What do you use to heat your aquarium?

I'm very close to purchasing a new, gorgeous juvenile BP. The last thing on my list before picking the little guy up is perfecting the temperatures in the aquarium.

I previously used this tank for a milksnake which required lower temperatures, for which a large heating pad on the underside of half of the tank would suffice. However, for my BP I'm going to need to raise the temperature on the warm side about 10 to 12 degrees.

I layered the netting of the lid with duct tape and and tin foil as the tutorial showed, but those temps. are just not reaching what they need to be! (I live in Seattle, and our winter this year is chilly.)

What is one more step I can take to heat this puppy up? (Purchase/homemade/whatever)

Thanks!

What type of substrate are you using?

Do you need to increase your warm side temps, cool side temps or both?

we had no problem with a UTH when we had our 55 gallon, 30 gallon and 30 gallon feeder tank.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by tigerlily

What type of substrate are you using?

Do you need to increase your warm side temps, cool side temps or both?

---

I'm using aspen.

I really need to increase the temps. of the entire tank, but primarily the warm side. But I'm thinking that increasing one side will regulate a higher temperature throughout both areas, anyways.

The thermometer on the warm side says about 75 degrees...

We have really cruddy, cheap Petco thermometers and humidity readers (with a flimsy needle). I know, I know. Don't scold me -_- I will invest in digital readers tomorrow afternoon and give an update!

what size is your aquarium?


maybe you can add a heat lamp with a lower wattage bulb with the heat tape
or
add a heat lamp and remove the heat tape
or maybe get stronger heat tape if this one is not upping it to the proper temps

just some ideas

give us more info

You may need to thin the aspen, as it traps the heat. When I used it, I had to fluff it periodically. It does look lovely, but requires a bit more maintenance.

As for measuring temps.... don't stress about temps until you can accurately measure them. I'd REALLY recommend getting that digital thermometer asap. :gj:

Just go to Wal-Mart and get an Accu-Rite, it's about 12 bucks....and reads temp. and humidity.
With our 55, after we foiled half and then Gorrila Taped the whole thing except for a round spot for our CHE (cheramic heat element) , it was tall to we had trouble getting the heat right with just the UTH (under tank heater)

I will trying thinning out the aspen a bit. I was used to having it thick for a burrowing milksnake.

I believe my tank is a 20 gallon. It's about 30" long and about 12.5" in height and width.

https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/fil.../20galtank.JPG

What does a ceramic heat element look like/function like?

I use a UTH on the warm side and a 50W red bulb on the cool side to keep the ambient temp up....otherwise the ambient temp drops below 75 degrees.....my thermostat is connected to the UTH and I have a rheostat connected to the red light so that I can adjust the ambient temp depending on the temp of the room. It seems to be working very well. I have covered 2/3 of the screen with foil and left an opening near the light for ventilation.....I'm concerned about the ventilation in the tank, if you cover the entire screen except for the opening where the light goes.....anyone else wonder about this???Or is it just meworrying for nothing?? :)

In my 30 gallon breeder, I have a zoomed UTH(forgot the size). For my custom enclosure, I use an exoterra(i think the 11x10). For my hatchling tub I use some off brand that was on sale. When I do my rack I will be using 11" flexwatt and I have a free shelf that I got from work that I plan to use for quarantining and will use 3" flexwatt

i use zoo med UTH for all 3 tubs

Well, for my aquariums, I use water heaters... ;)


But for my snakes' enclosures(tubs), I use flexwatt on thermostats.

1.) get an actual UTH, I might be wrong but it sounded like your using a human heating pad?
2.) get a thermostat so you can control exact temp.
3.) I recommend a space heater for ambient temps, but since you did the duct tape thing, you can also do the heat lamp like on the tutorial.

Heres a link with a good heater and thermostat:
http://www.mgreptiles.com/WOW.html

Where do you have the probe placed for your themometer?

