Spider personality??

So I was doing my daily combing of all the breeder sites I like to check out and came across this description about Spiders on Mark Mandic's site:

"In addition, Spiders come with a personality that is unrivaled in ball python morphs. They are eager to be held and don't display the fussiness towards food that typical ball pythons sometimes do. It shouldn't come as much of a surprise when they are ready and waiting when the dinner bell rings."


From those of you who have the pleasure of working with Spiders (and I can't wait to!!), is this true?

Jamie

By the way, Mark has a fabulous site and he is a super guy. www.ballpython.ca

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Originally Posted by jglass38

From those of you who have the pleasure of working with Spiders (and I can't wait to!!), is this true?

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Yup.

-adam

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Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

Yup.

-adam

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You must be tired from all your typing in the other thread. :P

Can you elaborate?

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Originally Posted by jglass38

You must be tired from all your typing in the other thread. :P

Can you elaborate?

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Overall, they just seem more mellow and curious. It really sounds wierd if I describe it ... you really just have to see it.

I thought Kev@NERD was NUTS when he first told me about the "spider personality" ... but it's true.

Not with every single animal, but the ones that have it are super nice snakes.

-adam

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Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

Overall, they just seem more mellow and curious. It really sounds wierd if I describe it ... you really just have to see it.

I thought Kev@NERD was NUTS when he first told me about the "spider personality" ... but it's true.

Not with every single animal, but the ones that have it are super nice snakes.

-adam

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What a marketing gimmick! Spider BPs soon to replace dogs as man's best friend!

I can't wait to see one in person. I need to get out more...

I'm actually partial to my little Ophelia. She's a normal, but from what they described as a spider...is so her. She's extremely curious, loves to be touched, kissed, nuzzled into... I'm convinced that she thinks she's human and the fact that I don't eat mice is bizarre to her. O_O

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Originally Posted by Melicious

loves to be touched, kissed, nuzzled into

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How do you know?

-adam

I don't really know persay because my mind and her mind aren't somehow linked, however, the time I spend with her makes it seem that way. She specifically goes out of her way to nuzzle into me.

I honestly think that snakes can show some form of affection.

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Originally Posted by Melicious

She specifically goes out of her way to nuzzle into me.

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Maybe it's because she’s ectothermic and your body temperature is warmer than the air temp?

-adam

Aren't we captain obvious? Of course she's ectothermic, however, I think there's more to it. Why wouldn't there? Just because she's animal doesn't mean she can't show some form of emotion and just because she's a snake, an ectothermic reptile, doesn't mean she's cold-hearted...

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Originally Posted by Melicious

Aren't we captain obvious? Of course she's ectothermic, however, I think there's more to it. Why wouldn't there? Just because she's animal doesn't mean she can't show some form of emotion and just because she's a snake, an ectothermic reptile, doesn't mean she's cold-hearted...

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I think you are anthropomorphizing, just a bit. I really don't believe that snakes have a emotional attachment to us. They tolerate some us better than others yes, but really don't care. That's a higher brain function which they lack. These are very simple creatures. Don't get me wrong, I love them and love to think that they like me too but I just don't think it's logical. ;)

(and just a warning... there's no need for name calling. That's soooo not productive, and just going to lead to this thread getting locked. :colbert: )

I would have to agree with Christie there. We all like to think the fish is happy to see us or the snake wants to spend time with us watching Magnum P.I., but its just not true. By the way, I am Captain Obvious, not Adam. I'm the one out here on the streets fighting crimes while he sits in a warm house reaping the benefits.

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Originally Posted by jglass38

I am Captain Obvious

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You are my hero Jamie. :love: ;)

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Originally Posted by tigerlily

You are my hero Jamie. :love: ;)

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That just makes my job worth it!

I apologize.

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Originally Posted by jglass38

I would have to agree with Christie there. We all like to think the fish is happy to see us or the snake wants to spend time with us watching Magnum P.I., but its just not true. By the way, I am Captain Obvious, not Adam. I'm the one out here on the streets fighting crimes while he sits in a warm house reaping the benefits.

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warm BASEMENT...get it right!

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Originally Posted by jglass38

That just makes my job worth it!

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:wuv: You rock!

Just doing my part to keep things running. Thanks ma'am! :)

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Originally Posted by Melicious

I apologize.

