My python Died

I have a Ball Python( I had ), I was taking care of for my 8 year old son who does not live with me. i feel awlful. i found him dead today, i fed him, held him and made sure everything was right. I got him from a local chain pet store, he was about 1 year old. any ideas what may have gone wrong? Did I do something? :( spiritbear857

well we need basic info about your set up.

What was he kept in?
What were the temps?
What was the humidity?
What did you feed him?
How often did you feed him?

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Originally Posted by spiritbear857

I have a Ball Python( I had ), I was taking care of for my 8 year old son who does not live with me. i feel awlful. i found him dead today, i fed him, held him and made sure everything was right. I got him from a local chain pet store, he was about 1 year old. any ideas what may have gone wrong? Did I do something? :( spiritbear857

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Were his temps controlled on a t-stat so he wouldnt freeze or get cooked? Did he make any sounds of whistling or gurgling? Any more info you can give will help but a necropsy from a vet would tell you exactly what happened. Sorry for your loss.

So sorry for your loss! As Nate said...we'd need more specifics on how you had him set up to try and puzzle out why he died. Which we'll be happy to do, so you'll be more confident in getting another in the future someday, should you choose to do so.


If you followed all the pet store's directions for setting him up...it's highly likely and very unfortunate...that something may yet have been seriously lacking in his environment. Pet stores are typically woefully educated when it comes to caring for snakes.

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Originally Posted by JLC

Pet stores are typically woefully educated when it comes to caring for snakes.

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I couldn't agree more...i've spent hundreds of dollars fixing problems that the pet store created for me. It has been a wonderful learning experience however. I will say that this site has taught me the most of any i've been to. I really do appreciate all you geniuses spending the time to teach us noobs what it takes to get involved with this hobby. One day I hope to be right there beside you.

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Originally Posted by nathanledet

well we need basic info about your set up.

What was he kept in? a glass tank with a hood
What were the temps? between 78 and 82
What was the humidity?
What did you feed him? Pinkies
How often did you feed him?

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every two days

recent he started to spend alot of time in his water bowl, does thet help

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Originally Posted by spiritbear857

every two days

recent he started to spend alot of time in his water bowl, does thet help

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Did you have a thermometer in the tank?

Read the above posts and describe the setup. We will be able to help you more with that information.

I had a therm in the tank and kept the temp between 78 and 82

I had a glass tank, I have a thero in the tank, along with a water bowl and a climbing tree. a heat pad at one end under the tank and a heat lamp. Also a Florcesent tube light(Day light)

I hand held him every other day, he was feed on an every otherday schedule, his cage was cleaned once a week. he seemed ok yesterday when I had him out. but the last two days he wasn't eating. he shed about two months ago. about 1 month ago he started to spend alot of time in his water bowl too.

Well, considering that ball pythons need a basking spot of at last 92-94 degrees, there are a bunch of things that can go wrong with their health when they are too cold.

Another thing is, that you fed him every 2 days? Thats way to much!! You were suposed to feed him every 4-7 days. With a 2 day MINIMUM digestion period before handling. What did you feed him.

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Originally Posted by spiritbear857

I had a therm in the tank and kept the temp between 78 and 82

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78 IMO is too low. 82 Should have been the absolute lowest for the cool side and a high of 88-90 for his warm side. Did the room get really cold at night?

yes, I am afraid so, it did get cold at night

with that tho of temps and thta much food he probally couldent digest quickly enuf and died from ehtier extreme bodily stress or the food rotted in his stomach and spread throught killing him

Okay folks let's not jump on this person too hard here. Hon did the pet store tell you that those temps and that feeding schedule were how you were supposed to take care of this snake? Unfortunately those temps and the almost constant digestion process probably didn't help the snake any. How long did you have it before it passed away? You were feeding it pinks? mice pinks or rat pinks? Is this what the pet store said to feed it?

Most important thing is does your child know and is he okay. It's awful the snake has passed but worse that he will be upset by this. I just went through losing our son's snake (it escaped due to my own carelessness) so I know how awful you must feel.

But wouldn't the heat pad have kept him warm enough?

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Originally Posted by spiritbear857

But wouldn't the heat pad have kept him warm enough?

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If there's too much cold it's hard for the heat to stay at a steady temp. Best thing to do is get a space heater that has a t-stat to shut off at a certain degree. Don't feel too bad about this. These sorta things happen and we all live and learn. I think more pet store should be more informed about the pets they carry so if someone needs info they can be of help, and not cause trouble.