Where are you measuring the temps at? The air temp in the rest of the aquarium, while important, is NOT as important as the temperature on the floor of the cage right over the heat pad. Using a heating pad to raise the temps of the entire aquarium will most likely result in the floor of the aquarium being TOO hot even to the point of potentially burning your snake. What kind of thermometer are you useing to measure the temperature, and where in the tank is it situated?

Mark

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SatanicIntention

Well, for my aquariums, I use water heaters... ;)


But for my snakes' enclosures(tubs), I use flexwatt on thermostats.

---

took the words right outta my mouth. i thought this thread was about fish tanks! :rofl:

Sorry, name of the thread is kind of misleading... >_>

Ohk, lots of questions to answer! Thanks for all the care and replies, guys. I can't wait to get an actual BP (TODAY!) and be a real part of the community ^_^

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MarkS

Where are you measuring the temps at? The air temp in the rest of the aquarium, while important, is NOT as important as the temperature on the floor of the cage right over the heat pad. Using a heating pad to raise the temps of the entire aquarium will most likely result in the floor of the aquarium being TOO hot even to the point of potentially burning your snake.

---

I am using this Zoo Med Repti-Therm UTH (Not a human heat pad, lol Griggs)
http://www.petco.com/Assets/product_...761230008B.jpg
http://www.petco.com/Shop/petco_Prod...lyID_6353.aspx

It doesn't have any way to regulate the temperature of it... just plug it in. When I put my hand on the bottom of the tank (inside) it's not so hot that I have to pull away after a few seconds, but it's still hot. Should I put a piece of cloth or a towel over the bottom of the tank to help?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MarkS

What kind of thermometer are you useing to measure the temperature

---

I am using a low-ned Kritterz Hi-Range Habitat Thermometer that changes color with the heat. It's mounted in the top left corner of the wall (hot side)
http://www.petco.com/Assets/product_...258358079B.jpg
http://www.petco.com/Shop/petco_Prod...lyID_6452.aspx

and the humidity reader is right next to it. Right now it's showing about 80% humidity, but I've knocked the little needle a couple of times O_o

http://www.petco.com/Assets/product_...258369048B.jpg
http://www.petco.com/Shop/petco_Prod...lyID_8193.aspx

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MarkS

and where in the tank is it situated?

Mark

---

It's situated in the corner of my room... under a window... Ohhh, got it. >_>

I glad I'm doing this all ahead of time. <_<

^^ That is like, the sucker kit from Petco. Everyone who knows little to nothing about snakes are lied to, cause even the employees know nothing about animals.:P My brother bought all that worthless junk which he is now stuck with, because the reciept is outdated.... You should definitely buy a thermostat. If you don't, the UTH will more than likely burn the snake. I would go with the Ranco cause they are pretty good. Since you are only heating one cage, then I would buy another under tank heater, but then you will have to get another Thermostat, or one capable of controlling two different outputs. I like Exo-terra UTHs cause it is made just like flexwatt.. I would probably wait and get all this stuff first, and then the snake,but you can do what you want!!
:rockon:

Ditch that thermometer and go to wal mart and get an Accurite thermometer. It is usually either in the garden section or in the section with A/C thermostats. It is only like $12 and measures temps at 2 places and measures humidity. For that heater, measure your temps and then if it is too hot, add more bedding on top of it until you can find a dimmer.

*shunned*

No, I know. It's bad. But all this was given to me on a whim when I agreed to take care of someone's snake for a few months.

I get off of school in a few hours, and I'll hit up the local Walmart. :P

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HelloSonya

*shunned*

No, I know. It's bad. But all this was given to me on a whim when I agreed to take care of someone's snake for a few months.

I get off of school in a few hours, and I'll hit up the local Walmart. :P

---

no problem. If you can, remember to look for a dimmer while you are there.

How exactly would a dimmer work? The UTH I have is just a single cable that plugs into an outlet.

They have lamp dimmer's that you can plug that heat mat into. A dimmer isn't the best solution, but it's WAYYYY better than leaving it unregulated. Remember you're body temp is around 98 so if it feels warm to you, it's problably in the 100 degree range.

