66% Explanation Needed Please!

I'm still learning all of the ins and outs of genetics. So here is a couple little questions for you!

66% Het -

Does this mean that there is a 66% chance that the snake is carrying the right gene to produce a visible morph?

Or Does this mean that there is a 66% chance to produce a visible morph with the gene that a snake is guarenteed to have?

66% het means that there is a 66% chance that the snake carries the gene to produce a visual morph.

When you breed two 100 % hets together they will produce 1 visual morph in 4 eggs so you have 3 in four that look normal. those three are 66% het because one of them does'nt carry the gene. If there are 8 eggs and 2 morphs then your odds of getting a het go up. The only way to know is to breed your 66% to a 100% and see if you get a morph.

If they produce a morph the Yatezee you got a 100% het if not you got a good looking normal.

I hope this helps.

Thanks for the explanation man! So it is safe to assume that raising a pair of 66% Het Pieds could be quite devastating when a visible morph isn't hatched.

Yes that would crush your dreams totaly. Now you might have hit the lotto. But you want know till you try. 100% hets aren't that expencive if your want to breed peid then get 100% and know for sure thats really the best way to go in my option.

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Originally Posted by Kilo

Thanks for the explanation man! So it is safe to assume that raising a pair of 66% Het Pieds could be quite devastating when a visible morph isn't hatched.

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well its better chance than a 50% het...

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Originally Posted by Kilo

Thanks for the explanation man! So it is safe to assume that raising a pair of 66% Het Pieds could be quite devastating when a visible morph isn't hatched.

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You could also buy a 100% het male and several 66/50% poss. het females, that way your odds of hatching a morph are increased.

Here is a great read on Possible Hets:
http://www.ralphdavisreptiles.com/ma...ble_het-tb.asp

Thanks Daniel I was looking for that link.

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Originally Posted by wildlifewarrior

well its better chance than a 50% het...

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People pay the extra money to purchase a couple of 50% Hets and raise them for 2-3 to three years to produce normals? I just don't understand why lol. I'm going to be looking into a Het female for my 100% het albino male soon and woudln't settle for anything other than a 100%. Eventually I will be purchasing a pair of 100% het pieds too.

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Originally Posted by daniel1983

You could also buy a 100% het male and several 66/50% poss. het females, that way your odds of hatching a morph are increased.

Here is a great read on Possible Hets:
http://www.ralphdavisreptiles.com/ma...ble_het-tb.asp

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Even doing that though... wouldn't you want to purchase the entire clutch of 66%'s knowing that at least 2-3 have the gene!?!

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Originally Posted by Kilo

People pay the extra money to purchase a couple of 50% Hets and raise them for 2-3 to three years to produce normals?

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You can also buy 100% hets and produce only normal appearing babies. However, you know that the genetics are there....you just did not have good odds.

Read that article by Ralph Davis.....one of the greatest explainations of why poss. hets are so great IMHO.

I just finished reading it.... it makes complete sense to attempt it. But a hefty project it is... purchasing 4-5 snakes for one project attemping to hatch at least 1 visible morph. I will stick to my 100% Hets... and at minimum would purchase 2-3 females out of a clutch of 66% to prove one-two of them out!

I bought a normal who had both pastel parents. I thought if you bred two FULL PASTELS that all of the clutch would have some pastel genes.

So shouldn't my normal be a het pastel? At least 50%?

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So shouldn't my normal be a het pastel? At least 50%?

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No such thing as het pastel (or spider) From what I understand if you breed a normal to either a pastel or spider you can get pastels/spiders and normals.

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Originally Posted by sidhe

No such thing as het pastel (or spider) From what I understand if you breed a normal to either a pastel or spider you can get pastels/spiders and normals.

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Correct Het is a term used to describe a recessive gene. Spider, Pastel are Dominate or Codominate meaning it either shows up or it wasent present. if I am not mistaken

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Originally Posted by AkivaSmith

I bought a normal who had both pastel parents. I thought if you bred two FULL PASTELS that all of the clutch would have some pastel genes.

