Just a little info on Pitbulls

Ok, I want everyone to play this "game". It's not as easy as you would think (even for a bully lover like myself)!!

FIND THE PITBULL

http://www.pitbullsontheweb.com/petbull/findpit.html



I just thought I'd post a couple of things I've found about American Pitbull Terriers.




T0 KNOW THE BREED"

Words by Dave Wilson - Founder/Owner - Razors Edge Kennel

What is a "Pit Bull"? Simply, whatever its owner wants it to be! Unfortunately, America's own breed has been misrepresented. Too many people know of the reputation brought about by the press. Without knowing the true history or personality of this lovable breed, it has been unjustly disgraced. Originally, this breed was conceived to fight other dogs for mans entertainment. Even then, a people aggressive dog was not accepted for the match. This would make it impossible for handlers and referees to break dogs apart; as they did so often in a match. As brutal as the history is, it's what gave this breed extreme stability with man. Times have changed and dog fighting fortunately became illegal. Luckily this breed's willingness to please it's owner and it's intelligence able it to become a perfect companion. It is physically capable of performing the tasks of any breed, and it adds an extra bounce with a smile on its face. Pit bulls have done everything from therapy, seeing eye, tracking, K9 protection & show; to a child's best friend. This breed will be you and your family's loving companion and reliable protector. They love people from birth, yet they will let no one harm the ones they love. There has never been a breed that's more eager to please and entertain it's family. Their eagerness to please has also been the cause for the down fall of the "Pit Bull".

A BAD OWNER MAKES A BAD DOG!

Sadly, there are still people who breed unstable dogs to make a more aggressive dog. Worst of all, people who own these dogs, use very inhumane practices to intensify aggression; they deprive the dog of light and nourishment for weeks at a time, shoot them with steroids and drugs and even allow them to attack defenseless animals, just to name a few. These people are obviously not responsible owners or breeders and unfortunately are the ones who get all the attention. Once you have owned an American Pit Bull Terrier or an American Staffordshire Terrier, you will never want another breed! These are by far the happiest and most loyal of all breeds.
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You made me what I am today, courage at its best. You wanted me to know no fear, a cut above the rest.

Not only did I master that, I've thrown in loyalty, too. Look past my eyes into my soul, you know I'd die for you.

I'll watch your kids, I'll watch your house. Your praise will be my crown, ask what you will-I'll do my best. I'll even be your clown.

But some of you don't like me, I'm sure I don't know why. The only thing I'm guilty of is courage, love, and try.

But still they want to see me go, they want my breed to end. Will I see you sitting idly by? You, whom I call friend?

You made me what I am today, you never saw me waiver. I've done my best to keep you safe. Wont you please return the favor.

by 'Cheryl Crabb'

wow. that was pretty interesting. i finally just had to go through all of the pictures one by one to find the pitbull.

for the poll my option really isnt there. i like pitbulls and would like to own one someday maybe, but i dont like them so much that i wouldnt own any other dog.

ahhhh! Sorry for the grammer error in my poll! I tried to edit it to correct it, but I wasn't able to.

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Originally Posted by mr~python

wow. that was pretty interesting. i finally just had to go through all of the pictures one by one to find the pitbull.

for the poll my option really isnt there. i like pitbulls and would like to own one someday maybe, but i dont like them so much that i wouldnt own any other dog.

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Yeah, I guess I should have put more thought into my poll choices! Thats what I get from rushing though things. I have to learn to "take my time."LOL

lol, thats alright.

Whee my first guess was the right one! I am a dog groomer though.. we see a lot of pits. I LOVE pit bulls. They are the sweetest dogs, and a properly cared for one loves people.. just usually not other dogs!

I have always admired the pit bull. Them and the bull terriers are among my favorites. It's a shame people have destroyed their reputation as a sound trustworthy dog. Raised by the right people they can still be that loyal companion. Bad breeding has caused some damage as far as stability of the breed, yet there are many wonderful ones out there. A friend of mine had one that would herd geese and sheep. The most trustworthy animal around.

Because they are a powerful and easily bored dog I always suggest involving your dog in a lot of activities and investing in at least basic obedience.
This is a suggestion I make for several breeds,Many powerful breed such as great danes, mastiffs,etc. lose their homes because the owner doesn't understand how to PROPERLY discipline a dog. An informed owner is more likely to keep the animal for life.
I didn't vote in your poll because I love pitbulls but CHOOSE a different breed, not because I dislike them. They are as a breed in itself outstanding companions.:sweeet:

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Originally Posted by Shelby

Whee my first guess was the right one! I am a dog groomer though.. we see a lot of pits. I LOVE pit bulls. They are the sweetest dogs, and a properly cared for one loves people.. just usually not other dogs!

