African Soft Fur Rat Questions

Ok...I just saw how great Ed's babies looked and after showing my wife (who raises rats as pets..colors, dumbos, etc.) we are hooked but I have some questions.

From a feeder perspective do those of you that feed them see a stronger feeding response? Or is there a reason you feed ASF over normal rats?

They appear smaller (when full grown - seeing Ed's pictures) is this true?

Anyone know where I could get a starter colony in the Indianapolis area?

Finally are they a lot more expensive to get started with them normal rats?

Thanks so much.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by lord jackel

Ok...I just saw how great Ed's babies looked and after showing my wife (who raises rats as pets..colors, dumbos, etc.) we are hooked but I have some questions.

From a feeder perspective do those of you that feed them see a stronger feeding response? Or is there a reason you feed ASF over normal rats?

---

I have seen my BP's strike at them much quicker than rats or mice.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by lord jackel

They appear smaller (when full grown - seeing Ed's pictures) is this true?

---

I would say they are a little larger than a preggo mouse.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by lord jackel

Anyone know where I could get a starter colony in the Indianapolis area?

---

Check out: http://www.asfrats.info/index.php

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by lord jackel

Finally are they a lot more expensive to get started with them normal rats?

Thanks so much.

---

I got my first trios for about $10 a trio. I got mine in mid Dec. and all 4 of my females have had 2 large litters so far. I think 2 of them are pretty preggo again. I let them have a beather after the second round.

As you may have read, they tend to be a little more nippy than a mouse or rat. They are not much as far as a pet goes.

Just my :2cent: :rolleye2:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jbkd

Check out: http://www.asfrats.info/index.php

---

Thanks Great Info and Great Site. I found a dealer in upper Indiana so I sent him and email...hopefully will hear back soon.

Thanks

You couldn't pay me to switch my snakes from regular old rats to this ridiculous fad of ASFR. I wouldn't feel right trying to sell someone a snake that might be imprinted on them. They are not readily available at pet stores and most likely will never be.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jglass38

You couldn't pay me to switch my snakes from regular old rats to this ridiculous fad of ASFR. I wouldn't feel right trying to sell someone a snake that might be imprinted on them. They are not readily available at pet stores and most likely will never be.

---

They ARE becoming more widely available than you think friend! I'm not picking on you but don't knock what you haven't tried...and if you have tried it and it wasn't successful for you please share your experience. I am very happy with the change. I wouldn't sell any reptiles feeding on asf rats without the buyer knowing the facts but then again any of my bp's on asf rats are not for sale anyway. It hits a sore spot with me when folks try and make something "new" sound like a bad thing.

The ONLY thing I have seen nay sayers rely on to make asf rats look like poor choice is availability. This very weak assumption is further from the truth every day. Obviously there is size difference also but with my adults I have had zero issues with steady growth when feeding on asf rats.

People interested in asf rats should not be turned away until they have consumed as much info as they can so they can make their OWN decision.

*Not trying to be a jerk just passionate about the animals I work with :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TekWarren

They ARE becoming more widely available than you think friend! I'm not picking on you but don't knock what you haven't tried...and if you have tried it and it wasn't successful for you please share your experience. I am very happy with the change. I wouldn't sell any reptiles feeding on asf rats without the buyer knowing the facts but then again any of my bp's on asf rats are not for sale anyway. It hits a sore spot with me when folks try and make something "new" sound like a bad thing.

The ONLY thing I have seen nay sayers rely on to make asf rats look like poor choice is availability. This very weak assumption is further from the truth every day. Obviously there is size difference also but with my adults I have had zero issues with steady growth when feeding on asf rats.

People interested in asf rats should not be turned away until they have consumed as much info as they can so they can make their OWN decision.

*Not trying to be a jerk just passionate about the animals I work with :)

---

I have no need to try. All my snakes feed perfectly fine on regular rats. What is the purpose of breeding these animals? Its only going to cause problems for the people that buy them (snakes imprinted on them). Try getting a snake imprinted on <insert your non rat/mouse rodent here> to switch. You have every right to defend what you have chosen to work with. I just don't get the point. Most breeders don't either.

You might want a different acronym for them to. From Urban Dictionary:

ASFR



Adult Sexuality Fetish Robots

To be sexually attracted to robots. To fantasize about men or women being turned into robots. The term also includes the transformation of ones partner (or fantasy) into any solid surface material, I.E., Stone, marble, mannequins, plastic, metal, statues, artwork.

