD line caramels are hot too!!! :sweeet: I love the purple in this boy!

http://www.8ballpythons.com/uploads/...ararmel-01.jpg

As to which is better, caramel or pied .... I say BOTH!!!

http://www.8ballpythons.com/uploads/...ararmel-02.jpg

http://www.8ballpythons.com/uploads/...ararmel-03.jpg

:D

-adam

Looking good Adam...A Caramel Pied will be HOT!

haha if only i could afford both

I really hope you see lil Carmel Pieds looking back at you from their eggs Adam!

A Carmel Pied would make my decison a whole lot easier haha

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Originally Posted by lillyorchid

I really hope you see lil Carmel Pieds looking back at you from their eggs Adam!

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That would be sweet, but they are all going to be 100% DH Caramel Pieds...

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Originally Posted by coldbloodaddict

That would be sweet, but they are all going to be 100% DH Caramel Pieds...

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quick dumb question DH for carmel and pied breed to pied makes pieds that are 66% het for carmel you would then have to beed that to a carmel thats het for pied to get a chance at carmel pieds right???

maybe KLG or Adam or Ed can pipe in here and help me out.

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Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

http://www.8ballpythons.com/uploads/...ararmel-03.jpg

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http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k1...ulke/thud1.gif :love:

Caramels rock my world! :D

If i get a 100% het carmel or piebald and breed him with my normal female what are my chances of getting pibalds or carmels?

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Originally Posted by coldbloodaddict

That would be sweet, but they are all going to be 100% DH Caramel Pieds...

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I think Allison was talking about when I get to the point of having eggs from breeding the double hets together ... I could be wrong, but I have a feeling that she's getting crazy knowledge from working for Pete ... sooo lucky!!! :love:

-adam

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Originally Posted by Lewdogg3

If i get a 100% het carmel or piebald and breed him with my normal female what are my chances of getting pibalds or carmels?

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0%... You would get 50% possible het carmel or pied.

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Originally Posted by Freakie_frog

quick dumb question DH for carmel and pied breed to pied makes pieds that are 66% het for carmel you would then have to beed that to a carmel thats het for pied to get a chance at carmel pieds right???

maybe KLG or Adam or Ed can pipe in here and help me out.

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If you breed a pair 0f 100% Double Het Caramel Pieds together there is a 1 in 16 chance you will hit on the actual Caramel Pied...

If you breed a 100% DH Caramel Pied, to a Pied the Pieds produced will be 50% het Caramel.

Hope I answered your question...

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Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

I think Allison was talking about when I get to the point of having eggs from breeding the double hets together ... I could be wrong, but I have a feeling that she's getting crazy knowledge from working for Pete ... sooo lucky!!! :love:

-adam

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Just didn't want anyone getting confused...The way the post is worded it sounds like your breeding to Co-Doms together and could produce a Caramel Pied in the first breeding...

carmel since they don't darken up as much like pieds do.

BOTH! I have always wanted a pied, though between my sis (Tigerlily) and actually seeing Adam's caramel they are super SWEET! Can't lose either way!

Love both but I have to say pied. Good problem to have though can't go wrong with either one.

I voted carmel, because it is an not so common morph. :rockon:

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Originally Posted by coldbloodaddict

That would be sweet, but they are all going to be 100% DH Caramel Pieds...

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How can you be sure that one or both of them arent het for the other trait????? You cant just by looking, so you might want to be sure before making a asumption.

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Originally Posted by piranhaking

How can you be sure that one or both of them arent het for the other trait????? You cant just by looking, so you might want to be sure before making a asumption.

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What????

What assumptions are you making???

I don't understand what point you are trying to make.

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Originally Posted by coldbloodaddict

Just didn't want anyone getting confused...The way the post is worded it sounds like your breeding to Co-Doms together and could produce a Caramel Pied in the first breeding...

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Oh no, Adam was right. Now that I look back at that comment, yes I worded that horribly wrong. My bad!

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Originally Posted by piranhaking

How can you be sure that one or both of them arent het for the other trait????? You cant just by looking, so you might want to be sure before making a asumption.

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Pretty sure those animals don't exist yet...And if that's what Adam was breeding together it would be a pretty big deal and I think he would have stated it...

High-white Pied.. one of my personal goals. But I am making myself earn one!

I voted for Pied, because if I had it to do all over again, I would do it the same way. Pied first, then Caramel. Although, I can see your dilema, as those two snakes are probably my two favorite in my whole collection.