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:gj:

I'm not trying to attack you, I promise! ;) I know how easy it is to give our snakes bits of our own thinking. I use the same terminology sometimes too. It makes ME feel better, so I do it. :D (as long as I eventually remember I'm being a big doofus, then it's all good. :giggle: )

Heres my thinking on snakes and emotions. The reason humans have emotions is because we are social creatures. We have to interact and relate to other members of our species in order to survive. thats what got us out of the trees and into caves. Most, if not all, social animals exibit some sort of emotions. This is pretty evident with dogs and cats. Snakes, however, are solitary creatures. Except for the whole breeding thing, snakes would just as much rather not see another one of its species its entire life. It doesn't need another snake to help it hunt, to provide security, it can do it just fine on its own. Because it has no natural need for any social skills, it has no need for emotions either.

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Originally Posted by tigerlily

:gj:

I'm not trying to attack you, I promise! ;) I know how easy it is to give our snakes bits of our own thinking. I use the same terminology sometimes too. It makes ME feel better, so I do it. :D (as long as I eventually remember I'm being a big doofus, then it's all good. :giggle: )

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No, no, no. I don't think you're attacking me. O_O I just think I could have handled it better. He did come a bit...know-it-allish and I could have responded much better than I did. Bad, bad Melanie. O_o

Just to throw out a bizarre theory...I haven't done any research on this, but did you ever think that even though they are naturally solitary creatures, they might actually have intellectually evolved due to their continuous intro into human lives? Our being so social might be what makes them somewhat social?

I know. I'm a nutjob.

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Originally Posted by Melicious

No, no, no. I don't think you're attacking me. O_O I just think I could have handled it better. He did come a bit...know-it-allish and I could have responded much better than I did. Bad, bad Melanie. O_o

Just to throw out a bizarre theory...I haven't done any research on this, but did you ever think that even though they are naturally solitary creatures, they might actually have intellectually evolved due to their continuous intro into human lives? Our being so social might be what makes them somewhat social?

I know. I'm a nutjob.

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No worries! We all get along fine. By the way, nutjob is a prerequisite to even post here :D

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Originally Posted by Melicious

No, no, no. I don't think you're attacking me. O_O I just think I could have handled it better. He did come a bit...know-it-allish and I could have responded much better than I did. Bad, bad Melanie. O_o

Just to throw out a bizarre theory...I haven't done any research on this, but did you ever think that even though they are naturally solitary creatures, they might actually have intellectually evolved due to their continuous intro into human lives? Our being so social might be what makes them somewhat social?

I know. I'm a nutjob.

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Adam is just blunt. He thinks it, and he says it. But we love him anyway. ;) :love:

As for the evolution thought. It's not likely, since evolution takes thousands of years. I think they are just curious, and tolerant of us. *shrug* But I haven't had a decent conversation with a single one of my snakes, sooo...... :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by tigerlily

Adam is just blunt. He thinks it, and he says it. But we love him anyway. ;) :love:

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It's how he rolls....;)

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Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

How do you know?

-adam

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ROFL. How did I know that was coming? :)

I'm sure snakes have emotions, but they're just very primitive emotions such as fear and defensivness, if you can define such as emotion. That tiny little brain doesn't leave much for advanced emotions and thought. Although they do have different personalities, their main goals in life are to find a place to hide, find warmth, eat, and breed. Oh, and a few of them have long term goals such as seeing how frustrated I get when they soil a fresh cage or won't eat. :zerb:

Now if one of you could please explain to me why our yearling female BP, Rionach, has suddenly taken a bizarre interest in ears, belly buttons and noses I'd be just thrilled! LOL We seriously do not hide rodents in there! We all shower regularily! What is up with this crazy snake? We handle her and she attempts valiantly to stuff her snout in there...nothing more ticklish than a snake's flicking tongue....ack! We pull her away, she goes right back to it. Do our earholes resemble termite mound entrances? Has our snake lost her ever lovin mind (however small and unevolved that might be)?

She may not do higher math but dang she's a determined little devil! :giggle:

I like blunt people. I actually like everyone here who's greeted me and everyone who hasn't. -Hums.-

And OMFG@ the ears! I squirm all over the place when Ophelia goes after my ears. I think she does it on purpose sometimes.

