Den site destroyed - all snakes killed

One of the people on my road (about 4 houses up) stumbled upon a den site yesterday of garters. Juvies and adults. Her and her husband killed almost 100 snakes. They had a garbage bag full of dead snakes this morning. They actually thought that by showing this to me, I would give them a pat on the back and say great job. What morons.
When I asked them why they would do something so terrible, the response was, the snakes were growling at them, trying to kill them, and chasing them into the house. I said why didn't you call me or walk down the road and I would have relocated them (they know I do it since other neighbors have asked for relocations). Their reasoning was they didn't want them to come back and try and kill their kids.
I really hate people like this. Snakes do not growl. They will not chase you into your house. And above all, they will NOT come back for revenge.
The other neighbors now think the better way to deal with snakes is to kill them on the spot rather than relocate them. This way they will never return.
I really wish there was an animal cruelty law that could be used. I called the state officials today and was told since it was not a timber rattler, and I didn't witness it, there was nothing they could do about it.
WTH. Doesn't anyone care that hundreds of snakes were just butchered out of ingnorance and fear?
This really ticked me off today. I never really cared too much for these people but now I despise them.
My other neighbors are not much better.
The new motto is kill the snakes instead of relocating them.

Wow. That is the most insane thing i have heard off. How does one even have the means to take on that many snakes at one go? I mean, did he just trudge around with a shouvel(sp)?

That's 1) weird and 2) heart wrenching because their excuses are so petty and trivial! Growling at you? How could they talk to anyone about that? Esp a known snake-person in the neighborhood? Any Shame?

Wow. Thats something else- and they're GARTER SNAKES for crying out loud.
O.O

WHAT IDIOTS!!!
Just reading this made me really upset and mad! I probably would have gone off on them in a hot second after hearing what they had done. It is VERY sad that no one would anything in a case like this. My heart goes out to those snakes!!!

They used shovels and one of those ice breaker things (don't know what they are called - long handle with a flat metal blade head) and a lot were crushed by rocks landing on them.
I have no idea how many in total were there originally since they told me it was a million but it had to be a lot to be able to kill this amount. Some probably got away but I think the majority died.

pick axe?

They will get there just desert someday when there house is over run with mice and rats :cool: .What a bunch of idiots:mad:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by lillyorchid

pick axe?

---

Nope. Not a pick axe.
I have one of these too and cannot remember what it is called. I use it to break up the ice on my drive way. It looks like a really large putty knife.:D

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SPJ

Nope. Not a pick axe.
I have one of these too and cannot remember what it is called. I use it to break up the ice on my drive way. It looks like a really large putty knife.:D

---

Ice chiper

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by joepythons

Ice chiper

---

That'll work.

And to think Bobby said you weren't good for anything. Shows how much he knows.:bolt:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SPJ

That'll work.

And to think Bobby said you weren't good for anything. Shows how much he knows.:bolt:

---

:sabduel: :irkd: :neener: :neener: Never listen to a redneck from Florida :P

Ever hear about Tonto Goldstein who was called Bubba by his friends?:thumbsup:

You got mail.:D :D

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SPJ

One of the people on my road (about 4 houses up) stumbled upon a den site yesterday of garters. Juvies and adults. Her and her husband killed almost 100 snakes. They had a garbage bag full of dead snakes this morning. They actually thought that by showing this to me, I would give them a pat on the back and say great job. What morons.
When I asked them why they would do something so terrible, the response was, the snakes were growling at them, trying to kill them, and chasing them into the house. I said why didn't you call me or walk down the road and I would have relocated them (they know I do it since other neighbors have asked for relocations). Their reasoning was they didn't want them to come back and try and kill their kids.
I really hate people like this. Snakes do not growl. They will not chase you into your house. And above all, they will NOT come back for revenge.
The other neighbors now think the better way to deal with snakes is to kill them on the spot rather than relocate them. This way they will never return.
I really wish there was an animal cruelty law that could be used. I called the state officials today and was told since it was not a timber rattler, and I didn't witness it, there was nothing they could do about it.
WTH. Doesn't anyone care that hundreds of snakes were just butchered out of ingnorance and fear?
This really ticked me off today. I never really cared too much for these people but now I despise them.
My other neighbors are not much better.
The new motto is kill the snakes instead of relocating them.