So shouldn't my normal be a het pastel? At least 50%?

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Breed two pastels together and you get four eggs. Heres the fun part you get three pastels and Drum roll please one super pastel. Meaning you have a 1 in four chance to produce a super. Now again they may all be just pastels.

If your going with poss. hets, females are the only thing worth having. When breeding a homo or het male with a group of poss. het females, you know the gene is in the mix somewhere. Here's the breakdown of the percent chance that each egg has to hatch out as a visual.

50% x 50%, each egg has a 6.25% chance of hatching a visual (same odds as producing a double recessive trait with double hets, 1/16)
50% x 66% = 8.3%chance
66% x 66% = 11%
het x 50% = 12.5%
het x 66% = 16.7%
het x het = 25%
homo x 50% = 25%
homo x het = 50%

There have been many-a-happy dances done when poss. het girls prove out :carrot:. Poss het males are as good as normals, unless you're dealing with high end stuff (i.e. Lav. albino) where even het males still cost a bunch and you're on a budget. Trying to prove out poss het males without poss het females (or het/homo femalesfor that matter) will be years of work with a possibilty to not producing any visuals ever. Having a 100% het male ensures that somewhere down the road, you will produce a visual.

Alright, that's enough outta me.

-Evan

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Originally Posted by AkivaSmith

I bought a normal who had both pastel parents. I thought if you bred two FULL PASTELS that all of the clutch would have some pastel genes.

So shouldn't my normal be a het pastel? At least 50%?

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I don't believe pastel is a recessive trait. It is very possible to breed 2 pastels and produce normals. There is no such thing as a Het Pastel.

EDIT: 4 post! before mine was submitted.. ouch lol

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Originally Posted by Kilo

Even doing that though... wouldn't you want to purchase the entire clutch of 66%'s knowing that at least 2-3 have the gene!?!

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There is no guarantee any of them are hets. 66% refers to the chance that each egg has of being a carrier, not necessarily of how many eggs in a clutch will be carriers.

-Evan

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Originally Posted by Evan Jamison

If your going with poss. hets, females are the only thing worth having. When breeding a homo or het male with a group of poss. het females, you know the gene is in the mix somewhere. Here's the breakdown of the percent chance that each egg has to hatch out as a visual.

50% x 50%, each egg has a 6.25% chance of hatching a visual (same odds as producing a double recessive trait with double hets, 1/16)
50% x 66% = 8.3%chance
66% x 66% = 11%
het x 50% = 12.5%
het x 66% = 16.7%
het x het = 25%
homo x 50% = 25%
homo x het = 50%

There have been many-a-happy dances done when poss. het girls prove out :carrot:. Poss het males are as good as normals, unless you're dealing with high end stuff (i.e. Lav. albino) where even het males still cost a bunch and you're on a budget. Trying to prove out poss het males without poss het females (or het/homo femalesfor that matter) will be years of work with a possibilty to not producing any visuals ever. Having a 100% het male ensures that somewhere down the road, you will produce a visual.

Alright, that's enough outta me.

-Evan

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Thanks for dropping the knowledge bomb Evan... you are always a big help!

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Originally Posted by Freakie_frog

Breed two pastels together and you get four eggs. Heres the fun part you get three pastels and Drum roll please one super pastel. Meaning you have a 1 in four chance to produce a super. Now again they may all be just pastels.

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pastel x pastel = 25% normal, 50% pastel, 25% super :D

-Evan

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Originally Posted by Kilo

Thanks for dropping the knowledge bomb Evan... you are always a big help!