If the temps were between 70 and 80 then no, these snakes orginated in Africa, so its warm there. You wont be introuble, so you can tell us everything, its the only way to learn.

I do Feel awlful that MY carelessness killed it, MY SON DOES NOT KNOW AS HE DOES NOT LIVE WITH ME. HE WOULD BE DEVISTATED IF HE DID , he will not be returning to stay with me until simmer. ,HE IS SUCH AN ANIMAL LOVER LIKE HIS DAD. I was not aware that you only feed them every 7 days. he was being feed small pinkies. and I was not aware about the temp either.

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Originally Posted by spiritbear857

But wouldn't the heat pad have kept him warm enough?

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Ball pythons require specific basking and ambient temperatures. They need a hot spot of 92-94 to properly digest their food and an ambient temperature of 82-84 everywhere else in the cage.

Temperatures lower than this can cause stress, upper-respitory infections, etc.

If your ambient temperatures were dropping down to the mid to low 70s at night, there is no way that your heat pad would have been able to maintain the right tempertures for the snake.

Not trying to be mean or anything...I think it's obvious that you didn't have access to good information prior to coming here. Do some research - you're in the right place - if your son decides he wants another and you'll probably have better success next time. Go check out the caresheet, that should answer a lot of your questions.

First sorry for yur loss

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Originally Posted by spiritbear857

I had a therm in the tank and kept the temp between 78 and 82

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I would suspect RI

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Originally Posted by spiritbear857

every two days

recent he started to spend alot of time in his water bowl, does thet help

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I would also suspect might infestation, and stress due to the lack of hides, overfeeding.

I am afraid it is likely a combination of everything that killed him.

I am not sure you are planning on getting another BP for your son but if you do you need to do a lot of researches and the best place to start is here http://www.ball-pythons.net/modules....warticle&id=59 because a pet store is not the place to get an animal from nor to get advice on husbandry.

Anyway if you really want to know what killed him for sure I would suggest a necropsy by an herp vet

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Originally Posted by GA_Ball_Pythons

First sorry for yur loss



I would suspect RI

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Yep. I think so too.

Thank you all so much for answering some of my questions. I will check the care sheet and keep coming back to help our next snake have a better chance.

Hon I just went through this with my 5 year old (who has still not accepted that the snake that escaped is likely passed away by now *sigh*) In the end it's best if you talk to your son and tell him the truth and let him vent out his anger and sorrow. It's happened and most likely due to the pet store not properly informing you on care and you not understanding that more research needed done on these exotic type pets. You unfortunately found BPNet too late for this snake but what's done is done. All you can do now is learn from this awful experience. You and your son (assuming he has computer access) could make a project of learning together about proper ball python care. Then at some future point you could go together next summer and get a new snake when you are both better able to care for one.

Nothing is going to make this right but I know as a parent I had to face it too and it's not easy but it's a learning experience (even though a tough one). Your son will experience loss in his life...grandparents, a friend moving, etc....you can use this experience to help him learn that mistakes happen, bad stuff happens, we face it and we learn from it.

I'm really sorry about your loss. I guess the best thing to do now is just see what might have went wrong and go from there. There's alot to learn about these snakes and this is a good place to start. If anything be weary of what the petstores tell you. There's alot of misleading information that they will tell you...

back to the original topic though, Again I'm sorry about you and your son's loss. Maybe you could go ahead and check out the caresheet on the site, gain a little bit more knowledge and give it a go again... :)

Best of luck to you in whichever route you go. ;)

First off, I'm so so so sorry for your's and your son's loss. If you're gonna give it another go please go with a well known breeder, it will cost a little more than a pet store but it is more than worth it!!!!! When I got my bp she was covered in mites and very large scars (my guess is from fights with other snakes, she was in a 5 gl tank with at least 15 other snakes) she still has the largest one on her belly a year later. He told me my female was a male and when I asked what she ate he said frozen fuzzies, I said you mean f/t he said that I didn't NEED to thaw them! Most pet stores , that I've seen, don't have the proper temps, humidity, hides (if any), and knowledge to care for such a fragile animal. Again I'm so very sorry for your loss and I hope your son will be ok. Good luck

I am sorry about your family's loss; it could have been a pre-existing condition..
I liked what Steve said a few posts back:
"Back to the original topic though, Again I'm sorry about you and your son's loss. Maybe you could go ahead and check out the caresheet on the site, gain a little bit more knowledge and give it a go again... "