Also be sure to measure temps at the floor level. There's no sense measuring temps way at the top, since the snakes doesn't spend much time up there. ;)

I use flexwatt hooked to thermostats

If the room your herp is in stays a constant temperature, a dimmer is okay for now. I used dimmers for 4 months and still continue to and my temps stay stable. If I am not mistaken, Genevive uses dimmers on each individual tub in her rack.

Dimmers are quite alright, some of the big breeders prefer them to thermostats because they have a "built-in night drop" so to speak. The rheostat (dimmer) that I have is a basic one that only handles 150 watts from a maximum of 3 sources. That means that it's good for one UTH (<25W depending on size) and say a 100W red bulb or CHE. Or you could put it on a series of cages/tubs with heat tape (also low wattage). You plug the heater into the rheostat and plug the rheostat into the wall. I have a 20g with a 75W red bulb and creates ambient temps of 75-95 alone. Consider putting the lamp on the opposite side from the UTH, and turn the heater low enough to maintain adequate cool side temps.

You need something to regulate the UTH, mine get to 100+ degrees and the snakes just aren't that smart.... They will get under whatever substrate you choose and will be touching that hot spot.

Also know that the strip thermometers are influenced by outside temps, so they show a lower reading than it actually is. Besides having a good thermometer, also watch your snake to see where he sits. If he's on the warm side all the time, your temps are probably still too low.

Aspen is incredibly insulating, I use it too. If you need to, switch to newspaper or paper towels- they won't trap the heat as much.

Put the cage along an inside wall, to avoid fluctuating temps and direct sunlight which could cook your snake.

I sympathize with you- I'm in Canada and it's November, the UTH are just not cutting it. Humidity is another issue. The lamps eat up humidity (<30%) so plan to address that when shedding comes around, with soaks/misting or a moist hide.

Good luck and keep asking questions! I can't wait to see the new baby!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sadie

Dimmers are quite alright, some of the big breeders prefer them to thermostats because they have a "built-in night drop" so to speak.

---

Which 'big breeders' are you talking about? I have never heard of a 'big breeder' prefering dimmers over a thermostat.....

And most prefer thermos not only bc of night drop but also because it keeps temps more stable

I used to live in Tacoma, and whoever said you're going to need a space heater to boost the ambient temperature in the room is dead-on right. Here in Central Illinois, where the temperature now (40s at night) isn't as low as what you're going to get in Seattle, I've found there's no way to get the temperature AND humidity right without heating the room hotter than the rest of the house. Even with the duct tape and foil covering described in the sticky. Even with two UTH's. A heat emitter will get the heat up OK, but suck the humidity down to 30 percent or lower in a heart beat, no matter how much you mist.

Your set-up looks really good, but, again, it's not going to make it without heating the room to 75 or so--signficantly warmer than most Pacific Northwest homes in the winter time. It's going to cost you in heating bills, but keeping reptiles isn't free. Better that than paying a vet to cure a respiratory infection. If you can't get the temps and humidity right, don't get the snake. Isn't fair to the animal.

Once you get the room temperature to 75 minimum, you should be able to get the rest of the way with under tank heaters. Try coconut fiber for substrate, which requires misting once or twice a day to ensure proper humidity. Good luck.

We have some extra space heaters so I'll plug one in tonight and see if that helps. Aside from the snake, I should be using one by now anyways. Summer was hot as heck, and now winter is coooold. Seems like the temperatures have dropped overnight!

I am also going to move the terrarium away from the window. I bet that will really help.

Btw, I didn't end up buying the BP today. I want to make sure I get these temps. pretty close to nailed first.

Thanks for all the great advice and ideas. I will keep updating!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HelloSonya

Btw, I didn't end up buying the BP today. I want to make sure I get these temps. pretty close to nailed first.

---

that's what i did as well. got everything ready (with the help from this forum) and then went and picked up dexter... much better than having the snake and then trying to figure out what to do. ;)

good decision!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HelloSonya

Btw, I didn't end up buying the BP today. I want to make sure I get these temps. pretty close to nailed first.