A form of roleplay.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jglass38

I have no need to try. All my snakes feed perfectly fine on regular rats. What is the purpose of breeding these animals? Its only going to cause problems for the people that buy them (snakes imprinted on them). Try getting a snake imprinted on <insert your non rat/mouse rodent here> to switch. You have every right to defend what you have chosen to work with. I just don't get the point. Most breeders don't either.

---

Dude, what's up? Thats like a mouse guy asking you why you imprinted your snakes on rats. There are plenty of breeders that feed a wide variety of rodents to animals to that do better on them. Hell, even Adam has a few snakes on mice. The ASF rats are becoming more and more available on a regular basis. As long as he is upfront when he sells them why does it matter? I will feed my breeders whatever it takes to get the best feeding response. Right now it is mostly rats and mice, but I do have a couple females (possible LTC) that might try ASF rats this summer. IF they feed on them, they will get them. I have no plans to sell those females, but if I do they will be sold as "ASF Rat Eaters".

I love ya man, but come on.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wild Bill

Dude, what's up? Thats like a mouse guy asking you why you imprinted your snakes on rats. There are plenty of breeders that feed a wide variety of rodents to animals to that do better on them. Hell, even Adam has a few snakes on mice. The ASF rats are becoming more and more available on a regular basis. As long as he is upfront when he sells them why does it matter? I will feed my breeders whatever it takes to get the best feeding response. Right now it is mostly rats and mice, but I do have a couple females (possible LTC) that might try ASF rats this summer. IF they feed on them, they will get them. I have no plans to sell those females, but if I do they will be sold as "ASF Rat Eaters".

I love ya man, but come on.

---

I think there is a difference between mice/rats and these ASF rats. Maybe I am wrong. Seems to me they are more like a Gerbil than a rat and could cause the same imprint problems that Gerbils can. I have switched many snakes from mice to rats and some that eat whichever is offered. I'm just stating my opinions on the whole thing. Whatever people choose to do is up to them...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jglass38

Seems to me they are more like a Gerbil than a rat and could cause the same imprint problems that Gerbils can.

---

Well, that is yet to be seen. I have talked to a couple people that haven't had a problem with them imprinting on them. They seem more like a cross between a rat and a mouse than a gerbil. The biggest plus for me to even try to experiment with these is the fact that they they don't outgrow the feeding size I prefer as quickly as rats do. Am I switching all my snakes over to these, no. They're just another tool in the shed. ;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wild Bill

Well, that is yet to be seen. I have talked to a couple people that haven't had a problem with them imprinting on them. They seem more like a cross between a rat and a mouse than a gerbil. The biggest plus for me to even try to experiment with these is the fact that they they don't outgrow the feeding size I prefer as quickly as rats do. Am I switching all my snakes over to these, no. They're just another tool in the shed. ;)

---

Rock on man! One man's Gerbil is another man's Rouse... :D

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wild Bill

Well, that is yet to be seen. I have talked to a couple people that haven't had a problem with them imprinting on them. They seem more like a cross between a rat and a mouse than a gerbil. The biggest plus for me to even try to experiment with these is the fact that they they don't outgrow the feeding size I prefer as quickly as rats do. Am I switching all my snakes over to these, no. They're just another tool in the shed. ;)

---

Awww..the wonders of the opinion. In this case I agree with Wild Bill. Now all I have to do is find someone to sell me some to get started with.

Jamie, I'm not sure what the purpose was for you to bring up the uh..."acronym" you found. If it was another way to put down those interested in these rats...well I don't get it. :)

Again I will reiterate the whole imprint assumption, I have offered rats or mice successfully after feeding several times using asf rats. That doesn't mean that others won't get imprint feeders but isn't just as well if they are able to get a non feeding animal to feed? Or that animal who doesn't feed well to start feeding regularly? I have experienced both of these cases myself. Again saying there is no point and that other breeders will see no point is just silly. It is NOT that difficult to track down these rodents once people collaborate. Maybe you are not raising your own rodents but I am and I am more than happy with the outcome of raising asf rats over "standard" rodents. Its been a win-win situation for me and until that changes no one can tell me I'm wrong or that there is no point.

