Being a worried snakemom - is he dehydrated?

I picked up my BP today and the breeder said "he's a little thirsty". He was pretty listless when I first held him. I got him home and he drank some and has since perked up a lot, and is exploring his cage little by little. the only worry I have is that his skin looks loose. I forgot to ask when his last shed was in my excitement but I emailed him. Is this just him growing into his new clothes, or do I really need to watch him? I've got a sweater box, two hides. 80 on the cool side, 90 on the warm side and this boy's about four months old. My humidity is at 60%.

http://mousch.zoto.com/img/45/d9b296...ef9a92d5f6.jpg
See the wrinkle along his sides?

http://mousch.zoto.com/img/45/6cf90d...183b44202e.jpg
Closeup of one bend

http://mousch.zoto.com/img/45/674a58...b05af08bfa.jpg
This is closer to his tail

http://mousch.zoto.com/img/45/d2e1ae...aaddf06158.jpg
side glamour shot!

So do I need a rush vet visit? I don't think I do but I would rather bank on all of your experience!

I realise my cage looks empty in those shots. He has a water dish, warm hide, cool hide and a silk vine so that he doesn't feel too exposed.

This is just my best educated guess (I could be wrong)\


I am inexperienced with hatchlings, but he looks really underfed. Possibly dehydrated too. Have you fed him yet?

One big concern i have is,has the snake ever eaten anything? It looks really skinny.Did you get it from a breeder who produced it himself or herself? The reason i ask this is i myself would never allow a snake to leave that is that thin or state its kinda thirsty.Stating something like that makes me wonder if the snake had water or not in its enclosure before you arrived.In my opinion the snake does look kinda dehydrated.

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Originally Posted by Chanarita

This is just my best educated guess (I could be wrong)\


I am inexperienced with hatchlings, but he looks really underfed. Possibly dehydrated too. Have you fed him yet?

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Sorry, forgot to include the following: I picked him up today. He hatched about 4 months ago. So he won't get fed until next week, unless he looks like he's starving? He doesn't go limp when I moved him - he grips whatever he is near.
He was on live hoppers. The breeder is the one who produced him.

He is also going to be left alone for a good while now, to acclimate to his new surroundings and keep the stress down. Could I feed him earlier? Or will he be okay until next Saturday? Should I go for tuesday or something?

Wow if I saw this snake at a store somewhere I would bet money on it that it was farm hatched and not captive bred. I have 4 farm hatched baby balls and none of them look as bad as that, not even the one I have had to resort to force feeding. I find it hard to believe that it has been fed more than once or twice or even at all. This late in the season he should have a way better start than that.

And sorry if that is bad news, but it is my honest opinion. I would make sure he has plenty of water available for drinking and soaking, maybe raise his humidity a bit, perhaps offer him a live crawler (my balls all regurgitated their hoppers) just to see if he will eat this soon after moving to a new home, but if he doesn't, I would totally leave him alone for a few days, don't take him out at all, then offer a crawler again.

:( Oh no, I didn't think he looked that bad! I will try and give him a crawler or hopper on Sunday or Tuesday then

Do you know what he weighs? He looks just like the little one I'm having to tube feed right now, which weighs 48g.

I honestly couldn't tell you what he weighs
Oh gosh now I'm so scared for this little guy, I thought he looked a little skinny but not omg emergency tubefeeding skinny :(
I don't have a scale or anything like that. The picture of the skin near his tail, he's sitting right where my two thighs meet. So that skin looks looser than he actually does.

:( poor little guy I will do whatever I can to pull him through
The breeder told me he had taken all of his meals. Is he just on mice that are too small? What should I do?

I took this just now to give you a visual on the health of my captive hatched balls, who are all probably around the same age as yours. The last one on the right is the one that I have had to force feed a few times already, and has only eaten on its own once. The other three all eat crawlers every week.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...pig/babies.jpg

I'd calm down and then do what all the good people here are suggesting to do. Give him/her a few/couple days to acclimate and then try feeding. Leave alone for another week and then feed again. What size enclosure is he/she in? What are the temps and humidity? What else can you give us to further help you, any info at all would help.

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Originally Posted by mousch

I honestly couldn't tell you what he weighs
Oh gosh now I'm so scared for this little guy, I thought he looked a little skinny but not omg emergency tubefeeding skinny :(
I don't have a scale or anything like that. The picture of the skin near his tail, he's sitting right where my two thighs meet. So that skin looks looser than he actually does.

:( poor little guy I will do whatever I can to pull him through
The breeder told me he had taken all of his meals. Is he just on mice that are too small? What should I do?

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Do me a favor and pm me the name of the breeder.I dont want to start trouble or anything,i just want to see if it a reputable person who breeds his own or a importer.

I've very upset with this breeder who in good conscience sold you this animal. He does look very thin to me, since I've not dealt with dehydration, I can't speak to if he is.


I'd like to see what the more experienced keepers say, but what "I" would do, is get it settled into a nice small tub enclosure (like a 15 quart) and leave him alone for a full week, and then offer a live hopper mouse and see if he'll eat.