I'm sorry for your loss. I lost a snake after only having it for one week due to existing conditions, and I cried a lot :(
I think the thing to do in this case is to tell your son. If he is a major animal lover, it's probably best he learn early that his pets will die, his pets need specific care, and that the petstore rarely correctly informs you about specific care.
It's important for you and your son to know that pet stores frequently have low-quality, unhealthy snakes and will push to sell a snake they know is unhealthy or unfit for the person looking to buy it. Do not feel like it is only your fault.
That being said, now you're at a new beginning. If you stick arond here and read a lot and ask a lot of questions you'll learn what you need to know in no time flat! You can get started with a well-bred snake that wasn't stolen from a nest in Africa, wasn't sent over in a shipping crate and wasn't improperly cared for.
I hope you still get another snake after this sad experience. Snakes are a joy to keep and a great pet for an 8 year old!

This might sound awful, but:

When's the last time your son saw the snake? If it's been awhile, and he's not due to see it again until the summer, then you can get another and he'll likely be none the wiser. If you see a snake every day, then you can tell the difference, but for kid that goes months without seeing it, well...

That said, ONLY get another snake if you can afford to care for it properly. You don't say where you live. If it's in the Midwest or northern climes, be prepared for substantial utility bills to keep the snake healthy and alive. By substantial, I mean a minimum of $50 extra per month in the wintertime to keep a space heater running. You can't skimp on this: If it's cold outside, the undertank heating pad and any other heat source for the tank alone won't be enough. At a minimum, you'll need to keep the room at 75 degrees, 24/7. Figure on doing this for 20 winters or so, because that's how long ball pythons live.

If you can afford the utility bills, the next step is a proper enclosure. There are excellent care sheets on this site that describe exactly what you'll need. Figure on spending at least a couple hundred bucks. DO NOT SKIMP on stuff like thermometers and thermostats and humidity gauges. That would be like putting you in the middle of North Dakota in the winter with no source of heat, or in the middle of the Arizona desert in July with no way to cool down. Heat, a way to measure it and a way to measure humidity are not luxuries, they're critical. And if you try going without, you're guilty of animal cruelty/neglect. It really is that simple.

I don't mean to be harsh or to scare you away, but keeping snakes is an expensive undertaking that requires a much longer commitment than keeping a dog or cat. If you're prepared, great. Ignore everything a pet shop tells you and come here for advice on what to do and buy. Do that, and you'll have a healthy pet for many years to come.

But...

If you are not prepared to keep a reptile, then please don't get another snake. Acquiring the animal itself is, by far, the cheapest and easiest part of the endeavor--you can usually get them for free on craigslist or from the local want ads, evidence that a lot of folks don't know what they're getting into when they get a snake. Don't be one of those people.

Very sorry to hear about the loss of your son's snake. :(

Anyway(even though everyone else has pretty much covered it,) I would reccommend doing your research before looking into buying a new snake. What you should do is tell your son: it's important for kids to learn about death and loss, because not telling him and then him possibly finding out later could end up being worse than telling him right away.

Good luck on events to come! :yes:

I am SOOOO sorry for your loss. :( :(

It is heart-breaking when we have to face our own sorrow and our children's at the same time. As someone suggested, I would be sorely tempted to fix the environment, get another snake, and hope he doesn't notice...

But in the end I wouldn't do it. I believe it's important to be honest with our children so that they will always know they can trust us. And I also believe it's important for children to learn to deal with grief and sorrow. We all hope sorrow is a lesson they'll learn later rather than earlier, but the fact is that it is part of life, and what will help our children more than shielding them is teaching them to grieve and then live again.

I love the idea that you could make a project of learning more about them together and preparing a good, healthy environment for your snake. What a learning opportunity for your son!

About your loss--it is human nature to blame ourselves when we suffer loss. There is always more we could have done. But if we didn't make mistakes we wouldn't be human. No one is perfect. You expected that the pet store would know how to care for your pet, and you followed their instructions. Sure, you could have done more research, but, again, we all make mistakes.

And you are demonstrating something much more important than perfection--the willingness and desire to learn and grow and do better next time. So pat yourself on the back for that and move forward.

I look forward to hearing more about your adventures back into the snake world--or not, if you decide it's not what you want/are able to do. Either way, :hug:

Blessings,

Heather

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Originally Posted by spiritbear857

I have a Ball Python( I had ), I was taking care of for my 8 year old son who does not live with me. i feel awlful. i found him dead today, i fed him, held him and made sure everything was right. I got him from a local chain pet store, he was about 1 year old. any ideas what may have gone wrong? Did I do something? :( spiritbear857

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I'm sorry to hear that ur sons python died. Many folks here have given you reasons on why this may have happened so I will not elaborate further on it. I will however give you some tips for future purchases.