---

If you live in the United States there is an animal cruelty law. And killing Garters in HUGE amounts like they did is cruelty no doubt. Even killing one for any reason is cruelty. I'd call the animal patrol and tell them to look in their garbage can.

I called the town animal control officer and the state fisheries and DEP.


No one wanted to do anything.

Why not? Are they that lazy to get off their butts and do something???? Maybe you should call the ASPCA?

maybe u should put out flyers around ur neighborhood letting ppl know if they have a snake problem to call u for help.? =-\

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SPJ

Ever hear about Tonto Goldstein who was called Bubba by his friends?:thumbsup:

You got mail.:D :D

---

Steve,that joke you sent me was a LMAO joke.you have mail :cool:

Thats horrible! :( Especially since no one will do anything about it! Next time you see them tell them that snakes help keep the mice and rodent populations under control, and if they keep killing them they're just going to find rats in their house.


I think it's especially stupid that they wouldn't call you and decided to just kill them instead.

I don't get it. Part of the attraction, to me at least, is the fact that I have fox, deer, rabbits, raccoons, possums, mice, bald eagles, snakes, toads, salamanders, bats, etc. all in my backyard.

I have a skunk that comes up to my back door at night a few times a week for the past 3 years looking for a handout (one neighbor puts out cat food for it) and this thing never makes any attempt to spray anyone (even though I have almost stepped on him a few time going outside). I have even had bears, coyotes, and wolves cut thru the yard.
If you don't want wildlife as a neighbor, move to the city. Don't live in a rural area with woods and open space surrounding you.

This is what is so great about living here. The animals are everywhere. I hate it when people kill them.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...s/063588d3.jpg

I agree with you Steve 100%;) .Some people think they are the rulers of the world and animals have to avoid them or else they kill them :mad: .We have coyotes ,turkeys and deer around our area and i love seeing them.I have rescued a snake recently(juvy black rat) and it now lives in our back yard or close to it as we have woods one door down from us.

i know exactly what you're saying about idiots like that, that live around nature.

at our 22 acres up in the foothills of northern california (its not our house, just a second piece of property) everyone up there kills every rattlesnake they see. i was riding my dirtbike one day and i stopped to look at a bunch of huge vultures eating a dead kit fox and a lady pulled up next to me.

we got talking about the nature up there and she said, "natures great isnt it? we love it." ofcourse i said howmuch i love the rattlesnakes and other herps up there. she said, "oh yeah, they're starting to come out now."(shis was earlier last year when they were coming out)"we just killed big one at our property." yeah, and you love the nature up here huh lady??? gimme a break!:mad: well i didnt say that but i wanted too.:rolleyes:

you should a) post there (your neighbors) address so we can all write them hate mail and b) post the address to the wildlife agency that you called so we can also send them hate mail.


Just my 2 cents.

SPJ I am from CT too, and this makes me sad to say i'm from CT. You should look up SNEHA which stands for Southern New England Herpetological Association, http://www.scinax.com/sneha/home.html there are three contacts there I know them all personally and if you email any of them let me know. They are all great people two are associated with universities. Let them know what exactly happened and they will possibly contact someone on your behalf, they are always willing to help. include me in the email and if you want me to help out in any way let me know. my email is michael-mosher@hotmail.com

wildlifewarrior

This might not help, but it's worth a shot. In the Spring I made up a flyer for my kids to pass around to the neighbors. It just stated that snakes are an important part of our ecosystem, some of the local non-venomous snakes in the area, and our phone number in case they wanted us to relocate the snakes for them.

There are a lot of ignorant fears out there, but sometimes people just need to be educated before the light comes on. However, sometimes people will never change...