---

Where's a standing ovation smiley when you need it?

Keep asking questions - it won't be long before you're here sharing all your firsts with us! (first feed, first poop, first shed!!!)

I use a human heating pad with no auto shut off, though it's on medium instead of low. It has all the heat needed for my BP.

That's a great decision you've made--wish everyone was so responsible. Fear not: With an attitude like yours, you'll have a happy snake in no time.

Don't get me wrong... it's SO hard not to just drive out there and buy him! I'm really just worried for the animal, because of the risks of stress and therefore eating problems, and shedding problems, etc.

I THINK it's going to be today though. We'll see! -_-

I moved the tank away from the window and it seems to help. I can definatly feel a temperature difference now when I put my hand into the tank.

- Here's a question: Maybe it's just my crappy humidity reader, but it's showing a humidity of 90%! Even if this is wrong, what's a way to bring the humidity level down?

There is nothing wrong with a dimmer switch to regulate the heating device. I've used them for years. While thermostats generally keep a steadier temp and may be more reliable, rheostats (dimmer switches) work perfectly fine as long as you keep an eye on them from time to time. I've switched most of my racks over to thermostats, but I still have some cages and racks on dimmers and they work just fine. (and while I'm not a REAL big breeder, I AM over 225lbs) ;)

This is what I used to do when I still used aquariums.

Zoo med heat pad, stuck to the bottom of the aquarium in the corner on one side. get two square plastic or rubber furniture coasters (those things you put under the legs of your chairs or tables to protect your floors) Cut them in half diagonally and silicone the pieces to each of the four corners of your aquarium. This is important as it will raise the bottom of the aquarium off the ground and you'll get air flow underneath it. If you don't do this the heat could be trapped in the space under the aquarium and could build up to the point where it could crack the glass. I've cracked a few aquarium bottoms before by overheating them. It also seems to make it easier to regulate the heat. I'd then plug the zoo-med heat pad into an extension cord into which I had spliced a dimmer switch. I've got a bunch of these I made out of 6 foot extension cords, a dimmer switch, a plastic electric utility box and a face plate. In order to measure the temp, buy a digital indoor/outdoor thermometer that has a remote probe on a wire. Tape the probe directly over the heat source on the bottom of the aquarium and cover with your substrate. If you don't want to put tape inside your cage, and there are many good reasons not to, you can pry up a corner of the heat pad and place the probe on the bottom side of the aquarium sandwiched between the sticky heat pad and the bottom of the tank. Do this carefully or you could damage the heat pad. Adjust the dimmer so that the temp on the thermometer stays around 90-92 degrees. I've always found this to be more then adequate without the need for other heat sources.

Mark

Yes they can be used, but are trickier to use. Especially if your temps in the house can change.

Don't rely on your hand to tell you what the temp is. A digital thermometer (a $12 Acurite from Wal-Mart or equivalent) is the only way to go. I'm not sure where MarkS lives, but I (again) think you're going to have a tough time with undertank alone unless you boost the ambient temperature in the room to about 75. Just keep fiddling until you nail it. I know it's REALLY hard not to dash out and get a snake pronto, but believe me: There are plenty out there, and a few days, even a week or so, won't make any difference given that this animal will live a couple decades. What you absolutely don't want is to have it come down with a respiratory infection (a byproduct of wrong temps/wrong humidity) that necessitates an expensive trip to the vet, not to mention the stress involved. Keep us all posted. We're rooting for you.

Well, I guess this whole thing is going to be postponed just a little longer.

The person who I was taking care of the milksnake for has had some other obligations she has to attend to... So I am left trying to find this milksnake a new home before I can get myself a BP. A few of my friends have shown interest, so once I get the 'ok' from one of them and help them create their setup, I can get back to dealing with my own snake.