...when people started using plastic tubs/racks for housing reptiles and keeping them individually I am willing to bet there was just as much skepticism...It will pass ;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TekWarren

Jamie, I'm not sure what the purpose was for you to bring up the uh..."acronym" you found. If it was another way to put down those interested in these rats...well I don't get it. :)

---

Nope, just an attempt to ratchet down the tension! :)

Quote:

---

Again I will reiterate the whole imprint assumption, I have offered rats or mice successfully after feeding several times using asf rats. That doesn't mean that others won't get imprint feeders but isn't just as well if they are able to get a non feeding animal to feed? Or that animal who doesn't feed well to start feeding regularly? I have experienced both of these cases myself. Again saying there is no point and that other breeders will see no point is just silly. It is NOT that difficult to track down these rodents once people collaborate. Maybe you are not raising your own rodents but I am and I am more than happy with the outcome of raising asf rats over "standard" rodents. Its been a win-win situation for me and until that changes no one can tell me I'm wrong or that there is no point.

...when people started using plastic tubs/racks for housing reptiles and keeping them individually I am willing to bet there was just as much skepticism...It will pass ;)

---

I raise my own rats and I don't see the point of ASF rats. You do and thats all that matters!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jglass38

I raise my own rats and I don't see the point of ASF rats. You do and thats all that matters!

---

A few simple points on raising the ASF rats is:

#1) they don't smell nearly as much as mice or rats!!!!!!! A big plus for me!!!:sunny:

#2) I can produce more feeders in a smaller space, compared to rats.

#3) My snakes like them better. Besides my BP's, my corns and milks like them better than large mice.

#4) They are getting more and more common in our area.I have already talked to my local pet stores about buying my extras and they want them, so they will be avail. They will spread quicker than you think.(not sure where in NJ you are) I bet there will be some frozen ones at the Hamburg show this weekend if you ask the right folks.

#5) they are closer to a mouse or rat than a gerbil.

#6) The only negative thing I find with them is they nibble a little when you handle them. For that matter, my older female rats bite me more when I take their pups.

#7) Folks that don't like change or except change get left behind. Don't knock it, till you try it.

Just my :2cent: .

:crix:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jbkd

A few simple points on raising the ASF rats is:

#1) they don't smell nearly as much as mice or rats!!!!!!! A big plus for me!!!:sunny:

#2) I can produce more feeders in a smaller space, compared to rats.

#3) My snakes like them better. Besides my BP's, my corns and milks like them better than large mice.

#4) They are getting more and more common in our area.I have already talked to my local pet stores about buying my extras and they want them, so they will be avail. They will spread quicker than you think.(not sure where in NJ you are) I bet there will be some frozen ones at the Hamburg show this weekend if you ask the right folks.

#5) they are closer to a mouse or rat than a gerbil.

#6) The only negative thing I find with them is they nibble a little when you handle them. For that matter, my older female rats bite me more when I take their pups.

#7) Folks that don't like change or except change get left behind. Don't knock it, till you try it.

Just my :2cent: .

:crix:

---

Rock on man!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jglass38

You couldn't pay me to switch my snakes from regular old rats to this ridiculous fad of ASFR. I wouldn't feel right trying to sell someone a snake that might be imprinted on them. They are not readily available at pet stores and most likely will never be.

---

110% agreeable.

I wouldn't want to risk getting my snakes stuck on ASFR and not be able to swithc them off!! Regular rats are still more readily ava. than ASFR are.

Now If you can get the whole country on them, I would try them.:P

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by stangs13

...

Now If you can get the whole country on them, I would try them.:P

---

Drat! you've unraveled my plan to take over the world!

I like the African rats. The biggest attraction is that they have very little smell. That makes breeding them easier on me :)
ALso, good point on saying you can breed them in a smaller space. These animals are smaller than a typical rat. Also, since they don't get as big as a typical rat, you don't have to worry about size issues when feeding a ball python because a full grown asf rat is the perfect size for an adult ball python. I was going to breed regular rats and wondered what I would do with retired breeders since they were so large. I couldn't feed it to my ball python...I mean, I suppose I could try but why put that stress of an oversized meal on my snake? And I certianly didn't want to waste a perfectly good rat. With African soft furs, that isn't an issue.
I was also worried about imprinting on these guys since I have a freezer full of regular rats. HOwever, I suppose I got lucky with my snake because he switches from frozen thawed to live, regular rats to asf rats with little hesitation. He is now fasting though so everything is on hold (although my rats don't know this and are STILL breeding!!!)