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I disagree Shelby.We own a staff/pit mix and a red nosed pit and they get along very well with the little dog next door(he is the size of a poodle).When we go to the vet they both want to play with the other dogs or the female(princess) wants to love them.Now both dogs are very protective of the house and of us which is normal for any dog.I got banned from a site last year because people were trying to say your pits should be nice to everyone no matter what.I told them they were very ignorant.I asked them this,so my dogs have to be nice to a burgler or someone trying to hurt my kid just because they are pits?? I have seen pits that are loved and properly cared for and ones that are mistreated.Its not the breed that needs to be put to sleep its the STUPID PIT MISTREATERS!!!!

It took me three guesses. I did recognise a lot of those breeds though, from my experience at the pet store.

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Originally Posted by joepythons

I disagree Shelby.We own a staff/pit mix and a red nosed pit and they get along very well with the little dog next door(he is the size of a poodle).When we go to the vet they both want to play with the other dogs or the female(princess) wants to love them.Now both dogs are very protective of the house and of us which is normal for any dog.I got banned from a site last year because people were trying to say your pits should be nice to everyone no matter what.I told them they were very ignorant.I asked them this,so my dogs have to be nice to a burgler or someone trying to hurt my kid just because they are pits?? I have seen pits that are loved and properly cared for and ones that are mistreated.Its not the breed that needs to be put to sleep its the STUPID PIT MISTREATERS!!!!

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What exactly do you disagree with? Yes, pits are protective.. and very good guardians if they are properly socialized. I didn't mean they are always friendly with everyone all the time, they can learn who is a threatening person (such as a burglar) and who is a friend.

For many years pits were bred to have a heightened prey drive and aggression towards other dogs to make them better pit fighters. So.. many pits today aren't crazy about other dogs.. not always, but we're always very careful at the groom shop to keep pits and dogs like them away from other dogs.

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Originally Posted by Shelby

What exactly do you disagree with? Yes, pits are protective.. and very good guardians if they are properly socialized. I didn't mean they are always friendly with everyone all the time, they can learn who is a threatening person (such as a burglar) and who is a friend.

For many years pits were bred to have a heightened prey drive and aggression towards other dogs to make them better pit fighters. So.. many pits today aren't crazy about other dogs.. not always, but we're always very careful at the groom shop to keep pits and dogs like them away from other dogs.

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I am sorry i thought you said pits never get along with other dogs :oops: .Thats what i get for responding and listening to the kid at the same time lol.

I'm glad I got a good response with this!

Most people that dislike pitbulls usually have never been around one to give them the chance. One classic example of this is my parents. Growing up they both had had many dogs, but never a pitbull or bully type dog. Soon after buying my own home and moving out I got a pitbull puppy. They though I was crazy. They even bought me a MUZZEL to use if they were over. (Which upset me, but that's a different story..lol)

NOW, I have two and they love my dogs! They understand now the breed is extreamly misjudged. They are the most lovable and loyal dogs. They would take either of them in a heartbeat, if I'd let them.

I have a pitbull and i love them to death, they get such a bad rep.,and there illegal in my small town of 900 people, but a few of us still have them.I have recently moved but, my old neighbor, breeds and sells pits. and before i moved i helped him, like, cleaning the cages, feeding, watering, bathing, shots for the pups, etc. it was awsome, considering i was only 12 it was really cool, and when he went on vacation me and my dad would go over and take care of them it was really fun.Now he lives out in the country, and we visit him every once in a while, but im almost 15, and when I turn 16 i'll be out there alot more

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Originally Posted by daaangconcepts

I'm glad I got a good response with this!

Most people that dislike pitbulls usually have never been around one to give them the chance. One classic example of this is my parents. Growing up they both had had many dogs, but never a pitbull or bully type dog. Soon after buying my own home and moving out I got a pitbull puppy. They though I was crazy. They even bought me a MUZZEL to use if they were over. (Which upset me, but that's a different story..lol)

NOW, I have two and they love my dogs! They understand now the breed is extreamly misjudged. They are the most lovable and loyal dogs. They would take either of them in a heartbeat, if I'd let them.

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I had a similar experience when I got a pitbull puppy.