EDIT by JLC -- I totally understand how frustrating it can be to hear these kinds of stories. But our TOS policy is very clear that we do not and can not tolerate talk about this kind of physical violence against another person.

Monty, i would have to say go easy on the violence, i think going over there and confronting the guy is fine, but herps have a bad enough stigma as it is, they don't need a reason to hate everyone trying to educate them.


I think the flyer is an awsome idea xdeus!

wildlifewarrior

the flyers are a good idea but they shoulda asked someone before they did it at all and i think thats a cause for violance because they made a really bad uneducated guess about the crueilty of animals

Whoa Mont... chill?

That is just awful!


It makes me really mad when people can be so cruel.:mad:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Monty

they made a really bad uneducated guess

---

Now its time to educated, idealy before but worst case scenario after (As this is a worst case scenario)

Im not saying i am not ticked off about it and i would have to take a deep breath before confronting the person and "calmly" educating them.

Like i said sad day for a Herper from CT

wildlifewarrior

A good idea to really reach people might be a community newspaper. Where I live, almost everybody reads the paper, and if you wrote a letter to the editor or called the editor about it, your thoughts would be in something that people trust and read every week.
Write about what you saw, and what threat these snakes pose (which is none... :sigh: poor snakes), and what can be done to avoid interaction... or musking. And how to identify them. Then outline how important garters are to the environment..
I'm so sad this happened. I used to play with garters as a kid and they're just stinky little sweethearts :(

ok u guys win i understand where you all are comin from and it is a sad day for a herper and yea you do have to educate people but alot of times people will listen and not really take heed of what your saying and just blow it off like it was nothing which is how i see those people in this case im not sayin it to others who afterwards go o S#$% did i do something wrong those are the ones u know u can eduate the ones that think about it and realize it was a bad idea not the ones that are hard headed they will never learn least thats how it is in my opinion and yes flyers are a good idea and i'm all for the flyers so sorry bout he violent out break earlier its just it pisses me off alot because animals are pretty much my life i like rescuing animals i would take more in but i cant no more room at my house or my friends house and im also a real big enviormentalist i know this has nothing to do with nothing but it does in the end ok im done and once again sorry about the violence

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Monty

ok u guys win i understand where you all are comin from and it is a sad day for a herper and yea you do have to educate people but alot of times people will listen and not really take heed of what your saying and just blow it off like it was nothing which is how i see those people in this case im not sayin it to others who afterwards go o S#$% did i do something wrong those are the ones u know u can eduate the ones that think about it and realize it was a bad idea not the ones that are hard headed they will never learn least thats how it is in my opinion and yes flyers are a good idea and i'm all for the flyers so sorry bout he violent out break earlier its just it pisses me off alot because animals are pretty much my life i like rescuing animals i would take more in but i cant no more room at my house or my friends house and im also a real big enviormentalist i know this has nothing to do with nothing but it does in the end ok im done and once again sorry about the violence

---

massive sentence.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Monty

ok u guys win i understand where you all are comin from and it is a sad day for a herper and yea you do have to educate people but alot of times people will listen and not really take heed of what your saying and just blow it off like it was nothing which is how i see those people in this case im not sayin it to others who afterwards go o S#$% did i do something wrong those are the ones u know u can eduate the ones that think about it and realize it was a bad idea not the ones that are hard headed they will never learn least thats how it is in my opinion and yes flyers are a good idea and i'm all for the flyers so sorry bout he violent out break earlier its just it pisses me off alot because animals are pretty much my life i like rescuing animals i would take more in but i cant no more room at my house or my friends house and im also a real big enviormentalist i know this has nothing to do with nothing but it does in the end ok im done and once again sorry about the violence

---

I can totally understandy your frustration and anger. However, if you choose to act upon it and commit an act of violence you will end up in jail obviously. How would that help the animals or the environment which are your life? They now have one less person to speak for them and would be worse off due to your actions.