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Originally Posted by xdeus

I'm sure snakes have emotions, but they're just very primitive emotions such as fear and defensivness, if you can define such as emotion. That tiny little brain doesn't leave much for advanced emotions and thought. Although they do have different personalities, their main goals in life are to find a place to hide, find warmth, eat, and breed. Oh, and a few of them have long term goals such as seeing how frustrated I get when they soil a fresh cage or won't eat.

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Very well put. these primitive emotions such as fear, hunger, being cold, or being warm are more state of minds than acutal emotions. Snakes, I would think, aren't really as much happy as they are content. {full, warm, not in shed etc} If a snake is hungry and striking at you for example, they are saying, I'm hungry, give food! not, I'm very mad at you for not providing me with a mouse sooner.

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Originally Posted by Melicious

Just to throw out a bizarre theory...I haven't done any research on this, but did you ever think that even though they are naturally solitary creatures, they might actually have intellectually evolved due to their continuous intro into human lives? Our being so social might be what makes them somewhat social?

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Thanks for the rebuttle, I'd much rather people differ from my opinion than agree with me, I don't learn that way. But I would think that it's extremly unlikely that snakes {I'm going to stick with BP's for my thoughts here} as a species have intellectually evolved due to their interactions with human lives. Yes, there is evidence that BPs have been kept in captivity all the way to early Egyptian culture, but I would doubt there is a single line of captive bred BPs that dates back that far. Hundreds of Thousands of BPs are taken out of Africa each year to be sold in the pet trade. There probably isn't a single BP line in captivity that has been captive bred for more than a couple hundred years {Adam, chime in, i know you've got more info on this}. It would take a couple thousand years of captivity to show any signs of evolution due to human interference. Lets take cats and dogs as examples. I saw a show recently on Discovery channel that was talking about the domestication of cats and dogs and how it started. Basicly, the early cats and dogs {they were wolves and big cats at the time} wandered into human camps from the smell of food. Some animals took advantage of this and stuck around, not attacking the humans. These cats and dogs walked willingly into captivity thousands and thousands of years ago simply because it benefited them. Through the years selective breeding has come up with the various types of cats and dogs we have now. Geneticly speaking, todays cats and dogs are virtually identical to their wild brethren. However inprobable, a chiwawa and a grey wolf could reproduce to have non-sterle pups. But back to the issue at hand. BP's or any other "domesticated" snake for that matter, simply havn't had the time to evolve from human contact. And probably never will. there was no mutual agreement when snakes were taken from the wild by humans. and there will probably never be a line of captive bred snakes that goes on continually breeding in captivity for thousands of years. However, {I know this is long, but I'm almost done} thats not to say that individual snakes don't adapt to humans. notice how I said adapt and not evolve. Individual snakes certianly do have different personalities, and it could be safe to assume that some individual snakes realize the benifits humans provide a dont mind us that much. ok, I'm done.

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Originally Posted by Boarder4l154

Very well put. these primitive emotions such as fear, hunger, being cold, or being warm are more state of minds than acutal emotions. Snakes, I would think, aren't really as much happy as they are content. {full, warm, not in shed etc} If a snake is hungry and striking at you for example, they are saying, I'm hungry, give food! not, I'm very mad at you for not providing me with a mouse sooner.



Thanks for the rebuttle, I'd much rather people differ from my opinion than agree with me, I don't learn that way. But I would think that it's extremly unlikely that snakes {I'm going to stick with BP's for my thoughts here} as a species have intellectually evolved due to their interactions with human lives. Yes, there is evidence that BPs have been kept in captivity all the way to early Egyptian culture, but I would doubt there is a single line of captive bred BPs that dates back that far. Hundreds of Thousands of BPs are taken out of Africa each year to be sold in the pet trade. There probably isn't a single BP line in captivity that has been captive bred for more than a couple hundred years {Adam, chime in, i know you've got more info on this}. It would take a couple thousand years of captivity to show any signs of evolution due to human interference. Lets take cats and dogs as examples. I saw a show recently on Discovery channel that was talking about the domestication of cats and dogs and how it started. Basicly, the early cats and dogs {they were wolves and big cats at the time} wandered into human camps from the smell of food. Some animals took advantage of this and stuck around, not attacking the humans. These cats and dogs walked willingly into captivity thousands and thousands of years ago simply because it benefited them. Through the years selective breeding has come up with the various types of cats and dogs we have now. Geneticly speaking, todays cats and dogs are virtually identical to their wild brethren. However inprobable, a chiwawa and a grey wolf could reproduce to have non-sterle pups. But back to the issue at hand. BP's or any other "domesticated" snake for that matter, simply havn't had the time to evolve from human contact. And probably never will. there was no mutual agreement when snakes were taken from the wild by humans. and there will probably never be a line of captive bred snakes that goes on continually breeding in captivity for thousands of years. However, {I know this is long, but I'm almost done} thats not to say that individual snakes don't adapt to humans. notice how I said adapt and not evolve. Individual snakes certianly do have different personalities, and it could be safe to assume that some individual snakes realize the benifits humans provide a dont mind us that much. ok, I'm done.