Another comment I have is about pitbulls not liking other dogs. It all depends on how much they socialize with other dogs. Where I live there are alot of dog parks and I would take mine there several times a week. She got along great with all of the other dogs, and I think that this is the key to having a friendly dog. If they are around people and other dogs they will be friendly towards them and not aggressive.

It is also amazing how ignorant people react to them. I was in the dog park with her when she was young and she was playing with an italian greyhound. The owner of the greyhound saw them playing and ran over and picked her dog up because she was afraid that my pit would "eat" her dog.

I have always said there are no bad dogs or breeds of dogs only bad owners.

By the way picture #14 rocks! That's the breed I am getting the first of the year.

My man's cousins both have Pits, and their dogs are the big, silly kind of dog that just wants to play all the time. :)

Most pits I've met are silly and just want to play all the time. lol

My favorite bully breed is the standard bull terrier. I'll have one someday..

My hubby loves the bull terrier also! Maybe one day in the future we would get one. My two are a handfull as it is already though.

Just a question for everyone...

What do you use as a correction method. When the dog does something they shouldn't have (like potty on the floor, or tear up a roll of paper towels or newspaper..lol)

I use a spray bottle. For me it works far better then any other method I've tried. I just spray them with the water. All I have to do now is pick up the bottle, its kinda funny especially when I'm using it for something else, the doggies go run and hide. LOL...I shouldn't laugh but its still funny!

I have a pit bull. We love him. He is the sweetest dog. He would rather lick you to death than bite you.

We also have a yellow lab. The two of them get along perfectly. Actually when they wrestle its the lab that always wins.....

Here are my babies..

jinx and jazminhttp://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f2...s/DSC02772.jpg

I know i'm going to catch it for this but here goes.I'm a vet tech studing to be a vet in a few years and we see all kinds of dogs bulls being one of them.I can say without a question this is one breed of animal that needs to be removed form the face of the earth!You can be the best owner in the world and at some point this dog is going to turn on you or someone you know.


We put down two or three a month because the dog is just plain NASTY!!!

Sry for my typing but i'm trying to feed my four month old son. And sometimes thats a full time job.

WTF,removed off the face of the earth?You are stupid!:mad:

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Originally Posted by AlCapone

I know i'm going to catch it for this but here goes.I'm a vet tech studing to be a vet in a few years and we see all kinds of dogs bulls being one of them.I can say without a question this is one breed of animal that needs to be removed form the face of the earth!You can be the best owner in the world and at some point this dog is going to turn on you or someone you know.


We put down two or three a month because the dog is just plain NASTY!!!

Sry for my typing but i'm trying to feed my four month old son. And sometimes thats a full time job.

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ARE YOU SERIOUS???????????

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f1...s/DSCF0043.jpg

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f1...s/DSCF0032.jpg

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f1...s/DSCF0005.jpg

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Originally Posted by ofish14

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f1...s/DSCF0043.jpg

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f1...s/DSCF0032.jpg

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f1...s/DSCF0005.jpg

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Yep, ofish that pup is just tooo cute.

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Originally Posted by AlCapone

I know i'm going to catch it for this but here goes.I'm a vet tech studing to be a vet in a few years and we see all kinds of dogs bulls being one of them.I can say without a question this is one breed of animal that needs to be removed form the face of the earth!You can be the best owner in the world and at some point this dog is going to turn on you or someone you know.


We put down two or three a month because the dog is just plain NASTY!!!

Sry for my typing but i'm trying to feed my four month old son. And sometimes thats a full time job.

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Those are probably the ones that are not raised properly. Using that same mentality, there are many criminals that have to be "put down" by the police every month. Maybe we should push that the entire human race be removed from the face of the earth too. One bad apple spoils the bunch right?

"WTF,removed off the face of the earth?You are stupid"

Yep i'm stupid,But i get a first hand look at what this dog is all about and this breed needs to go period. Take alook at the facts pitbulls bite and kill their owners more than any breed in america fact. They kill more humans than any other breeds in america fact. I could go on but whats the point.Take a look at the numbers on Ohio State U. website under vet school. That tells you all you need to know.

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Originally Posted by AlCapone

"WTF,removed off the face of the earth?You are stupid"

Yep i'm stupid,But i get a first hand look at what this dog is all about and this breed needs to go period. Take alook at the facts pitbulls bite and kill their owners more than any breed in america fact. They kill more humans than any other breeds in america fact. I could go on but whats the point.Take a look at the numbers on Ohio State U. website under vet school. That tells you all you need to know.