Thanks for all the help. Hopefully it won't be too long. I don't think I could stand waiting a month or more. :zerb:

I live in MN, it's always cold here. I keep my herp rooms between 75-80 degrees, but even when I've kept the animals in a 68 degree room, I haven't had trouble. Respiratory infections are caused by germs, not temperatures. Too low temps can cause stress to an animal which can exacerbate an ALREADY EXISTING CONDITION, but they do not CAUSE respiratory infections.

If you're worried about ambient temperatures you can alway heat the air in the cage with a light bulb, the problem with these is that they tend to dry the air out as well. Another option is to put a hide box partially over the heat source. An enclosed hide box will trap heat inside and will create an area where the air temps as well as the belly temps are nice and warm. Just make sure it doesn't get too hot.

I guess my main point for the original poster is to point out that belly temps are the most important temperature aspect in the cage. Ambinent air temps, while important, are not as crucial as belly temps, and if you have an unregulated heating pad, it's easy to burn your snake.

Mark

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MarkS

I live in MN, it's always cold here. I keep my herp rooms between 75-80 degrees, but even when I've kept the animals in a 68 degree room, I haven't had trouble. Respiratory infections are caused by germs, not temperatures. Too low temps can cause stress to an animal which can exacerbate an ALREADY EXISTING CONDITION, but they do not CAUSE respiratory infections.

If you're worried about ambient temperatures you can alway heat the air in the cage with a light bulb, the problem with these is that they tend to dry the air out as well. Another option is to put a hide box partially over the heat source. An enclosed hide box will trap heat inside and will create an area where the air temps as well as the belly temps are nice and warm. Just make sure it doesn't get too hot.

I guess my main point for the original poster is to point out that belly temps are the most important temperature aspect in the cage. Ambinent air temps, while important, are not as crucial as belly temps, and if you have an unregulated heating pad, it's easy to burn your snake.

Mark

---

I think you're splitting hairs here. The lower temperatures weaken their immune systems, making them more susceptible to bacteria and viruses. (not necessarily a pre-existing condition) A walk in the rain won't give you a cold, but may weaken your immune system so you come down with a bug. Either way you end up with a sick animal.

Why do you say that ambient temps aren't as important? I've noticed mine were very sensitive to the air temps, and I was much more prone to fasting during those times.

i have the same size tank for my bp , all you need now is the lamp i use a 75 watt heat bulb for the warm side and a uth on the cool side my substrate is repti carpet also make sure and get some new thermometers and hygrometer to see what your temps are really at, i use the stick on kind. and also instead of aluminum you could also try plastic wrap duct taped to the screen. my temps and humidity are solid 24-7, 95 on the hot side and 82 on the cool side 60-70% humidity. if you cant get your humidity right put another water bowl under the lamp, it will bump up for sure. my bp seems to be pretty comfortable.

Quote:

---

I think you're splitting hairs here. The lower temperatures weaken their immune systems, making them more susceptible to bacteria and viruses. (not necessarily a pre-existing condition) A walk in the rain won't give you a cold, but may weaken your immune system so you come down with a bug. Either way you end up with a sick animal.

Why do you say that ambient temps aren't as important? I've noticed mine were very sensitive to the air temps, and I was much more prone to fasting during those times.

---

I don't think thats splitting hairs at all. I've never had a sick animal due to low temperatures. I've seen too many gloom and doom posts warning people that they risk sickness and disease for their animals if the ambient temps are too low. In my personal experience it has never happened. I'm not saying that it couldn't happen, I'm just saying that the odds seem to be a lot smaller then would be indicated by the number of posts I've seen on the topic.

Mark

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MarkS

I don't think thats splitting hairs at all. I've never had a sick animal due to low temperatures. I've seen too many gloom and doom posts warning people that they risk sickness and disease for their animals if the ambient temps are too low. In my personal experience it has never happened. I'm not saying that it couldn't happen, I'm just saying that the odds seem to be a lot smaller then would be indicated by the number of posts I've seen on the topic.

