Thought I'd see what people think

Let me set this up by saying a few months back we purchased a 100% Het Orange Ghost BP from a breeder at a Herp show. The guy we bought it from said he had paperwork for it but did not have it with him and he would send it to us asap. A month went by with no paperwork so Sean emailed him and never recieved a response. Sean emailed a somewhat nasty email to him about how disappointed he was with the way he was doing business. Noting also the many negative feedback testimonials on the guys webpage. This was the response he recieved.


That was my dad that sold you the ball. I ( Zach- Zach Currie Reptiles ) do not deal with any ball pythons mainly larger pythons, anacondas, and a few colubrids. I actually don't even own 1 ball. I know my dad talked to a guy last week about getting the paperwork, he has had to track it down but we know who bred it. Feel free to call him at **********, his name is Phil. As far as ruining my name I see no point in that but if you want go ahead, it will not hurt my business one bit. I have plenty of satisfied customers who will back up my name if anyone ever has any questions, because honestly, I am one of the best to deal with. That was my purpose in putting up my Testimonial page on my site, which has plenty but hasn't even been updated in 3 months so there are plenty more. Your last e-mail , I forwarded to him so I don't know if you got a response or not. But you cannot intimidate me , and I am sure you may think you can put a "Sting" but I know too many people in the reptile community and reptile business that I deal with profesionally and honestly every week so you can do no damage to my business but like I said I am not the one you need to talk to.


Am I out of line to think that this is no way to do business as a professional breeder? I believe a simple appology would have been in better taste.

In my mind, it looks like he's trying to defend himself after he or his "dad" made a mistake. Not something I look for in a quality reptile breeder.

IMO you shouldn't have to have any kind of trouble contacting your seller. This is annoying and causes a lot of undue stress, whether the genetics are true about the snake or not.

so did you call phil?

Sounds like to me you bought a normal. I would never buy a snake from someone who said he "does not have the paper work with him". That would send up big red flags for me. Was it a male or a female you bought?

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Originally Posted by recycling goddess

so did you call phil?

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Although it sounds like the start of a goose chase I would at least put forth the effort call "Phil" who knows maybe he is telling the truth!

Otherwise, another lesson learned about purchasing. If you don't feel you can trust the person...even if you think you can, demand paperwork up front. A quality hard working breeder is not likely to "forget" paperwork like that if they really expect to make the sale.

especially with hets. since you can't visually see what they are packing... i would only purchase one from a respected and reputable breeder. ;)

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Originally Posted by Colorful Balls

Am I out of line to think that this is no way to do business as a professional breeder?

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What would make you call some moron sitting behind a table at a reptile swap a "professional breeder"?

I think the way this person "does business" is pretty typical of the majority of people that set up tables at shows ... there are definitely some great people selling animals at shows, but unless you know who they are BEFORE you go to the show, you're rolling the dice.

Hope this helps. :sunny:

-adam

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Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

there are definitely some great people selling animals at shows, but unless you know who they are BEFORE you go to the show, you're rolling the dice.

Hope this helps. :sunny:

-adam

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I couldn't agree more! Whenever there's a show locally, I print the vendor list about a week before the show, and start researching on the BOI. I sort of grade them 1-3. 1's are people who have favorable BOI threads and who I am somewhat familiar with. 2's are people who don't have any reputation on BOI and 3's are those with a history of bad transactions on the BOI.

I will only do business with the 1's. Usually there are only 3 or 4 "1's" (for me) of people I will consider buying from.

Occassionally, I'll get to the show and there will be a vendor that I'm already familiar with (like Ballroom Pythons South) that wasn't on the vendor list, but was very familiar with their quality, who I'd also buy from.

And just a personal thing for me, I ALWAYS pass from a vendor who has a ton of babies in one small display tank. I don't see the balls, I see nothing but potential parasite or sickness.

Basically a lot of words to say - anytime you go to a local reptile show, it's always good to have done your homework, not just on how to care for your new pet, but also of the vendors who will be showing.