The only thing I don't like about asf rats is their demeanor. They are biters. I would go as far as say aggressive. You can try to coddle them from birth but they reach a certain point where the teeth come out. And yes, it hurts!

Everyone has their own opinion on the matter. Just don't say this is a fad....I don't want to hear that. I want to see this go the distance.

if they truely are better eaters on these, I would love to see it spread. I would rather my rats which are larger faster though

Ok...I found someone near Indianapolis that will sell me a trio of them...but for $50!


This seems really high to me? Can anyone "that has bought them" comment? Or better yet have another idea on how to get them?

Thanks

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jbkd

A few simple points on raising the ASF rats is:

#1) they don't smell nearly as much as mice or rats!!!!!!! A big plus for me!!!:sunny:

#2) I can produce more feeders in a smaller space, compared to rats.

#3) My snakes like them better. Besides my BP's, my corns and milks like them better than large mice.

#4) They are getting more and more common in our area.I have already talked to my local pet stores about buying my extras and they want them, so they will be avail. They will spread quicker than you think.(not sure where in NJ you are) I bet there will be some frozen ones at the Hamburg show this weekend if you ask the right folks.

#5) they are closer to a mouse or rat than a gerbil.

#6) The only negative thing I find with them is they nibble a little when you handle them. For that matter, my older female rats bite me more when I take their pups.

#7) Folks that don't like change or except change get left behind. Don't knock it, till you try it.

Just my :2cent: .

:crix:

---

Great Points....I love lists they are easy to understand and get the points.:D

If the ASF produce the giant litters, and have less smell, and all the pluses... then they will become more and more common, until the rodent industry is producing them as much as they are mice and rats. At that point you'll see a lot mroe people jump on them. At this point, a few people really like them, and use them.
I've fed a few different snakes the ASF and they eat rats afterwards just fine. I even offered my male hatchling a fuzzy ASF and he ate that, then ate reg rat pinks and fuzzies without issue. He'll eat whatever he's offered.
There is potential with these new rodents, and they may take off. If they do, there will be some people who get to say "Hey, I've had those for YEARS!" and look good.
Personally, I haven't yet seen the giant litters, and although they don't have ammonia smells like the big rats, I do note a different rank odor if you don't clean the bins. But they ALSO seem to pick a potty corner, which makes it easy to spot clean.
All only my own personal experiance.
If they start producing larger litters, I'll set up for a large colony of them. If they continue to produce so-so litters, I'll feed them all off and go back to nothing but reg rats. When I have to retire large rat breeders, I'll find someone with a big snake to trade out the rats. You give me two smalls, I'll give you one giant.
I'll talk about my own experiance with the ASF, but I'm not convinced myself yet. And the buggers BITE.
Wolfy

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by lord jackel

Ok...I found someone near Indianapolis that will sell me a trio of them...but for $50!


This seems really high to me? Can anyone "that has bought them" comment? Or better yet have another idea on how to get them?

Thanks

---

This isn't uncommon for a price in a area where they are new only a couple people have them. When I first saw them the price was $75-$100...for a trio! I thought no way these people are nuts! I got my starting group in trade as I was intrigued but still could not see dropping the cash. When I was asked originally I would tell people $30/trio and it still felt wrong! There are a few of us in MI now with them though and the price has dropped considerably even when I see others selling the at shows. You can either wait until the price drop which is usually a very steep drop or jump on them and then try and make some money back by selling some of your offspring. Most of the people I have talked to who spent the money have gotten at least some of the initial back by selling their extra's.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TekWarren

This isn't uncommon for a price in a area where they are new only a couple people have them. When I first saw them the price was $75-$100...for a trio! I thought no way these people are nuts! I got my starting group in trade as I was intrigued but still could not see dropping the cash. When I was asked originally I would tell people $30/trio and it still felt wrong! There are a few of us in MI now with them though and the price has dropped considerably even when I see others selling the at shows. You can either wait until the price drop which is usually a very steep drop or jump on them and then try and make some money back by selling some of your offspring. Most of the people I have talked to who spent the money have gotten at least some of the initial back by selling their extra's.

---

I didn't think of reselling some down the road to recoup the initial costs.

Good points...Thanks.