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Thanks, I try! :D

-Evan

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Originally Posted by Evan Jamison

pastel x pastel = 25% normal, 50% pastel, 25% super :D

-Evan

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Sorry mistyped that was in a hurry

Here this is a good visual sight to show you how every thing will turn out
http://www.ballpython.ca/genetics.html

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Originally Posted by Evan Jamison

If your going with poss. hets, females are the only thing worth having. When breeding a homo or het male with a group of poss. het females, you know the gene is in the mix somewhere. Here's the breakdown of the percent chance that each egg has to hatch out as a visual.

50% x 50%, each egg has a 6.25% chance of hatching a visual (same odds as producing a double recessive trait with double hets, 1/16)
50% x 66% = 8.3%chance
66% x 66% = 11%
het x 50% = 12.5%
het x 66% = 16.7%
het x het = 25%
homo x 50% = 25%
homo x het = 50%

There have been many-a-happy dances done when poss. het girls prove out :carrot:. Poss het males are as good as normals, unless you're dealing with high end stuff (i.e. Lav. albino) where even het males still cost a bunch and you're on a budget. Trying to prove out poss het males without poss het females (or het/homo femalesfor that matter) will be years of work with a possibilty to not producing any visuals ever. Having a 100% het male ensures that somewhere down the road, you will produce a visual.

Alright, that's enough outta me.

-Evan

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A god among men...Nice! :salute:

does super mean it carries two copies of the dominate gene and it would be guarenteed to pass the gene on? Also, do supers look any different than a "normal" with the trait.

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Originally Posted by piranhaking

does super mean it carries two copies of the dominate gene and it would be guarenteed to pass the gene on? Also, do supers look any different than a "normal" with the trait.

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Generally speaking, yes..."Super" means it carries both copies of a dominate gene. In the case of most ball python morphs a "super" will look significantly different from its single-gene counterpart. A super-pastel is far more faded, with higher degrees of blushing and crazy pastel colors...for instance. A more radical example would be the "super" form of yellow-bellies, which is an ivory colored snake...or two lessers make the pure white leusistic.

In some cases, an animal can carry both genes but not show a visible difference from the original morph. If this is the case, then the benefit of having the "super" would be that ALL of its offspring would demonstrate the visible morph. I can't think of any such examples in the BP world. Spiders are the only dominant morph I can think of that does not have a visable super-form...and no one that I know of has proven even a non-visible super-spider.

I have 100%het pied and will breed him too his offspring girl's and I just can't wait to have fun with this project. One of our other member's also went this route and produced 1.7 possible het pied's she must be on cloud nine cause she will definitely produce a pied or two in a couple of year's. When you think about it it's probably the most fullfiilling way to do it not to mention the economic's.

Oh wow I just now thought of that Emilio! I could just purchase a normal female to breed with my 100% het albino and then breed the het back to the female offspring to produce my morph! Actually I could just purchase a 100% het albino female and a normal female along with a 100% het pied male then do it with the het pied like you are! Brilliant!

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Originally Posted by Kilo

Oh wow I just now thought of that Emilio! I could just purchase a normal female to breed with my 100% het albino and then breed the het back to the female offspring to produce my morph!

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Be careful, though. Remember, you are dealing in the world of POSSABILITIES only. If you breed a 100% het to a normal...than the offspring have a 50% possibility to carry the gene...they could all turn out to be normal.

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Originally Posted by Kilo

Actually I could just purchase a 100% het albino female and a normal female along with a 100% het pied male then do it with the het pied like you are! Brilliant!

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Best chance would be the 100% het pair....that is what I am hoping to save up for real soon!!

-BT:cool:

100% het x normal = 50% poss. hets


het x 50% poss. het is not a bad way to go. i would try 3 or 4 girls instead of one.



vaughn

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Originally Posted by bjthomps

Be careful, though. Remember, you are dealing in the world of POSSABILITIES only. If you breed a 100% het to a normal...than the offspring have a 50% possibility to carry the gene...they could all turn out to be normal.



Best chance would be the 100% het pair....that is what I am hoping to save up for real soon!!

-BT:cool:

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Wow you'd really need some bad luck not to hit on one especially if you get 3 or 4 female's.