If he starts eating well for you, and there are no other problems - then I would think he would start to bounce back.

If he doesn't eat - I would think a vet visit is in order to asess his overall health and make sure he doesn't have internal parasites.

http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e9.../Batsignal.jpg

If I were you, I would just take him to a vet. There's no reason to panic, but I would think that if he has been eating regularly, there must be something else causing him to lose weight.
Since you just got him, you probably don't have a fecal sample for the vet to test. I would just talk to the vet and tell him/her you'd like to bring in a fecal sample when you get one. That way you shouldn't have to pay for another office visit (but you will have to pay for the tests).

Bear in mind, I'm no expert. I only have 2 baby ball pythons. One is very thin like yours, hasn't eaten in the 2 months I've had him. The other is a fat, healthy girl that has eaten every week with no problems. But I have had a lot of dealings with vets, and most of them are very willing to work with you on getting your pet healthy with as little cost as possible.

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Originally Posted by jim020cricket

I'd calm down and then do what all the good people here are suggesting to do. Give him/her a few/couple days to acclimate and then try feeding. Leave alone for another week and then feed again. What size enclosure is he/she in? What are the temps and humidity? What else can you give us to further help you, any info at all would help.

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I put this in the beginning of my post, but it's 90 on the warm side, 80 on the cool, a humidity of 65%. He's in a sweaterbox size rubbermaid with a warm and cool hide and a water dish big enough to soak in with newspaper substrate.

Okay. I did a little water displacement test and even thought I don't know the density of an underfed ball python, he displaced 50ml of water which makes him around 50g. Sounds too skinny. I will leave him alone (which is hard now that I'm so worried!). Should I try to feed Sunday or Tuesday?

Ok i was pmed the supposed breeders name and i visited his site.He states that the majority of his snakes are produced by him,but he does sell wild caughts and captive hatched.He also says he will tell you when you buy from him whether or not he produced it or imported it.I nearly hit the floor when i looked at his prices:eek: .He gets between $85 to $125 for ball pythons,or $100 for snow corns.That is ridicules for a normal very skinny snake.I recomended to take the snake back and get her/his money and go elsewhere.

I'm no snake expert but that snake doesn't look good at all! It is VERY skinny. I know if I were you, I'd take it and ask for my money back.

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Originally Posted by lillyorchid

I'm no snake expert but that snake doesn't look good at all! It is VERY skinny. I know if I were you, I'd take it and ask for my money back.

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See, now I'm really scared about this. I know if I take it back and accuse him of selling me an underfed snake, I will be shut out of the local reptile community. Plus he works at the only place in town to buy feeders. I want to keep him alive and safe, and I don't think taking him back will do much good for either of us.

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Originally Posted by mousch

See, now I'm really scared about this. I know if I take it back and accuse him of selling me an underfed snake, I will be shut out of the local reptile community. Plus he works at the only place in town to buy feeders. I want to keep him alive and safe, and I don't think taking him back will do much good for either of us.

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Folks mousch is from Canada.Like he/she says the person is well known and could cause her/him problems.I thought we had jerks passing off sick snakes this guy takes the cake :mad: .

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Originally Posted by joepythons

Folks mousch is from Canada.Like he/she says the person is well known and could cause her/him problems.I thought we had jerks passing off sick snakes this guy takes the cake :mad: .

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Yeah, I found another thread on a different forum. Turns out he's had illegal reptiles before and been found guilty. But the thread is full of people defending him. He's also up there in the community. ARGH!

I will leave him be. This will be really hard, I'm going to spend every waking moment thinking about this guy. I will channel my worry into reading about bringing a hatchling back up to strength. Come on Our Intrepid Hero, you can do it little buddy!

Oh and joe... his prices are pretty normal for Canada. Don't move up here or you'll have some kind of heart attack! His prices were on par with everyone else at the recent reptile show.

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Originally Posted by mousch

Yeah, I found another thread on a different forum. Turns out he's had illegal reptiles before and been found guilty. But the thread is full of people defending him. He's also up there in the community. ARGH!

I will leave him be. This will be really hard, I'm going to spend every waking moment thinking about this guy. I will channel my worry into reading about bringing a hatchling back up to strength. Come on Our Intrepid Hero, you can do it little buddy!

Oh and joe... his prices are pretty normal for Canada. Don't move up here or you'll have some kind of heart attack! His prices were on par with everyone else at the recent reptile show.

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Well like i said in a pm to you,your heart is in the right place:gj: .Myself and the members here have numerous tricks to help you get this little one to eat.With a lot of patiance and luck hopefully we can get it healthy.On a side note those people are smoking something :eek: ,i relize Canadas money is worth less then US money but geeeee.

Nah, the dollars are close enough now that it's a HUGE price difference between Canada and the US. Now it's just that there aren't too many Canadian breeders, this is also changing... but the prices aren't. Oh well. It's bad for people who want to build collections, but keeps down the "I saw this snake in the pet store he is sooo cuuute! What is he and does he eat vegetables?" people.