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Originally Posted by rabernet

I couldn't agree more! Whenever there's a show locally, I print the vendor list about a week before the show, and start researching on the BOI. I sort of grade them 1-3. 1's are people who have favorable BOI threads and who I am somewhat familiar with. 2's are people who don't have any reputation on BOI and 3's are those with a history of bad transactions on the BOI.

I will only do business with the 1's. Usually there are only 3 or 4 "1's" (for me) of people I will consider buying from.

Occassionally, I'll get to the show and there will be a vendor that I'm already familiar with (like Ballroom Pythons South) that wasn't on the vendor list, but was very familiar with their quality, who I'd also buy from.

And just a personal thing for me, I ALWAYS pass from a vendor who has a ton of babies in one small display tank. I don't see the balls, I see nothing but potential parasite or sickness.

Basically a lot of words to say - anytime you go to a local reptile show, it's always good to have done your homework, not just on how to care for your new pet, but also of the vendors who will be showing.

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good advice, i started searching the BOI a few nights ago for vendors that will be at the show here next month

If you find someone at the show vending that you didn't look up on the BOI, you can also ask around. Ask the event organizer or other breeders if "so-n-so" has vended here for many years and if he is good to do business with. Most vendors or regulars at the shows know who is who, and can tell you who is honost and legit.

When it comes right down to it though, buying hets is always a little risky unless you know the breeder. I personally wouldn't even buy hets from someone unless it was directly from the breeder who was signing the paperwork, unless I got the paperwork first and contacted the breeder and got the information confirmed.

I will also avoid anyone selling hets on their table if they don't have any visible morphs there. An example would be at a past Manchester NH expo, one year there was someone there with a bunch of inexpensive pied ball hets, albino hets, etc.. Nothing else.. just a table full of normal looking "hets". No thanks, I'm all set. :P

Rick

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Originally Posted by SiscoReptiles

If you find someone at the show vending that you didn't look up on the BOI, you can also ask around. Ask the event organizer or other breeders if "so-n-so" has vended here for many years and if he is good to do business with. Most vendors or regulars at the shows know who is who, and can tell you who is honost and legit.

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Show organizers won't throw bad guys under the bus because they want their money ... if a vendor is shady and the guy running the show lets them set up, he's certainly not going to steer business away from them ... the show organizer wants vendors to keep showing up so they want them to make money.

As far as asking other vendors ... many of the people that do shows see each other week in and week out on the "show circuit" ... they have to deal with each other every single week and even if they don't agree with each others business practices, unless there's a chance to steal a sale, they won't talk too much smack about each other ... it's "show code".

My $.02.

-adam

I suppose the 'show code' is different there than here.

In NH or ME there are vendors who, if they don't like the way other vendors conduct themselves, will indeed inform you who is honost and who has been hassled by customers at previous shows.

If you ask around you can get a pretty good idea if you can put any trust in a vendor.

Rick

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Originally Posted by SiscoReptiles

I suppose the 'show code' is different there than here.

In NH or ME there are vendors who, if they don't like the way other vendors conduct themselves, will indeed inform you who is honost and who has been hassled by customers at previous shows.

If you ask around you can get a pretty good idea if you can put any trust in a vendor.

Rick

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When I used to do the Manch Vegas (Manchester, NH) show, the majority of the vendors took care of their own ... thats one of the many reasons I don't set up for shows anymore ... the view from the "inside" can be an ugly one at times ... As far as show organizers letting you know who the shady people are ... LOL .. Does Bruce allow shady vendors to even setup at the NH show? :sweeet:

-adam

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Originally Posted by SiscoReptiles

I suppose the 'show code' is different there than here.

In NH or ME there are vendors who, if they don't like the way other vendors conduct themselves, will indeed inform you who is honost and who has been hassled by customers at previous shows.

If you ask around you can get a pretty good idea if you can put any trust in a vendor.

Rick

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who's to say these vendors aren't just saying things to make others look not so good in an attempt to get you to look & possibly buy from them?