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Ever stop to think about why this is? When a pitbull bites it BITES. The key work there being WHEN. Just because a dog is a pitbull does not mean that it will attack and kill its owner and deserves to be put down before this even happens. Did you look up any statistics about how many humans kill humans? I assure you that more humans are killed by humans than pitbulls. It seems to me that humans are more of a threat to humans than pitbulls are.

woah! woah! woah!!!!!

this is a topic about pit bulls!!!! not stupid people!!! you wanna bash stupid people?? make a thread about it!!!!


that said i don't think you're stupid, Alcapone. however i do believe numbers are skewed. for example, i read a statistic that more people are bitten every year by bluefish than by all shark types combined, on the American Eastern Seaboard (atlantic Ocean)

however getting bit by a bluefish rarely draws blood. therefore the numbers don't get reported because...who cares?

you see? so i don't know if this holds true by dogs, i would assume (note the word assume) that most dog bites draw blood or worse (eg stiches) but you get my point.

in summation i don't have any particular feelings towards owning a pit bull. i wouldn't want to see them wiped from the face of the earth (i've seen too many movies, i know that of course right after we would wipe them from the face of the earth aliens would come and demand to have their children back or something.)

wow, i wander a lot.

You wanna talk dog bites? I'm a Vet Tech as well and I have seen many, MANY more bites from people's spoiled Chihuahuas, Dachshunds, Rat Terriers, Schnauzers, Lhasa Apsos, Labradors, etc. We get alot of Am. Staff.'s and Am. Pit Bull Terriers, American Bull Dogs, Bull Terriers, and they are the ones I look forward to every day. They could care less what you stick or poke them with, they just look at you with that big smile on their face and love you for being there with them. If they are socialized properly, JUST LIKE ANY OTHER DOG, then they are perfectly fine to be with other dogs/cats/etc. I mean, seriously, if you didn't properly socialize a Lab, Husky, or one of those ditsy Chihuahuas(like every one I have ever met has been) they could be definitely be equally aggressive and very dangerous(with children or other animals).

Proper socialization, proper training, and not to mention the most important part; Spaying and Neutering to get rid of the health problems, frustration associated with the hormonal influence, and the unneeded aggression. It is all any dog ever needs. Sounds like someone needs to watch The Dog Whisperer and really take in what Cesar is talking about. I would trust any Bully breed MUCH farther than I would ever trust any of the toy breeds.

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Originally Posted by mr~python

wow. that was pretty interesting. i finally just had to go through all of the pictures one by one to find the pitbull.

for the poll my option really isnt there. i like pitbulls and would like to own one someday maybe, but i dont like them so much that i wouldnt own any other dog.

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same here

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Originally Posted by SatanicIntention

You wanna talk dog bites? I'm a Vet Tech as well and I have seen many, MANY more bites from people's spoiled Chihuahuas, Dachshunds, Rat Terriers, Schnauzers, Lhasa Apsos, Labradors, etc. We get alot of Am. Staff.'s and Am. Pit Bull Terriers, American Bull Dogs, Bull Terriers, and they are the ones I look forward to every day. They could care less what you stick or poke them with, they just look at you with that big smile on their face and love you for being there with them. If they are socialized properly, JUST LIKE ANY OTHER DOG, then they are perfectly fine to be with other dogs/cats/etc. I mean, seriously, if you didn't properly socialize a Lab, Husky, or one of those ditsy Chihuahuas(like every one I have ever met has been) they could be definitely be equally aggressive and very dangerous(with children or other animals).

Proper socialization, proper training, and not to mention the most important part; Spaying and Neutering to get rid of the health problems, frustration associated with the hormonal influence, and the unneeded aggression. It is all any dog ever needs. Sounds like someone needs to watch The Dog Whisperer and really take in what Cesar is talking about. I would trust any Bully breed MUCH farther than I would ever trust any of the toy breeds.

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AMEN

You got it Becky!

Anyways, as far as sheer numbers, more labradors bite people than pits. There is a breed temperament test, and pits rated one of the best.. above dogs like labs.. and shih tzus. I can not remember the website that lists it though.

The problem is that bad people tend to pick dogs like pits to abuse and therefore make aggressive. Why would they want a dog that doesn't have a bad reputation? They want a dog that looks and acts mean to make themselves feel good about themselves, so they get a pit, or rott, or whatever, and abuse it to the point that it is a dangerous animal that often needs to be put down.. now, they could do the same with other breeds too, just they choose pits.

Being a groomer I have never had an aggressive pit come in. On the other hand we get a lot of nasty pomeranians, schnauzers, and lhasa apsos. I too look forward to having the pits come in, they're such wonderful dogs!