Besides not even savings on the cost of BPs will get me to move to the USA. I am Canadian!

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Originally Posted by joepythons

Myself and the members here have numerous tricks to help you get this little one to eat.With a lot of patiance and luck hopefully we can get it healthy.

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You can say that again! Without help from you all, my snake would probably not have made it this far.

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Originally Posted by SarahMB

You can say that again! Without help from you all, my snake would probably not have made it this far.

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Sarah on behalf of the members here you are welcome :colbert2: .I am not sure if i helped personally since i reply to just about every post here lol.Not sure if i help out or just blab alot :P .

So I'll leave him be until Sunday and try to feed him. Should I try a hopper or a crawler?

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Originally Posted by mousch

So I'll leave him be until Sunday and try to feed him. Should I try a hopper or a crawler?

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To tell you the truth as small as it is i would try a fuzzy mouse.When they are very small if they eat to large of a meal they can regurge.This of course is just my opinion from my experiances in the past.

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Originally Posted by joepythons

To tell you the truth as small as it is i would try a fuzzy mouse.When they are very small if they eat to large of a meal they can regurge.This of course is just my opinion from my experiances in the past.

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oh well why would I listen to your opinion eh? :rolleyes: (I'm just kidding save Hero, Joe!)
I'll do the fuzzy. Should I try just one, or should I go for two?

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Originally Posted by mousch

oh well why would I listen to your opinion eh? :rolleyes: (I'm just kidding save Hero, Joe!)
I'll do the fuzzy. Should I try just one, or should I go for two?

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O your very funny NOTTTTTTTTT :P .Being that this might be its first meal i would try one to see how it does.You can always move up the size of the rodent as needed.

Awesome. Without you guys I probably would never have realised he was malnourished, not just dehydrated. Thanks a lot! I will update on Sunday.

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Originally Posted by joepythons

Sarah on behalf of the members here you are welcome :colbert2: .I am not sure if i helped personally since i reply to just about every post here lol.Not sure if i help out or just blab alot :P .

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I think you are a great help, and a decent guy to boot!

mouche: Please do keep us updated, hopefully we can watch our scrawny babies get better together :sweeet:

gogo scrawny babies!!

I went to BC last winter and almost had a cow over their reptile prices. Red-eared sliders for $80!

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Originally Posted by SarahMB

I think you are a great help, and a decent guy to boot!

mouche: Please do keep us updated, hopefully we can watch our scrawny babies get better together :sweeet:

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Why thank you.Just decent huh :( .I know just joking lol.

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Originally Posted by SarahMB

I think you are a great help, and a decent guy to boot!

mouche: Please do keep us updated, hopefully we can watch our scrawny babies get better together :sweeet:

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Shhhh, don't say he's only decent around our scrawnsters!! Joe is a great guy and amazing with snakes and there's no one else I would rather trust! :P

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Originally Posted by Rapture

I went to BC last winter and almost had a cow over their reptile prices. Red-eared sliders for $80!

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Did they have solid gold shells?

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Originally Posted by mousch

Shhhh, don't say he's only decent around our scrawnsters!! Joe is a great guy and amazing with snakes and there's no one else I would rather trust! :P

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I agree Joe is great :sweeet: .Everyone should be like Joe even Jamie lol.Joe is god of snakes long live Joe :bow: .Yes i am losing it people lol. w

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Originally Posted by joepythons

Did they have solid gold shells?

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Haha, no... and they were half dollar size. All of the reptiles there were expensive, and not just to the equivalent of the exchange rate.

LOL, ya'll, 'decent' in Texas is one of the highest compliments one can pay! It's the same as saying 'he's good people'.
Now if I wanted to be insulting, I would say "Bless his heart". haha

You texans! Out where I am now apparently it's good to just call people whatever you feel like to their faces, even if you've never met them before.

Maybe Texas isn't so bad after all!

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Originally Posted by SarahMB

LOL, ya'll, 'decent' in Texas is one of the highest compliments one can pay! It's the same as saying 'he's good people'.
Now if I wanted to be insulting, I would say "Bless his heart". haha

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Well i reckons i will allow yall to get along little doggie :partyon: .Sorry i could not help it :P

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Originally Posted by joepythons

Well i reckons i will allow yall to get along little doggie :partyon: .Sorry i could not help it :P

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I think yer moseyin' for a beatin'!

Haha, well Texans will tell it to you like it is, but we'll do it with a smile and make you think we're sweet as pie for doing it.

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Originally Posted by mousch

I think yer moseyin' for a beatin'!

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LMAO.See now where else on the internet can you openly joke with others? If this thread was on a few other sites(not naming them) we would be either banned or openly jumped on.Long live ball-pythons.net :salute:

This place is definitely homey. Which is good because Hero's gonna need some help. I went back and got the tighter hides that I had when I had misjudged the size, and he fits PERFECTLY inside them. This should reduce his stress, his other hides were too big for him. He's all cozy now. I was surprised he fit but he did! Very cool :)