Make sure that you have your enclosure and environment established before purchasing another bp. Many new comers and other experienced members prefer to house their animals in glass aquariums. This gives them the means to make an aesthetically pleasing display, if only for themselves.

Make sure that you select the right size tank for your new snake, may it be a juvi or an adult. A baby or a juvenile will be fine in a ten gallon. An adult will need a 36"x18"x12” enclosure to live "comfortably" in.

You will need to provide adequate heating for you ball python to thrive successfully. The preferred means of heating a tank or a plastic tub is through the bottom, or belly heat as it's known. A UTH(Under Tank Heater) or Flexwatt will provide you with the means of successfully accomplishing this task.

Now that you have the means to provide heat, you have to control the out put. Successful breeders recommend that you provide a hot side ranging from 92-94F, and a cold side in the range of 82-84F. These temperatures have to be measured using a reliable digital thermometer. Do not use any of the dial shaped junk that the stores sell. These are prone to some serious errors and you cannot afford to guess temperatures.

Control the out put of your UTH using Thermostats. Without using one, ur temps can sky rocket and "cook" ur snake. If you are interested in purchasing flexwatt and a thermostat, I would recommend http://www.reptilebasics.com

If the room in which you house your snake gets cold, then there is no way that a tiny heater can provide the correct ambient temperatures. If that is the case, then you have to invest in a space heater to keep the ambient temps of the tank at a minimum 80F.

When you have established the current temperatures, you have to turn your attention towards humidity. A correct humidity is important for your ball pythons overall health and well being. It's recommended that you keep ur humidity constantly between 50-60%. If you are using a digital thermometer like Acurite, then you have the means to measure humidity as well.

It's hard to maintain proper humidity in a glass tank, especially with a ventilated top. Covering a screen top most of the way with plastic wrap, Plexiglas, or clear contact paper will help keep ur humidity at the desired levels. If this does not work, try using a bigger water dish and place it at close proximity to the heat source to get the range you desire. Misting at regular intervals help as well.

For detailed examples on how to setup a tank check out the following link.
Glass tank setups

Next thing to worry about is substrate. It can be something as simple as using newspaper/paper towels or decorative as aspen, cypress, reptibark, or carefresh bedding. Do not use cedar or pine under any circumstances. The oils found in these can be harmful to your bp. If you are using colorful substrate, make sure that you clean and replace it regularly. Failure to do so can lead to bacterial and fungal growth which in turn can cause a host of health problems for your ball python.

You have to provide your ball python "hide boxes." In the wild, these creatures are found living in tight little burrows. Hence it's only natural for them to want to feel secure in a captive environment. Don't waste your money with the hides found at the pet stores. These are too big and too open for your ball pythons "tastes."

Get the little pans that come with the bottom of pots and use those instead. Just make sure to knock a hole on the side or on the top. What ever you use, just remember that balls like to be touched from all sides. This is a very critical aspect of your husbandry, and you should provide a minimum of two hides for your snake; one on the cool side and one on the hot side.

Now that you have most of ur enclosure setup you are ready to get ur next snake. I would recommend that you buy a captive bred and born animal from a reputable breeder. The following come highly rated in no particular order.

http://www.8ballpythons.com/
http://www.newenglandreptile.com/
http://www.joecompelreptiles.com/
http://www.ralphdavisreptiles.com/

Feeding your bp an appropriate sized meal is very important. There has and continues to be debates on this issue. The consensus among many breeders and enthusiasts is to feed a prey item(mouse or rat) slightly smaller than the girth of your snake. The frequency of feedings should be limited to once every seven days.

You can feed inside or outside of the enclosure. Some folks fear that feeding inside the enclosure will make ur snake "think" that it is feeding time every time you open the cage. This is far from the truth as long as you interact with your snake on a regular basis. That said however, it's your personal choice.

Be prepared to take you ball python for regular vet checkups. These creatures are really good at masking symptoms of illness. Unless you are adept at recognizing those symptoms, your snake could be very ill by the time you get it to a vet. Therefore regular vet visits are highly recommended. I hope this has been helpful and please don't hesitate to ask further questions should any arise.

Before I forget, several of our prominent members are also enthusiast breeders. I would recommend buying from them any day. Just frequent our "inquiries" section or ask around to find out more. :D