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Originally Posted by Shelby

You got it Becky!

Anyways, as far as sheer numbers, more labradors bite people than pits. There is a breed temperament test, and pits rated one of the best.. above dogs like labs.. and shih tzus. I can not remember the website that lists it though.

The problem is that bad people tend to pick dogs like pits to abuse and therefore make aggressive. Why would they want a dog that doesn't have a bad reputation? They want a dog that looks and acts mean to make themselves feel good about themselves, so they get a pit, or rott, or whatever, and abuse it to the point that it is a dangerous animal that often needs to be put down.. now, they could do the same with other breeds too, just they choose pits.

Being a groomer I have never had an aggressive pit come in. On the other hand we get a lot of nasty pomeranians, schnauzers, and lhasa apsos. I too look forward to having the pits come in, they're such wonderful dogs!

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i totally agree with what you're saying. at this point i guess that the only arguement against thenm would be that no matter how badly you raise, say a hamster,it just can't do damage to you. as opposed to pit bull (or rotts like you mentioned which also have a bad rep) which are "waiting to be abused"

Unfortunately you get situations though with pits like we have here in Toledo, Ohio. We have a huge pit problem due to illegal dog fighting and people (mostly young males) that think having an aggressive dog makes them somewhat more "manly" (pretty sad if you being a big man is dependent on your dog isn't it). I'm amazed pits aren't illegal in Toledo.

I was out walking our puppy with my son Mikey 3 days ago. A big male, unneutered pit on a leash (okay it was a chain...lordy but these guys have to look macho don't they) was dragging it's owner along and out of the blue went for our puppy. If the owner hadn't been strong enough either the puppy or my son would have been injured. Yesterday an 18 month old walking down the street with her parents here in Toledo was suddenly grabbed by a pit. It was behind a fence in it's own yard, but had a dig out spot apparently and came through, grabbing this poor baby by her leg without any reason to do so.

I'm not blaming these dogs but the fact is I'm getting scared to walk our puppy and my son around. We had to go home last week because the neighbours called me over to say 4 pits were roaming loose a block over. It's pretty scarey stuff when they don't seem to have a reason to trigger, they just go for anything small and moving.

I know this is about bad owners not bad dogs but they've ruined the pit breed in Detroit and Toledo. I wouldn't buy a pit down here if you paid me, most come from fighting stock and the sad thing is the laws will likely ban them soon here. We actually considered a pit puppy before we got Gunnar and did a lot of research but we decided against it as we believe they will be banned in Toledo as well as not being sure we could find one that wasn't from fighting stock. There isn't hardly a day goes by that I don't see an aggressive pitbull incident reported on TV and I'm just so sad for these poor dogs but I'm also becoming very afraid of them.

I am a big dog lover - but fact is, I just don't trust pit bulls. I worked in high school at a veterinary clinic before people knew what pit bulls were and I was feeding the boarders, and one was a pit bull. Same dog I fed day after day - and one day, without warning, he clamped down on my hand when I was putting his food bowl in his cage.


I had to be rushed to the emergency room and was asked by the medical staff "your pet bulldog did this to you?". NO - a PIT bulldog did this to me.

The vet asked me if I wanted him to hold the dog for longer for rabies observation. I told him no - because if he did, the dog would starve to death. Turned out after the attack, I was the only person that dog would let near him and I still had to walk and feed this dog that I didn't trust until his boarding time was up.

I know it's all about the owner and how it's raised, the problem here is that a lot of people get pit bulls because they are a tough dog, and I don't want to have to figure out if a person is raising their pit correctly.

At the dog park that I go to, we've got a guy with a pit named Troy. Now Troy seems sweet enough, but his owner got his ears cropped so that they're hardly there, giving him that tough guy look, and Troy plays very roughly with the other dogs and the owner just goes "he's alright, he's alright". One day it attacked his father's dog that it was raised with. Didn't make me feel any easier when Troy was around. Thankfully, he shows no interest in Diamond - she'd definitely come out on the losing end.

I had quite a few experiences working with pits at the vet clinic I previously worked at. And the nastiest dogs to come in were Shelties followed by Beagles and Labs. We had lots of sweet pits come through there, one that stands out is;
We had a pit come in that had been hit by a car, her pelvis had been practically shattered, her owner wanted anything done that could be done to put her right. Out of the 8 person staff I was the only one that would go near her. I had to go in on my days off to change her bedding or it wouldn't get done. To change the bedding you had to lift her out of the cage (not easy with an 60lb dog on the bottom level) remove the dirty blanket, sanitize the cage, add new blanket, put dog back in. A few times I did bump her hips and pelvis as I moved her and other then a few wimpers she just licked my arms and that was that, such a vicious dog...oh yes.