Like I said earlier, I understand your passion and I'm sure I would feel the same way about anyone who would kill an animal. But if you choose to act upon those feelings, it becomes more about you than saving or educating about the animals/environment in general. Violence will not solve your problem. Put those feelings to better use and write letters or publish articles or just talk your heart out to people who are afraid/ignorant about the facts! :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SPJ

One of the people on my road (about 4 houses up) stumbled upon a den site yesterday of garters. Juvies and adults. Her and her husband killed almost 100 snakes. They had a garbage bag full of dead snakes this morning. They actually thought that by showing this to me, I would give them a pat on the back and say great job. What morons.
When I asked them why they would do something so terrible, the response was, the snakes were growling at them, trying to kill them, and chasing them into the house. I said why didn't you call me or walk down the road and I would have relocated them (they know I do it since other neighbors have asked for relocations). Their reasoning was they didn't want them to come back and try and kill their kids.
I really hate people like this. Snakes do not growl. They will not chase you into your house. And above all, they will NOT come back for revenge.
The other neighbors now think the better way to deal with snakes is to kill them on the spot rather than relocate them. This way they will never return.
I really wish there was an animal cruelty law that could be used. I called the state officials today and was told since it was not a timber rattler, and I didn't witness it, there was nothing they could do about it.
WTH. Doesn't anyone care that hundreds of snakes were just butchered out of ingnorance and fear?
This really ticked me off today. I never really cared too much for these people but now I despise them.
My other neighbors are not much better.
The new motto is kill the snakes instead of relocating them.

---

i haven't read this thread... (as i'm sick and can't focus for that long right now) but i just want to say how sad this makes me... i'm going to go cry for the snakes now :(

im sorry bout all the one sentence long posts. its my style of writing ive writin like that all though high school even book reports. and the way i wrote them it was just all flowing and i just love writing i just dont remember the puncuation. so once again i will work on my puncuation. its just when yout teachers and stuff think its a unique way of writing and they don't stop it it just stays with you. so i will try and puncuate more.

ok now that thats done about my violence i have a really bad bi-polar disorder. i was in my violent person because i hadnt taken my meds. that day i woke up late and wasnt feelin good and i had a temp later that day the temp went down and i took my meds but since i missed a dose it didnt really do anything.

now on to the killing of the snake den it's not right and those people should be educated about things like that like i said before the flyers are a good idea and going to schools and educating the kids is also a good thing to do so that way the ingnorance will stop. it just sucks to lose a whole ecosystem like that.

UPDATE:


I just a call at work from my wife. This woman stopped by the house today and asked if I would remove all of the snakes from her yard tonight.

She has seen another one today (this time she says it's a copperhead but I doubt she can ID any snake) and her and her husband are afraid to go after this one since they are "poisonous" and "can kill you right away by spitting the poison at you". OMG. Talk about uneducated about snakes.

I agreed to go tonight with a few bags and a hook. I plan on relocating every snake I find.

It would be nice to find a copperhead though since they haven't been seen around here for years. At least I'll know there are some left and not all were killed or forced out by the new developments.

I'll let you know how it goes.

Maybe this will be the beginning of the end for killing snakes from these people. Hopefully, there wll be at least a garter there so I can handle it and show them that even though they are wild, they are not evil (won't be freehandling if it is in fact a copperhead though:D .)

No worries monty.


SPJ - there are still copperheads in CT, so if this turns out to be a den for copperheads, please don't tell anyone, since they aren't doign that well in CT. Not because i think people on this forum are bad, but people passing through just looking may see the post and think it is a good idea to have them have as little publicity as possible. ;)
Good luck with the catch and release, people learn best (i think) with hands on experience. Give it a try as long as its not the copperhead!:eek:

wildlifewarrior

Wow, just read this whole thread... I can't imagine such ignorance. But now I know what "Hick-ory" flavouring is all about. I didn't think it'd be so prevalent in CT though!

Garter dens have become real tourist attractions in Ontario. Even senior citizens remark at how beautiful and amazing hordes of garters can be. Though I can only imagine if my vision was failing and all I saw was a blurry writhing mass of green everywhere I stepped... bad acid trip!

