Double Recessive Traits? How does that work?

Double Recessive Traits? How does that work? I don't understand. I know how the co-dominant and dominate work and the simple recessive but not this. Can someone please help me here? Thank You!

It basicly taking 2 simple ressesive traits and breedintg thme together.You get 2 simple ressesive traits in one. Like the albino pied.

I dont think so. Look at this page. That wouldn't make any sense.
http://www.newenglandreptile.com/gen...recessive.html

Check this out

-Evan

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Originally Posted by BaLLPAddICT

I dont think so. Look at this page. That wouldn't make any sense.
http://www.newenglandreptile.com/gen...recessive.html

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Its exactly what I said. Just in bigger words. And alittle more indepth.

What are the genes for an Axanthic ball? I thought all morphs had one gene, the homozygous. And the others were mixed morphs (genes). Not true?

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Originally Posted by BaLLPAddICT

What are the genes for an Axanthic ball? I thought all morphs had one gene, the homozygous. And the others were mixed morphs (genes). Not true?

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Huh?! Not following you here.....BPs (and most animals for that matter) have two copies of each gene, one inherited from each parent. Homozygous just means the animal has two copies of the same gene at a certain loci (location on the chromosome) they could could both be normal genes or both be abberant genes. The axanthic trait is recessive to the wild type (normal) gene, so if an animal is heterozygous for the axanthic trait it will be normal looking.

-Evan

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Originally Posted by BaLLPAddICT

What are the genes for an Axanthic ball? I thought all morphs had one gene, the homozygous. And the others were mixed morphs (genes). Not true?

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Axanthic is a ressesive trait..meaning it takes 2 het animals to produce an axanthic.

check out this page http://ballpython.com/page.php?topic=genetically3 The genes for both Albino and Axanthic are confusing me when it gets to the square on breeding those two morphs together.

Ooh. So, what would need to be breed to make an Axanthic morph?

Here look at this....it has visual aids to help get the concept of recessive genes.

http://www.ballpythons.ca/what_get/recessive.html

To get an axanthic you would have to breed....

Axanthic to Axanthic
Axanthic to het. Axanthic
het. Axanthic to het. Axanthic

With the double recessive traits, each individual trait is still inherited independant of each other. Does that help?

-Evan

Ok heres how you get axanthics. Give Adam Wysocki a call. Place an order for a pair of 100% hets andgrow them up untill the female is a few years old and 1,500Gs and breed them and hopefully in about 60 days you will have some axanthics and possible hets!!


The square is a punnet square. The albino is the same as an axanthic exept for the morphs. The genes are the same.

I always thought of each morph as having one gene like albinos do.

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Originally Posted by BaLLPAddICT

I always thought of each morph as having one gene like albinos do.

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Jeez..lol. Alright. Albinos and axanthics are simple ressesive. it takes 2 snakes with the same gene (het forms) to make this snake. The dad and the mom carry these hiden genes and when these genes meet in the female you get an egg with a little albino inside. Hope you understand!

lol thats not what i meant

i meant the homozygous form of each morph i thought to have one gene, am i still being stupid? lol its just a little confusing for me

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Originally Posted by BaLLPAddICT

i meant the homozygous form of each morph i thought to have one gene, am i still being stupid? lol its just a little confusing for me

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Discounting any weird biological exceptions that may be there that I don't know about.....basically, EVERY gene is a pair...like a pair of shoes. You don't ever have one shoe...you have a pair of shoes. If the two shoes of that pair match, they are homozygous. If one is "red" and the other is "normal" then the pair could be called "het for red."

Now picture those shoes on two millipedes twined around each other. LOTS of pairs of shoes!! And each pair does something different. One pair might have the albino genes....another pair the axanthic genes....another pair the pied genes.....etc.

Does that help any?

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Originally Posted by JLC

Discounting any weird biological exceptions that may be there that I don't know about.....basically, EVERY gene is a pair...like a pair of shoes. You don't ever have one shoe...you have a pair of shoes. If the two shoes of that pair match, they are homozygous. If one is "red" and the other is "normal" then the pair could be called "het for red."