I currently have a boxer/pit mix. She's a doll. She is cautious of new people but doesn't go to ravage them.
I obedience train dogs in my area and I'm one of two people that will accept pits for training.

Something to consider on the news is that ANY bully looking breed is automatically a pitbull to them. It gets the headlines. Pitbull has been so twisted into a nightmare creature that it sells.
After training my share of dogs I always say that there is a reason for their actions 99.9% of the time. They aren't made to just snap.

One thing that is enjoyable to see is if any of you watch 'The Dog Whisperer', Ceasar has some super nice pits in his group, free with other dogs, very nice dogs and great show. I recommend it.

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I currently have a boxer/pit mix. She's a doll.

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We DID have a boxer/pit mix that came in as a HBC that was the sweetest dog I've ever met. Loved her! She stayed with us for quite some time as she went through surgeries for skin grafts.

While labs may have a higher bite stat then pits, I don't see too many savage maulings or deaths from labs or smaller breeds mentioned by a vet I think was in this thread!

Unfortunately, gangs, meth labs and pea brained morons like keeping pits. These people are also usually the ones that have their pits running loose in the neigborhood!

Just recently, two pits got loose and attacked school kids outside their school. Forcing kids to flee inside. The pea brained moron owner has been arrested and charged!

Not that long ago, a child was mauled to death by a "loose" pitbull here in Colorado. A woman jogger was mauled to death, even with people coming to her assistance they still killed her and injured those trying to help her. The two pits were shot. The owner charged!

I don't trust them.

Having said that, I do know some people that own one of the nicest pits around.

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Originally Posted by daaangconcepts

Just a question for everyone...

What do you use as a correction method. When the dog does something they shouldn't have (like potty on the floor, or tear up a roll of paper towels or newspaper..lol)

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I use sounds. When a dog is in the middle of a bad activity [let's say pottying on floor] I let loose with a resounding ACK!, Than I immediately take them to the proper place to go and reward them for using the proper spot. When housebreaking a puupy I take them out on lead to cut distractions. As soon as they potty I give them lots of attention and play time. Just a small amount of free time when we get back in house.[not to much free time in house at first, gives too many chances to instill bad potty habits.]They are then returned to their crate to rest. As soon as rest time is over its time to go out ON LEAD and potty again.
If they have already soiled the floor it must be cleaned really well to remove any odors. Puppies tend to revisit the scene of the crime if they smell any odor.
In the case of destructive chewing I use the same sound , remove the item they are chewing and replace it with a proper chew toy, again praising when they chew the approved toy. Puppies must chew. Denying them chew toys only tends to make them more destuctive.
This has always worked for me. Sorry for the long post.

PITS ARE BAD DOGS. But thats his opinion and I respect that.


BAD DOGS FOR BEING THE MOST LOYAL.
BAD DOGS FOR BEING THE MOST LOVABLE.
BAD DOGS FOR BEING ABLE TO HAVE A HIGH PAIN TOLERANCE WHEN YOUR KID PULLS ON THEIR EARS AND NORMALY ANY OTHER DOG WOULD BITE THE KID FOR BEING TO ROUGH.
BAD DOGS FOR BEING THE BEST BREED IN THE WORLD.

I could go on since I'm drunk but I wont, so let me just say I know people who work as vets and they can tell you they don't trust any other dog that comes in for fear of knowing that the other dogs snap much more than any of the pits do.

This is a great topic and its my first post so congrates to you who came up with this thread it is much easier to talk about Pits compared to BPs this is one thing I know. There are a lot of points that I can hit on but it would take up more of your time and only the Pit owners or people who have witnessed first hand of how good a Pit can be coming from a good home know how TRUSTING this breed is. I've been raised around Pits my whole life and it is the only DOG I WILL EVER TRUST...

PUNISH THE DEED NOT THE BREED.

Say it with me: PUNISH THE DEED NOT THE BREED......

What is being punished in Toledo are people like me and the family of that 18 month old who are getting to the point of being afraid to walk the city streets or go to public parks because of the pitbull issues in this city. These are not pit crosses or dogs that just happen to look like pits, these are pits. Most that end up in family homes here are puppies of fighting pits, they keep the biggest pup for pit fighting and sell off the other pups as pets. It's not about the breed here or in Detroit, it's about a societal problem but unfortunately this breed is going to suffer and so are those like me who don't feel safe anymore.