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That...makes much more sense. I just figured I'd throw some randomly floating hair-brained idea out. I like the idea of them adapting to us and us to them.

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Originally Posted by Melicious

Why wouldn't there?

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Because no matter how many times it's been investigated and studied by scientific organizations and universities around the world, there as never been any direct evidence to indicate that lower order life forms are doing anything more than reacting to stimuli within their environment.

I don't have an opinion one way or another, I was just posing the question. Didn't realize I would ruffle your feathers. I'll know better for next time. ;)

-adam

Sounds good to me. I'll just continue to remind myself that I'm a nutjob.

All I gots to say is.....

sitting on the couch with Khan roaming around my hands and lap, sitting in his room watching him make his way all around his house relaxes the crap out of me and still amazes me how great and interesting snakes are. He relaxs me, I make sure he has food, shelter, and a toasty tank. Its a system we have and as long as he thrives and I still wake up excited:pinkele: to care for him thats all that matters. If he loves me, wants to cuddle with me...I dont care, cause you know why?
He'll never be able to come slither over to me and say...
"hey Erica, your pretty awesome and I like you"
If he could I would soil my pants, but he wont so Im alright with the relationship we have now.

PS....
You guys posted some very interesting points on animals and snakes...you guys and gals are a very informative bunch and I respect that as well as enjoy your posts! :D

oh pps...
:banana: peanut butter jelly time!!!!!!

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Originally Posted by tigerlily

But we love him anyway. ;) :love:

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OH YEAH? HOW MUCH? :hump:

-adam

Wouldn't you like to know.... :devilish: :blowkiss:

Just keep that camera handy for my next visit. ;) :wuv:

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Originally Posted by tigerlily

Wouldn't you like to know.... :devilish: :blowkiss:

Just keep that camera handy for my next visit. ;) :wuv:

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I'm going to hire a video crew.

-adam

:8: LMAO!!!

:rockon:

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Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

OH YEAH? HOW MUCH? :hump:

-adam

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is that a humping/licking smiley face? now i have seen it all!

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Originally Posted by 4Khan

now i have seen it all!

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Not true ... there is MUCH more to see here. ;)

-adam

You're all a bunch of sick, sick snake people!

I love you. ^_^

if you were yogurt would you be
fruit on the bottom
or stirred?

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Originally Posted by 4Khan

if you were yogurt would you be
fruit on the bottom
or stirred?

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I'd be sour. :rockon:

-adam

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Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

I'd be sour. :rockon:

-adam

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you sassy man you...
I say you should be a kiwi blend of yogurt..slightly sour but sweet aswell.

if you didnt know I quoted Bio Dome on that pick up line!:P

Nah, he'd be a new line of alcoholic yogurt. ;) :carouse:

corona yogurt with lime peel sprinkles:w00t:



vaughn

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Originally Posted by kavmon

corona yogurt with lime peel sprinkles:w00t:

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Oh, that's just NASTY! :puke:

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Originally Posted by kavmon

corona yogurt with lime peel sprinkles:w00t:

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Winner winner chicken dinner! :carrot:

-adam

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Originally Posted by xdeus

Oh, that's just NASTY! :puke:

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yeah i think so too! but that's adam:zerb: :picknose: :ohmygod: :fart: :pee: :twisted:


vaughn

That's Wysocki, if you're nasty....

I think Yogurtmeister would suit Adam. :carouse:

The ways these threads go...I think there's still some happy endings going on in Adam's juvi room, lol.....