Good luck with the relocations. I wish we had native herps to relocate if needed!

One last thing: while I wouldn't wish PETA on my worst enemy, except I would wish PETA on PETA, I'm sure a sensational case of animal cruelty, particularly against wild animals, would get them interested. If you really want action... go for the nuts!

i bet if i came over there and killed them with my shovel and told the police the story they told you. id be in the crazy house. like were the only living things around.

after reading that i can honestly say im ashamed to share the same species with these F:cens0r::cens0r::cens0r::cens0r:rs

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by wildlifewarrior

No worries monty.


SPJ - there are still copperheads in CT, so if this turns out to be a den for copperheads, please don't tell anyone, since they aren't doign that well in CT. Not because i think people on this forum are bad, but people passing through just looking may see the post and think it is a good idea to have them have as little publicity as possible. ;)
Good luck with the catch and release, people learn best (i think) with hands on experience. Give it a try as long as its not the copperhead!:eek:

wildlifewarrior

---

If there are any copperheads, I definitely want them relocated somewhere safer. There can't be many around (at least nowhere like there were about 10 years ago around here). They are getting almost as hard to find as timbers (and those are next to impossible to see in the wild unless you know where to look and I won't broadcast a spot I know of on the net.)
Copperheads and timbers need to be appreciated from a distance and not bothered.

I agree i know of a den site and you only can find black rats and garters there most of the time as well as copperheads. Be very secrative about those dens they are precious!!!


wildlifewarrior

Sorry i ment to send a personal message

Good luck with rehomeing those other ones!!!

Good luck hope you find a good quiet place for them

I could go on and on for hours with this one; the whole thing is a rotten shame, and I am ashamed to be of the same species as these complete moronic idiots who did this. I am a proud rural resident, and I love having nature right outside of our door. I never condone killing animals (or heck, even native plants) for senseless things; shame on suburbanites who want to extend suburbia's synthetic grotesqueness into my domain.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SPJ

If there are any copperheads, I definitely want them relocated somewhere safer. There can't be many around (at least nowhere like there were about 10 years ago around here). They are getting almost as hard to find as timbers (and those are next to impossible to see in the wild unless you know where to look and I won't broadcast a spot I know of on the net.)
Copperheads and timbers need to be appreciated from a distance and not bothered.

---

Just remember if you relocate them, to do it to an area where they will have some sort of den to retreat to for the winter. moving them to an area with no den, could be worse than leaving them where they are ;). No worries though (it is also getting late in the summer season don't forget) so you may be putting up with moving snakes for quite a long time. When telling these people about the den don't forget to mention that they were their first, and no matter how hard they try they are gonna live around snakes. Just wait until all of the survivors emerge next spring. Give em a head's up about that!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ginevive

I could go on and on for hours with this one; the whole thing is a rotten shame, and I am ashamed to be of the same species as these complete moronic idiots who did this. I am a proud rural resident, and I love having nature right outside of our door. I never condone killing animals (or heck, even native plants) for senseless things; shame on suburbanites who want to extend suburbia's synthetic grotesqueness into my domain.

---

I like how people exagerate. Sorta like "This giant 1 foot slug with acid like slime that it left a trail of to hopefully melt my legs to the ground and leave me helpless and to cocoon me so to feed its young and dominate the world was in my backyard!!!" Sorta like what his neighbors said that the snakes chased them into the house and "growled" at them I think he said. Um, wtf? Since when have snakes been able to growl?

I think you should personally let loose about 50 brown mice right next to their home, where there is an entrance for them to get in....months later, when your neighbor starts complaining, say "Well, if we had some garter snakes livin' around here, we wouldn't have this problem...."

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 4theSNAKElady

I think you should personally let loose about 50 brown mice right next to their home, where there is an entrance for them to get in....months later, when your neighbor starts complaining, say "Well, if we had some garter snakes livin' around here, we wouldn't have this problem...."

---

FANTASTIC IDEA!!!!! that might be the best idea yet my hat is off to you!:colbert2:

(i just wanted to use that smiley)