It's not a once in awhile thing here, it's every week. Dog Control should do more, well we had a dog control officer attacked by yet another family pet pit the other week. They have to put these pits down and it's so sad for the dog to end up like that.

It's all fine and well to say don't blame the breed. I would have said the same before I moved to Toledo. Now I'm wondering if my son and I are safe to walk our pup and considering whether mace will drive a pit back. What do you say to parents like the ones here that were walking their toddler innocently down a city sidewalk and had to drag her out of the jaws of a pit. "Don't blame the breed"....sorry folks but that is likely not going to cut it for them.

Some say make it expensive to own a pit here in Toledo. That will hardly work when very few of them have city licences anyway and a fair number have never seen a vet. Apparently we have a law in Toledo you can only own 1 pit...it's basically ignored from what I've seen and very difficult to enforce (it's not my dog, it wandered in here, it's my brother/cousin/etc dog I'm just dogsitting, so forth and so on).

I hate to see breed specific laws, they are so unfair but I don't see what else Toledo can do about this problem.

frankykeno, you bring up very valuable points. Although I am completly AGAINST Breed Specific Laws, I understand your concerns. But here are some reasons why BSL isn't the best answer:

1. Criminals habitually break laws, so having an "illegal breed" may indeed be attractive to them and might make them want to breed and sell more "illegal dogs". If their dog is confiscated and killed, they really don't care. They will just get another one because breed bans punish the dog, not the owner.

2. Law abiding responsible owners, whose dogs love people and have never done anything wrong, can see their homes invaded, often without a search warrant, and their beloved family members dragged away (in front of their children) to be killed. Not because the dogs are unstable or mean, but simply because of their breed.

3. The owners of truly dangerous dogs (of any breed) escape punishment because their breed is not targeted by legislation and therefor is believed "safe".

The better options is:

Strict laws to control aggressive dogs of any breed or mix. Known as generic vicious dog laws, they put restrictions on the ownership of dogs that pose a danger to people, restrictions such as confinement in locked, escape-proof kennels while outdoors on the owner's property; muzzles when the dog is off the property; and purchase of a liability insurance policy.

Here is a link to what we have in place in VA. It was made to strenghten the laws against the dog owners of dangerous or vicious dogs. It also describes what they mean by dangerous and vicious

http://www.understand-a-bull.com/BSL...VAStateLaw.pdf

Well I agree with you that breed specific laws will hurt some people I'm sorry but I can't agree. I read that document. The determination of vicious and dangerous can only come after the incident has occurred....after an innocent pet is dead, a child disfigured, etc. The evidence I'm sorry to say in my community is that this breed, bred in this manner, here in Toledo is a loaded gun that doesn't even need a reason to fire. Google pitbull attacks in Toledo OH and then tell me you'd feel safe in this community walking your puppy and your 5 year old.

I don't and I've never in my life been afraid of a specific breed nor supported breed specific laws. I cannot though simply play the discussion game when I know it's a reality here....week in and week out...that pitbull attacks happen. I've lived in this neighbourhood less than 2 months and had two issues already with near misses with pits. What would I have said to my child if that pit had killed his puppy in front of his eyes. The only and I mean only reason that pit didn't grab Gunnar was because the owner muscled it away, literally flipping that snarling, enraged and very big pit over and dragging it off....while it still continued to try to attack a puppy. That dog wasn't going to listen to it's owner and had that man not been a pretty big guy I'd have a dead puppy and a traumatized child.

You can say, oh that's a single incident...that does not count the loose pits in yards when I have to pull Mikey back from the sidewalk as the snarling charge at the fence happens. The pits that fling themselves at the end of their chains when all we are doing is walking down a sidewalk near their property...a public sidewalk. This is not funny people and it is not nice to be scared to walk in broad daylight with your child and your puppy on it's leash, properly licensed and taught to not be aggressive.

So no - I don't want to wait for that to happen to have that dog of that breed, bred from fighting stock, deemed vicious and dangerous. The fact is these people may well move to another breed or get a pit anyways but with stricter laws come stricter penalities and if it cuts down on just one or two attacks here in Toledo then I'm sorry to say but for the first time in my life....I'll support BSL.

One thing you need to be aware of is this. It's not the true fighting pits that are at issue. Those poor sad things are mostly kept locked away as their scars give Dog Control evidence of fighting. It's the pups from the fighting litters, sold as pets, that are causing most of the incidents in Toledo. These "pets" that are not pets are sold to people that are not criminals. I feel bad for them, for the dogs and for this community.