Mark

---

Could you describe your personal experience? I've only kept mine for about 2 years, so I will not say I'm an expert by any means. That is why I rely on information from people who have kept these animals for decades. From my limited experience, they've been right on the mark. So what temperatures do you maintain your collections at and how long have you kept them that way? I'm always open to listening, but just because something hasn't happened to you doesn't mean it won't. I'd rather err on the side of caution here.

Ambient temps play a role in triggering breeding, so if your trying to initiate breeding the ambient temps are real helpful. I think the main concern is digestion and metabolism which is directly related to temps. The correct temps make happy snakes which eat and breed better and more predictable. I did read in the Barker's last book that he would rather be slighlty cooler than slightly warmer but remember 80 is on the cool side for a BP. Animals will survive under unfavorable conditions but that doesn't make it good.

I had a snake with a RI and the first thing they tell you to do is keep the temps on the high side it improves their immune system. And they do stay on the heat when they don't feel well.

Well, I'm certainly no expert by any means either. But if you want a resume, here it is. Just counting off the top of my head, I currently maintain 99 ball pythons, 81 colubrids, 7 pythons of various other species and a boa. These numbers include babies from this year.

I'm a relative newcomer to ball pythons though, I've only been breeding them for 5 years. I got my first one in 1999 (still have him too). Before that my main focus was on colubrids, mainly corns kings and milks. I've been breeding them for about the past 15 years. I got my first 'store bought' snake (a corn snake) in 1978. Before that I'd been keeping whatever I could catch in the woods and swamps out in back of my house, mainly garter snakes and red belly snakes.

I haven't kept any quantity of snakes in aquariums for the last 10+ years, but I used to have shelves filled with 10 and 20 gallon aquariums. Most everything I have now are kept in racks. The few individual cages I have contain a few burms, a carpet python and a boa. The one snake I currently keep in an aquarium is a coastal carpet python thats in a 40 gallon breeder tank. She's in a room thats about 68-70 degrees and has a heating pad only. I've maintained her that way now for about 4 years. In the past though, before I started maintaining larger numbers of balls and keeping them in rack systems, I kept them in aquariums (because I'd moved all of my colubrids to racks and the aquariums were available) Some of them were kept this way for over 2 years with just a heating pad for heat.

The only time I've ever experienced a respiritory infection was with a burmese python that I was holding temporarily. He's fine now after undergoing a series of baytril injections. The other burms that I was maintaining in the same type of caging with the exact same temps using the same type of heat pad are all doing just fine.

Mark

Geez, am I jealous of that collection! http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k1...ke/drool51.gif A girl can dream. :D

Admittedly we're not experts and you don't even maintain your bp collection in tanks. (neither do I, after much difficulty maintaining temps which DID result in fasting but no RIs) It doesn't seem like the best advice to give to newbies, who are looking for the best conditions to keep their animals in. That is why I feel that we should defer to those who are, and offer that information with what experiences we have had. I appreciate you discussing your view and opinions so clearly. :gj:

Sorry about the delayed response.
About using dimmers/rheostats:

David and Tracy Barker (VPI)
Ball Pythons: The History, Natural History, Care and Breeding (2006)
Pythons of the World, Vol. II
p. 153-154

"Some keepers advocate the use of thermostats [to control heating devices], while others use rheostats. We are in the rheostat camp for several reasons."

1) cost less
2) fail less, and with less serious consequences, than a thermostat
3) "give our snakes a more constant variation of temperatures as the ambient temperatures in our snake rooms change"

Oh and on the subject of ambient air temps, the Barker's caution to not heat the air too much, as it can prevent the snake from cooling off. There is much much more on that topic, which I'm not going to transcribe. They recommend ambient temps of 78-80 with a hot spot of 86. They believe that keepers have been traditionally keeping snakes too hot. Food for thought.

If you can't find a place for it, you can put it up for adoption on petfinder.com or even just take it into a petco. The only problem with petco is that you'll have to give up your enclosure, but at least in my store, the animals put up for adoption don't stay in the store for more than three days. That's how i got my snake anyway.