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Originally Posted by piranhaking

How can you be sure that one or both of them arent het for the other trait????? You cant just by looking, so you might want to be sure before making a asumption.

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It is not an assumption it is genetic.

Let see if I can explain.

If you breed A Pied to a Caramel all the offsprings will be 100% DH Caramel Pieds.

DH mean Double Het, all the resulting offsprings from crossing Pied to Caramel, will look normal but will carry both genes (Pied & Caramel) whic is why they are called 100% DH Caramel Pied.

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Originally Posted by GA_Ball_Pythons

It is not an assumption it is genetic.

Let see if I can explain.

If you breed A Pied to a Caramel all the offsprings will be 100% DH Caramel Pieds.

DH mean Double Het, all the resulting offsprings from crossing Pied to Caramel, will look normal but will carry both genes (Pied & Caramel) whic is why they are called 100% DH Caramel Pied.

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The easiest way to say it is that it takes two copies be present of a recessive gene in any animal in order for that animal to show morphed. Since each parent passes half of there genetic material to their off spring all offspring of a recess. morph to normal breeding will have 1/2 the genetic material need to be morphed. This means that they are heterogeneous or Het for that morph or they carry one copy of the gene. Now in dominate and co/dominate mutations the Heterogenous animals show the mutation.

So a Double Het carries one copy of the Carmel gene and one copy of the Pied gene. To show a mutation both genes must be present. So breeding a double het to doube het is the only way to have a chance at combining the two genes.

sorry so wordy

hope this helped

thanx to this thread, im finally learning all this het and genetic talk:D

I say go with Caramel, but that is because I personally do not like pieds, I must be weird :confused:

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Originally Posted by twiztard

but that is because I personally do not like pieds, I must be weird :confused:

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Blasphemy !!!!! :banned1:


LOL :D

I voted Piebald. When I get more involved with BP's that will be my next BP.

Wow this is hard carmels have that amazing bright color but piebalds just look plain cool i have to go with piebald tho my first love.

Guys, I'm new here and I'm still learning about BP. So I think I'm entitled to ask stupid questions...here we go.

1) What's Carmel? I thought at first it's a misspell, but later I saw someone using that word again. So Carmel is different from Caramel? English(I mean American ;) ) is not my first language btw.

2) Are Caramel and Caramel Albino same thing, just different name? I think they're the same morph, but I'm not so sure.

3) Caramel carries Recessive or Co or Dom gene?

cheers!

I vote for Caramel btw, if it's the same thing as Caramel Albino.

1. You are correct... it is spelled Caramel. I admit that I'm guilty of misspelling it as well.

2. Caramel and Caramel Albino are the same thing. Many people believe it is tyrosinase-postive albinism.

3. Recessive.

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Originally Posted by hgrub

Guys, I'm new here and I'm still learning about BP. So I think I'm entitled to ask stupid questions...here we go.

1) What's Carmel? I thought at first it's a misspell, but later I saw someone using that word again. So Carmel is different from Caramel? English(I mean American ;) ) is not my first language btw.

2) Are Caramel and Caramel Albino same thing, just different name? I think they're the same morph, but I'm not so sure.

3) Caramel carries Recessive or Co or Dom gene?

cheers!

I vote for Caramel btw, if it's the same thing as Caramel Albino.

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thanks for the answers. :)

As Lawrence stated Caramel and Caramel Albino are the same thing. He also said it is thought to be Tyrosinase positive also written T+. One last name you may hear for this same mutation is Xanthic Albino. I think this one mutation has more aliases than any of the rest.

YEAH!!! caramel pied!! My dream is beganing to form

I say carmel. You dont see alot of carmels around, you see quite a few pieds.

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Originally Posted by GA_Ball_Pythons

It is not an assumption it is genetic.

Let see if I can explain.

If you breed A Pied to a Caramel all the offsprings will be 100% DH Caramel Pieds.

DH mean Double Het, all the resulting offsprings from crossing Pied to Caramel, will look normal but will carry both genes (Pied & Caramel) whic is why they are called 100% DH Caramel Pied.

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yes, it is an assumption, if you would notice what is actually being said in my post. What i said is that there is no way to know just by looking if one of the two snakes that are being bred are already het for the other trait, meaning the pair possibly being a pied het carmel being bred to a carmel, or a carmel het pied, being bred to a pied.

I just read from some thread that said Caramel was introduced in 1996. So why their price is still expensive??? I know they're recessive, but still.....

Can anyone shed some light?
PS: I'll be getting one female Caramel this weekend anyway, can't wait! :D

I love Pieds. This would definately be my choice.