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Awesome Analogy!

okay well if this is true then im getting somewhere. These punnet squares for the simple recessive and dom/co-dom types of balls had the tables set up like for an albino a|a for one parent and the other parent a|a. Was that just simplifying it like it really is aa|aa and aa|aa for albino? And the other genes are two also exept not the same like albinos? And those make a different morph? ahh.. i think i understand this now..

on one of the genetics pages on ballpython.com it had this for the genetics of an albino and an axanthic: aaax+ax+ x a+a+axax so if i were to separate them it would be like this: aa, ax+, ax+ x a+a+, ax, ax is that right? this was what was confusing me. oh no the + was standing for another gene right? lol so it should be like this separated?: aa, ax, +a, x+ x a+, a+, ax, ax.. uhh.. im lost, it doesnt show that in the square.. can you tell me what i mean? lol and here's the url of the page im looking at: http://ballpython.com/page.php?topic=genetically3

the a+'s on the site are the hiden albino gene.

When breeding an albino to an albino you dont get another morph....

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Originally Posted by BaLLPAddICT

okay well if this is true then im getting somewhere. These punnet squares for the simple recessive and dom/co-dom types of balls had the tables set up like for an albino a|a for one parent and the other parent a|a. Was that just simplifying it like it really is aa|aa and aa|aa for albino? And the other genes are two also exept not the same like albinos? And those make a different morph? ahh.. i think i understand this now..

on one of the genetics pages on ballpython.com it had this for the genetics of an albino and an axanthic: aaax+ax+ x a+a+axax so if i were to separate them it would be like this: aa, ax+, ax+ x a+a+, ax, ax is that right? this was what was confusing me. oh no the + was standing for another gene right? lol so it should be like this separated?: aa, ax, +a, x+ x a+, a+, ax, ax.. uhh.. im lost, it doesnt show that in the square.. can you tell me what i mean? lol and here's the url of the page im looking at: http://ballpython.com/page.php?topic=genetically3

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You're on the right track. The a|a are just the possible genes that each parent can pass on. Since each parent only passes on one of the two genes that they carry, the punnet squares are set up like so: A|A for a normal, A|a for a het, and a|a for a homozygous recessive.

With double het parents, this gives four different possibilities for which genes they pass on. So the parents are AaXx (X signifying the axanthic gene), but each parent can pass on AX, Ax, aX, or ax, that's where the odds come into play with the punnet square 1/16 chance of AAXX (normal), and of aaxx (snow).

-Evan

how do you spread out the gene with 4 alleles onto the punnet square? on the web site im on they have the gene CcGg and its spread onto a 4 by 4 square which looks like this: CG|Cg|cG|cg how did that haopen? lol it seems like something really easy but i dont see how they did it..

in the one you are asking about with all the +'s and x's this is what is meant (a+,a+) X (a,a) In this case a+ is being used to show the dominant trait (the normal) the a is used to represent the albino. The X is to show the two were crossed. It is the same as the other squares shown on the one of the other links, only they are using a and a+ instead of a and A. maybe that helps some.

how come in a punnett square for offspring of a albino and axanthic their genetics would look like this?: Albino x Axanthic: aaax+ax+ x a+a+axax.. why would this: aaax+ax+ represent albino? or how would that work?

first off it would be alot easier to use different letters for different traits. Secondly, the way they get the combinations is each parent has two copies of each gene. Only one copy of each gene is passed on to each baby (go look up mitosis and meiosis that may help explain that part) The 4 combinations are the 4 possible ways for those 2 sets of genes to mix. Lets say the parent has A a and X x. One copy of each gene is passed on to the off spring so you take the first copy in the first pair, and put it with the first copy in the second pair (A X) then you do the first copy from the first pair with the second copy from the second pair (A x) Then you do the same thing for the second copy in the first pair (a X) and (a x). Anyway, go look up mitosis and meiosis, and find a good visual explination of that and this should all make alot more sence.

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Originally Posted by BaLLPAddICT

how do you spread out the gene with 4 alleles onto the punnet square? on the web site im on they have the gene CcGg and its spread onto a 4 by 4 square which looks like this: CG|Cg|cG|cg how did that haopen? lol it seems like something really easy but i dont see how they did it..

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Excellent Question.

It is called independant assortment.....Evan explained it well in one of his previous posts......I have nothing to add expect an animation. Pictures help....but moving pictures really help to understand biological processes!

See http://www.sumanasinc.com/webcontent...ssortment.html

Click narrated.