I understand I will not be able to change the way you feel towards them. However I truely don't think BSL is the solution. You can't blame a whole breed for the actions of some.

If the familys (that bought the puppies from dog fighting lines) could be educated by their local government on these so call "backyard breeders." They would have been able to make a better decision on which animal the chose for their family pet. I also feel sorry for the families that purchased these animals not knowing what they were getting into. Now its up to the owners. They need to be held responsible for the dog they choose. If they are responsible they could have the dog enrolled in disobedience classes. Or have its temperment tested. If the dog proves to be dangerous, they would have no choice but to CORRECT that situation. If a dog is truely dangerous/vicious it should be euthanized.

It's just like wanting to purchase a pet snake. You need to do your homework and research the animal you want to get. When we were looking for our dogs bloodline and temperment of the parents were are main concern. We actually saw the parents, we have the bloodline papers. These animals may cost more, but you truely get what you pay for!

Lovely concepts...please google pitbull attacks Toledo OH. Tigerlily just did and was sickened by what she read. I'm all for education and fairness. I'm not however all for sitting back and watching children mauled while we educate. This is about owning a dog....a privilege....children walking their own city streets safe from attack by pitbulls...a right.

You aren't going to change my mind because I had to change my own mind when I moved here. I used to be the first one to fight BSL, I considered buying a pitbull puppy before we got our current puppy, I had to change my mind because all my ideals do NOT match up with the situation in the city I live in. This is an area specific issue as much as a breed specific issue. In the city I live in (which is all I've ever commented on in this thread) pitbulls are a real and present danger that is overwhelming the resources of the Lucas County Dog Warden.

I agree children and families have the right to feel safe and secure in there own home and neighborhoods. Maybe your town is full of non-responsible pitbull owners and they only way for your city to feel safe is to introuduce BSL. If that helps the problem there, and is the only solution then so be it.

If BSL ever were to become an issue in my county I would fight it, (but my county doesn't have a problem with pitbulls) We've had a couple attacks arise here and there, but these attacks are not always by pitbulls. Just this week a 5yr was mauled outside his home by a german sheppard and lab. But we have very few occurances of attacks.

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Originally Posted by daaangconcepts

I understand I will not be able to change the way you feel towards them. However I truely don't think BSL is the solution. You can't blame a whole breed for the actions of some.

If the familys (that bought the puppies from dog fighting lines) could be educated by their local government on these so call "backyard breeders." They would have been able to make a better decision on which animal the chose for their family pet. I also feel sorry for the families that purchased these animals not knowing what they were getting into. Now its up to the owners. They need to be held responsible for the dog they choose. If they are responsible they could have the dog enrolled in disobedience classes. Or have its temperment tested. If the dog proves to be dangerous, they would have no choice but to CORRECT that situation. If a dog is truely dangerous/vicious it should be euthanized.

It's just like wanting to purchase a pet snake. You need to do your homework and research the animal you want to get. When we were looking for our dogs bloodline and temperment of the parents were are main concern. We actually saw the parents, we have the bloodline papers. These animals may cost more, but you truely get what you pay for!

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This is exactly right. The key is education for the owners. The pups may be bred from fighting stock, but that doesn't mean that the pups will have the same fighting mentality as their parents. That mentality is something that has to be taught.

When I had my pit I took her to dog parks several times a week so that she could socialize with other dogs and people for the sole purpose of teaching her how to interact with other dogs and people.

The problem with pits is the same reason they are used in pit fighting: when they do attack they are vicious and relentless. It is an unfortunate trait that this breed has naturally, and the only way to overcome this is through proper training.

I wonder how many of those pit owners in Toledo have taken their dog to obedience training. I think it would be safe to say that none of them have. You may have a pit problem in your neighborhood, but it is not an issue of too many pits in the neighborhood, it is too many owners not training their dogs properly.

As for BSL's, I think that would be as effective as prohibition in the 20's.

I agree that responsible owners would make this issue mute, but apparently these owners just aren't. It also sounds like there is a large population of animals that have NOT been socialized properly. Socialization is important for any breed, but in the case of some it can have disastrous results. What type of solution is viable for adult animals that have no social skills? Those types of things usually need to be ingrained early on, and there seems to be a large number of animals involved. I've never heard of pits being such a problem in any of the areas I've lived in, and I personally love the breed. I would not be willing though, to live in such circumstances. My children deserve better than that.